Did Mike Rossi (viral marathon dad) cheat his way into Boston?

YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!

This thread = GOAT

You are going down hard Mike!

See you on the news buddy!

me.... wrote:

i am one of those runners. my 10k PR is just under 40, my marathon PR is 2:56. my only 5k was 20mins, a few weeks after an ultra. some runners are simply better at long distances than others.

thankfully i have mountains of proof (both good proof like i was happy with my time and bad proof like what a sh!tball day that was) of all my races...

So clearly you never ran a 5k when fit. If you're 10k is 39, then by definition your 5k is 19 something. 20+ 5k peopel don't break 3:00 in the marathon.

When i startd training for the marathon, I had like a 16:34 5k pb from HS. 2.5 years later, I ran a marathon at almost that pace. 2:23:13. But along the way I ran 15:30 in practice. And my pb was from when I was injury prone in HS and running 40 mpw and when I ran 2:23 I was way over 100 mpw.

justAnumbersGuy wrote:

If you typed in 1226 and it returned photos, it's because you've tagged them as "favorites."

Thanks. I was wondering why the same moron kept showing up in every search.

The email states that Via Marathon contacted the USATF. No where does it indicate that the USATF GAF.

Kinda like how I contacted Ms. Underwood...

I wonder if they'll contact some of the legitimate finishers in that range to ask them if they remember seeing him in the middle miles. There were 60+ people in the 3:10-3:20 range. If he ran the entire course, surely someone was running with him at 5 miles, 8 miles, 10 miles, the half, 16 miles, and would remember running with him.

Unless he's claiming that he ran the entire thing completely alone.

Has anybody tried comparing the pics from Lehigh to his pics from the Philadelphia Marathon? The shoes are very similar but I can't say if they are the same or different for certain.

But I guess this doesn't really matter since nobody seems to be debating that the finisher pic of him in Lehigh is really him.

The head down running at the finish looks odd to me. If I had just run a 3:11 I would have had my head up!

A few thoughts...

1). The general public isn't going to care as much about this guy's deception as Kip Litton's--there's not going to be a story in The New Yorker this time. Why? Rossi's deception is limited in scope. It involves one core incident, and his motivation is understandable, by which I mean it at least makes sense and isn't totally bizarre. Litton, on the other hand, was extreme. His ruse was so outlandish and intricate that it rose to the level of performance art.

2). Deny, deny, deny, like a politician. That's what Rossi will do if he's smart, because the story will go away--maybe not on LRC, but basically everywhere else. The absence of evidence (that he really ran the race) is not the evidence of absence! At least that's what he can claim, and it will be convincing to some and raise reasonable doubt for others. Unless someone has a picture of him clearly exiting/entering the race at location not near a restroom facility, he has plausible deniability, at least in the minds of many with whom the arguments about pace don't really resonate/make sense. I mean, a lot of people probably have some Hollywood-style ideas about running where heart and determination can propel you to achieve incredibly improbable things.

3). Someone a while back partially quoted my other post and claimed I didn't address the issue with the principal. In fact, I did. That was near the top of my post. I think the public shaming of the principal he did was much worse than the faked marathon. I imagine she had to deal with a lot of hate mail and outraged, maybe even threatening phone calls, not to mention the humiliation within her own community, just for doing her job. His stunt affected her personal and professional life far more adversely than some hypothetical runner who barely ran a BQ time missing out because of him. I'm not saying that wasn't wrong to or that he shouldn't be penalized through official channels, but, to be blunt, I think to be outraged about that--everyone online is "outraged" about this, that, and the other thing--is melodramatic.

4). In spite of my principled stand against online shaming, I have to admit that the LRC community's sleuthing is almost nonpareil. Now, I think combing through photos in the aftermath of the Boston Marathon bombing, for example, was a more valuable use of your research skills, but that's just one guy's opinion. And, I'll be honest--I'm conflicted myself, because I have to say that I find the narrative here really interesting, but it's not hard to find examples of how these things can easily go too far.

It really is a tough course to see anyone. This course is more like an ultra. Most of it is on single or double track rail trail. I ran it 2 years ago and i can barely remember anyone other then the guy who passed me in the last mile, only because he had A BAA singlet and he was really hammering. you could jump in this course at anytime and no one would notice. There was a section I didnt see a single soal for miles, running or spectating.

There is a weakness in the current "statistical argument" against having only 1 photo. It is always possible for a photographer to take a break, check his phone, etc and miss some runners. If this happens, then it's not just 1 photo lost, but 2-3 photos lost (most runners have several photos at each site). So Rossi can reasonably claim his 1 photo is a result of bad luck at several locations. After all, in a large enough sample, outliers *do* occur.

The way to counter this argument is to show that there is continuous photography coverage of all runners at some mid-race site, except for Rossi. For example when the runners are coming through the park path, it's pretty easy to show continuity from one photo to the next because of the shooting angle. If you guys can prove there are no photography gaps yet Rossi never comes through, then it's case closed.

Remember how long it took USATF to investigate the Bumbi DQ, even with clear video evidence? There is very little chance they lift a finger for this issue. I'm not sure that I blame them. I doubt they are staffed or financed to track down every cheat at each and every marathon across the country. And if this guy isn't a USATF member, what can they do?

I agree...the finisher photos of him at Lehigh do not look natural. 'Haven't compared to another race though. Fishy.

PS I sent a few relevant links to some mainstream media...

how did he do it?

Looking at the course description and the photo evidence it is likely that he jumped in the race around the final relay exchange.

What was the original contingency plan for a point to point thon: meet friends & family at finish or bus back to the start?

He either did 1) a solo mission- parked at start, got in car and drove to location near final relay exchange or finish. or 2) had accomplice/ride to the finish. can't do #1 if friends/family plan to meet at finish to cheer on the 'dad of the year'

hoping there was a video camera at the 1/2 mark or some other evidence the race organizers can point to- video of him with race bib walking back the parking garage...

What I dont get is he was taking selfie videos etc in all his other races, family at every turn in other races. yet this race , which he lives close to, no family came out to different points to cheer him on? and take a pic or a video? Perhaps they were two busy driving him around. Perhaps we should get CSI to check all the Redlight cameras!

Anyone try to contact the runners who finished around Rossi. One is a sports reporter in Manchester, CT?

cldrunner wrote:

What I dont get is he was taking selfie videos etc in all his other races, family at every turn in other races. yet this race , which he lives close to, no family came out to different points to cheer him on? and take a pic or a video? Perhaps they were two busy driving him around. Perhaps we should get CSI to check all the Redlight cameras!

If I were going to cheat by exiting the course at mile 3 and re-entering at mile 23 I would drive myself. Why would he want witnesses?

Based on the photos taken just down the road from the start, I think it unlikely that he ran anything at the beginning. He probably had his bib under a shirt, waited until after the gun went off and just walked over the line (perhaps like he had been there to support a runner) and then just walk away.

And regarding linking the photos to create a video effect; if you look at them in camera roll mode you get this effect with no work at all. He never runs by any of the major points for photography except the finish.

Use the Portapotty! wrote:

The email states that Via Marathon contacted the USATF. No where does it indicate that the USATF GAF.

A couple years ago a serial course cutter cheated me out of third place in a marathon. (I posted about it in an other thread.) I protested it to the race director who bumped it up to the USATF. The USATF did indeed GAF. It took several months, but they determined the evidence was enough to conclude the person who stole third place from me had cheated. Unless the USATF only GAF about my case because it involved a top three finish and prize money (I never received), if they've been asked to look at this one I think they'll rule on it. It probably won't be this week or next week. As GregTF suggested, it may be weeks -- even months.

crusher wrote:

Use the Portapotty! wrote:

The email states that Via Marathon contacted the USATF. No where does it indicate that the USATF GAF.

A couple years ago a serial course cutter cheated me out of third place in a marathon. (I posted about it in an other thread.) I protested it to the race director who bumped it up to the USATF. The USATF did indeed GAF. It took several months, but they determined the evidence was enough to conclude the person who stole third place from me had cheated. Unless the USATF only GAF about my case because it involved a top three finish and prize money (I never received), if they've been asked to look at this one I think they'll rule on it. It probably won't be this week or next week. As GregTF suggested, it may be weeks -- even months.

Might they investigate faster if picked up by mainstream media (more than what is already being written), given his letter to the principal and the fact that this whole thing started by going national.

I think there will be general interest because of the media attention he sought and got as the "Boston Marathon Dad." You even state "I have to say that I find the narrative here really interesting,..."

And nobody, even non-runners, likes a cheater.

I hope the other Mike Rossi from PA is not affected. I agree that things can get out of hand...