Shameful: Drug cheat Liza Hunter-Galvan wins $10,000 at 2015 Boston Marathon

If I was a doper I would argue that retroactively changing the punishment after the crime is an unconstitutional ex post facto law. But I'm not a doper so I'd be fine taking away the second chance of everybody who is.

Angryjohnny wrote:

If I was a doper I would argue that retroactively changing the punishment after the crime is an unconstitutional ex post facto law. But I'm not a doper so I'd be fine taking away the second chance of everybody who is.

The punishment is "you can't race for 2 years" ... I disagree w the severity of that punishment but that is what it is. That's a moot point.

What comes next is key.

I have never gotten an invited bib to Boston. Neither have thousands of others... This invited entry is not a right to be restored after punishment... It is a reward.... It is not a given. I'm sure plenty of people would like to have one.... But it is not a right.

If you are a convicted doper you lose your place in line to far far behind all the talented clean runners who would like an invited masters athlete bib.

Punishment vs rewards wrote:

If you are a convicted doper you lose your place in line to far far behind all the talented clean runners who would like an invited masters athlete bib.

That would not be fair, and is fortunately not a part of the law.

Angryjohnny wrote:

If I was a doper I would argue that retroactively changing the punishment after the crime is an unconstitutional ex post facto law. But I'm not a doper so I'd be fine taking away the second chance of everybody who is.

Races and their sponsors have rights too, to dictate who they want to pay and reward, without having their reputation tarnished.

Let people be wrote:

Punishment vs rewards wrote:

If you are a convicted doper you lose your place in line to far far behind all the talented clean runners who would like an invited masters athlete bib.

That would not be fair, and is fortunately not a part of the law.

World Marathon Majors Statement on Elite Athletes Having Tested Positive for Performance Enhancing Drugs

2006-06-16

The World Marathon Majors – Boston, Flora London, real,- Berlin, LaSalle Bank Chicago, and the ING New York City – have adopted a policy whereby any elite athlete who has been convicted of a drug violation will have lost the opportunity to run in the individual World Marathon Majors events.

This is not a retroactive rule. This policy was in place before Ms Liza got caught using EPO. Look at the date "2006-06-16."

To translate, this policy was enacted for World Marathon Majors and applies to elite runners on June 16, 2006. Liza should get nothing other than an asterisk next to her name for the rest of her marathon career. Once a drug cheat...always a drug cheat.

Bye Bye wrote:

J.R. wrote:

The Brojos and their misguided minions are always short of facts, but full of hypocrisy, so you make up your own facts, name call in the titles of threads, and on the front page. The Brojos, spurred on by sensationalism, acrimony and ill will, never have and never will have a valid argument about doping and drugs.

Runners World and their forum awaits you, bye.

Poor old J.R., he's been courageously fighting the good fight about 'drugs don't work' on LR for years and has finally had to resort to name calling and invective, the very thing he complains about. Sorry old pal, games up, no one's listening, time to go to RW.

P.S. Loved the bit about "always short of facts", coming from you that's gold.

Also, who can forget your classic "a large bowl of organic cherries and pure water" (whatever pure water is) is more performance enhancing that any PED.

A narcissistic sociopath is someone with a combination of narcissistic personality disorder and definitive behavioral signs of sociopathy. People with narcissism are characterized by their excessive and persistent need for others' admiration and positive reinforcement. They generally have grandiose opinions of themselves and believe they are superior to other people. Narcissists are also frequently convinced that they are above the normal responsibilities and obligations of everyday life, so they usually have significant difficulties maintaining employment or relationships as a result. The narcissistic sociopath has this type of personality along with a noticeable lack of regard for the rights of others and a tendency to regularly violate those rights.One noted difference between a narcissistic sociopath and people with narcissism alone is that the narcissist with the sociopathy reacts strongly and sometimes even violently to negative feedback. True sociopaths generally do not respond to criticism or care what others may think of them. A narcissistic sociopath is unable to tolerate criticism and needs constant praise, as well as deference from other people. Many with this condition present themselves in the best light possible and are able to easily charm others to gain their trust.

Easy to figure this out wrote:

Liza Hunter-Galvan won the race and deserves the prize that she got.

A cheat would be someone who was second and tried to get the first place prize.

The organizers have been made aware of this.

Contrast her behavior with that of Christian Hesch, who at least came clean and feels he and other EPO cheats should have lifetime bans on prize money. She is the embodiment of evil in the context of drugs and cheating.

smithson valley runner... wrote:

She is such a good person that an HS athlete from Smithson Valley was so scared of her, they had a police escort to meets that she was going to be at in the fall. That is a great person that scares a 16 year old girl with her behavior. Great person?

See these are some of the things that the apologists and lapdogs from San Antonio don't know or don't want to know.

The story about nasty comments said to a girl from SVHS are true. We can talk about that story, we can talk about the improper transfer of their daughter from one school to another school in the same district only to have that blow up in their face and have the daughter ruled eligible. Liza doesn't feel that any rules apply to her

That's Gold wrote:

Bye Bye wrote:

Runners World and their forum awaits you, bye.

Poor old J.R., he's been courageously fighting the good fight about 'drugs don't work' on LR for years and has finally had to resort to name calling and invective, the very thing he complains about. Sorry old pal, games up, no one's listening, time to go to RW.

P.S. Loved the bit about "always short of facts", coming from you that's gold.

Also, who can forget your classic "a large bowl of organic cherries and pure water" (whatever pure water is) is more performance enhancing that any PED.

There was no name calling or invective in my post. You simply prove my point about making up your own facts, this thread alone being full of such nonsense.

You described yourselves well!

Props to Liza for getting her act together and to the BAA for doing the right thing.

wanna epo with those crackers?

pollyana wanna epo wrote:

wanna epo with those crackers?

Did you go to Yale?

J.R. wrote:

You still here?

noun: invectiveinsulting, abusive, or highly critical language.

J.R. wrote:

The Brojos and their misguided minions are always short of facts, but full of hypocrisy, so you make up your own facts, name call in the titles of threads, and on the front page. The Brojos, spurred on by sensationalism, acrimony and ill will, never have and never will have a valid argument about doping and drugs.

There are obviously some holes in the ex post facto argument (eg being invited is a privilege not a right, BAA is a private organization not a government) but I think the same rationale applies. Also, the 2006 statement is a little ambiguous. It doesnt clearly say that a doper is banned forever -- it could be read to say that a doper is just banned while they are serving their sentence as imposed by the group that sentenced them. I'd be interested to know what the actual policy is and if it was published when this woman got busted. If the published policy when she doped was that convicted dopers are banned for life then it is indeed shameful that she could subsequently compete and win a award. If not them I can see how the BAA might feel like their hands are tied.

Just wasted more time than it's worth digging around BAAs site and WMM... Useless with info on invited athletes... I understand they won't put out the compensation structure but you'd expect some sort of official statemt on drug use... Especially after Jeptoo