How long was this storm Sandy in the forecast to hit the East Coast? 10 days? The backup plan should have been place then. To announce that it is a GO, and then two days before cancel it is pitiful leadership.
How long was this storm Sandy in the forecast to hit the East Coast? 10 days? The backup plan should have been place then. To announce that it is a GO, and then two days before cancel it is pitiful leadership.
rojo wrote:
Why are runners so cheap?
Because running is one of the most inexpensive sport to do! It is one of the only sports that you need NOTHING (not even shoes) to do...
Economically (not physiologically) speaking, ANYONE can become an elite marathoner!
Querfeldein wrote:
Tokyo has just been announced as another WMM event:
http://news.runnersworld.com/2012/11/02/tokyo-becomes-6th-world-marathon-major/However, Tokyo is in February, so that still doesn't solve the problem for the current season. Extending the season to February would bring up the question whether to allow runners not entered to NYC to score points, or whether to exclude runners that already ran in Berlin or Chicago. However, the fact that Tokyo is in as a paying member from 2013 makes it highly unlikely that the first WMM race in Japan will be held in Fukuoka in 2012, which could also deplete the field for Tokyo.
If New York is cancelled without replacement, it also messes up the 2012/2013 season for runners like Kipsang.
The cleanest solution now would be an Elite only race similar to the US trials, perhaps next weekend in Central Park. Maybe after the election, when people aren't trying to politicise every issue, it could actually be possible.
The hatred against running is so great that running in NYC next weekend or anytime in the next few weeks (months?) could get a lot of opposition.
NYC is out of the question.
The decision for a replacement race (and WMM points) will have to be made this weekend, because right now the elites are calling their agents and asking about (1) their appearance fee and (2) should they take a flight to Turin, Yokohama or somewhere else?
For Japanese women like Kayoko Fukushi, the choice is obvious. For Kenyan runners, Turin is on the way home and many Kenyan's have run there before. Not sure about how good the prize money is, but must be better than missing out on a fall marathon.
For many other runners, even one week is too much delay. Kim Smith delayed her honeymoon until after NYC and was planning to leave the day after the marathon. I'm not sure she would delay again, for a race that *might* be held in Central Park sometime in the next month. Amy Hastings was training with Kim in Providence, but next week she won't have that option. What should she do, stay in a hotel in NYC while people make up their mind?
I'm sure they are not the only ones that can't wait until after the election.
rojo wrote:
HOw many of the people paying $300 to sit in the upper deck of Dallas Cowboys stadium 10 times per year plus 75-200 per game for parking could name the starting conerback?
It's called entertainment value!
People pay big money for NFL (and other major sporting events) games because it is entertaining to watch! People are only paying for marathons to experience running it themselves. No one cares about the elite runners! If anyone cared about the elite runners, they would be watching the race, not running the race.
If the NYRR's (or any major marathon) made the announcement that they were no longer going to pay any money to elite runners for travel, appearance fees, prize money, etc. EVERY race would still sell out every year!
If no one cared about elite runners, there wouldn't be appearance fees and prize money. The fact that people can make six figures just for showing up should tell you that many people do, in fact, care.
Bobby1 wrote:
IMO running races don't get respect because they have turned into parades.
I agree. I think pro/elite road racing needs to break-away from the mass races and be held on smaller loop courses (similar to bike crits) easy to manage and televise/webcast.
Maybe they can be held in conjunction with the bigger mass races (later that day, the day before ro day after).
This would ensure that lots of fans are available to line the course.
Holding along with the mass races just gets everyone lumped in together in the minds of the rest of the world. "Oh you marathoners" or "them" and people don;t think about elite running as a real Professional Sport.
Seperate them and all of sudden you get more respect as a professional sport in many "average" persons thinking.
The next step in conjunction with the seperation would be to set-up some pro-tours like the PGA and European Pro tours in golf.
Some questions:
- Is it possible to run the entire NYC Marathon course on a Sunday morning, using sidewalks,etc, even when the roads are not closed? Or are some parts of the NYC Marathon course never runnable except for the NYCM? I would think there would be some people that would decide to run it unofficially themselves even though itis canceled, if they could.
- Still don't understand whythe other pro sport events aren't canceled/postponed. Yes,their venues are different, but there is a crapload of resources that go into an NBA/NFL game that could be used for needy/emergency/etc... Seems like that argument would apply to those events as well.
- So if 5 days or whatever isn't appropriate for hosting this because of the tragedy, how long would be appropriate? 2weeks? 2 months? I just wonder what the time period/circumstances are for it to become appropriate.
- Is it EVER appropriate to host a NYCM for that matter? Out of all the millions of people that live in and around the NYC area,there are always goingto be tragedies occuring in the city somewhere,always people out of their homes,without power, etc... When is there too much tragedy to host a NYCM and when is it okay?
- Would it have been acceptable to run this race ifthey turned it into a fundraiser for the relief effort? If 100% of the profits went toward relief efforts? It brings $$$$$ into the city that needs it more than ever right now, so couldn't they turn it into something that benefits the relief effort?
Well played Bloomberg. You got all the traveling runners to get into town and spend their money, then cancelled it. You catered to popular opinion by canceling the marathon which most recreation runners will understand and you got the economy boost for the city as well.
Next move. Run the elite race in Central Park in the next week or two. FYI. The Brooklyn Marathon at Prospect Park is on Nov 18.
I am running Richmond next Saturday. Fast course, 6k people field. Soon enough. Im gonna be there. Perfect!
NYC yet again proves to be the most self absorbed city in the world. The mob did win and running lost. The race should have been cancelled or moved to Central Park the morning after the storm came through. But Bloomberg and Wittenberg got caught up in their own hype. But even their hype could not stand up to CNN, USA Today, Screaming A. Smith and ESPN and effiminate idiot Mike Greenberg. The Knicks and Giants can go on but silly runners and their parade are too trivial and inappropriate at this time. Storms come through and destroy and kill every year but NYC always has to take the cake. What I don't want to hear about is the indomitable spirit of this city. It is a self involved mob.
As someone who loves this race and lives in New York, I find some of the comments on here pretty upsetting. Not only was most of the city without power and running water for the entire week but people have died, lost their homes and a good part of the infrastructure in and around the city needs to be repaired. The comparison to an NFL game is not apt at all. An NFL game is in a self contained stadium with roughly 100 participants an does not require thousands of volunteers and police who would otherwise be helping to repair the city and maintain order.
I'm bummed that the race is cancelled and agree that a sub-set of the athletes should be able to compete in a modified course (maybe the 2008 trials course). But for those of you who do not live in the area, please try to keep things in perspective and get off your high horses. The city is not self-involved for putting the health and well being of its residents above a marathon.
I agree that the storm was a tremendous natural diaster which is affecting millions of people directly and the entire country should be concerned and supportive. The marathon should have been cancelled; however, I think it should only been moved back 7-10 days.
The New York City Marathon generates WELL OVER $200,000,000 for the city of New York. While we mourned the dozens of people lives lost, the marathon could actually be used as a way to honor those lost, and bring in hundreds of million dollars to a city that really needs it at the moment.
A couple college buddies and I are doing a long tempo tomorrow in Central Park:
http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=4886584
Obviously not a real contingency for the elites but some sort of runner community commraderie could slightly mitigate the loss for sub-elites
rojo wrote:
HOw many of the people paying $300 to sit in the upper deck of Dallas Cowboys stadium 10 times per year plus 75-200 per game for parking could name the starting conerback?
Why are runners so cheap? People complain about paying about $200+ to run down the streets of New York for 5-6 hours but have no problem paying $300+ per night for 4 nights to sleep in a room which requires zero work.
The NYRR is an amazing organization.
Yet Dwayne Wade will get publicity for donating 1/82nd of his salary after complaining about having to sit in 3 hrs of traffic - when his salary is greater than the entire New York pro field.
To be clear, I have zero problem with people paying $300, $3000, or $30000 to participate in a race (or go to a Cowboys game). That is their choice, and more power to the NYRR for making that kind of money. I do not believe anyone signed up to run so they could watch the pro race. And an insignificant fraction of the people who watch the race actually pay the NYRR for the opportunity to do so, so I don't understand your comparison to the NFL/NBA.
People pay money directly (tickets/parking) and indirectly (tv) to watch Dwayne Wade and the no name players on the Cowboys. They have talents people will pay to see. If you believe the same about marathon runners, then please tell us why you don't start hosting professional marathons without us hobby runners in spectator friendly arenas and broadcasting them? Do you think this would be a profitable enterprise? You could be quite successful.
Maybe the race was supposed to be on tv. If there was such a demand to watch the race, then NYRR and the television station failed miserably in not setting up a course anywhere else in the world and getting the pros there to race in front of the cameras.
Those supplies would not be in the city without the marathon they were not taken from relief efforts. And the economic way to transport the food is not why the food doesn't go there its because the food wouldn't exist if there wasn't american demand. Those generators were probably purposely ordered months ago and if there was no marathon they would not be in the city. My point is there has been no evidence presented to me that the marathon would not be a net benefit to the city and victims, even assuming all the supplies to the victims. Do you think 300 million dollars equals a few generators, 10000 cases of water, and enough food to feed 50000 thousand. The amount of money these people bring into the city will bring far more carity.
the faster you run,
the slower time passes,
the longer you live...
rojo wrote:
what happened here? wrote:A marathon is hardly a professional sporting event anyway. The NYC marathon is a hobby race/walk that is able to generously support it's own charity called appearance fees only because 50,000 people pay $300 to run. How many of the 50,000 people running or thousands watching could name 5 professional runners in the race or even know who won a week after the race?
HOw many of the people paying $300 to sit in the upper deck of Dallas Cowboys stadium 10 times per year plus 75-200 per game for parking could name the starting conerback?
Why are runners so cheap? People complain about paying about $200+ to run down the streets of New York for 5-6 hours but have no problem paying $300+ per night for 4 nights to sleep in a room which requires zero work.
The NYRR is an amazing organization.
Yet Dwayne Wade will get publicity for donating 1/82nd of his salary after complaining about having to sit in 3 hrs of traffic - when his salary is greater than the entire New York pro field.
----
The NYRR is an amazing organization that does great for the NY running community at large. Ms. Wittenberg as the CEO had very poor judgement and showed she does not understand the city or the world of running. Making a donation she thought ,would defer the wrath of a political storm , it did not. No back up plan whatsoever.
She should step down or be fired by the board.
The so called pro side of the event , the super elites will be fine , its the second tier of elites that round out the top ten and pick up some prize money and the prestige of finishing in the top ten of one of the greatest marathons in the world. Ms. Wittenberg ended that opportunity.
Staten Island, connected by the Verrazano bridge into Brooklyn would need to have no obstacles. City officials need all access to all roads and as we now have limited networks. The Marathon would become a further liability to the rescue efforts. This is clear.
Some are pissed they can not run, while many folks in S.Island,Long Island, Rockaways are refugees, lost homes and so forth. It must have taken time to recognize the scope and needs of the people, unfortunately too late.
The places hit are decimated, a war zone. This argument or complaining directed to M.W> or Bloomberg is short sighted and lacking discernment.Clearly large scale rescue can not be interfered with. This is the priority. NY RR have much more on their plate than your desire to make your fantasies the way you want to make them come true. Get over it, and wait till people get their communities back.
CrossFan wrote:
- Would it have been acceptable to run this race ifthey turned it into a fundraiser for the relief effort? If 100% of the profits went toward relief efforts? It brings $$$$$ into the city that needs it more than ever right now, so couldn't they turn it into something that benefits the relief effort?
Great point! The most sensible thing anyone has said yet!
it no longer matters who is right or wrong, the citizens of NYC and spoken and most are really really pissed about the marathon being considered!.....marathoners should feel lucky they cancelled it....the people of NYC are a lot things...but they are not afraid to start a fight! People would of got hurt.....mostly runners and marathoners....this could of got real ugly!!!!!!!... It's over...go home.