GIVE THOSE 5th AVE GUYS CREDIT!!

Headwind Moses wrote:

If Galen, who never broke 1:50 and didn't have a decent kick for most of his college career, can run 3:50i, than Jenkins, who always has wheels at the end and is in 13:00 shape can run 3:49 with Murphy and BB rabbiting through 1:53. Times are legit, even a little slow IMO. No curves (which leads to less tactical, more balls-out), but also they are running in flats on pavement, not Monaco Mondo!

Jenny Simpson beat Muir running the equivalent of 3:59, they both have run consistently faster than that in the DL.

Exactly.

Centro has a track PR of 3:30.4, which is equivalent to around 3:47.8 for the mile…or even a little faster.

Here is my calculo question for you:

How much faster could Centro have run if he ran the tangents, had a better start…and was wearing some fancy Nike spikes at this road mile?

I think it would be exactly 11.8478594 seconds faster.

How much faster could Centro have run???

In conclusion:

A lot faster!!!

So none of these sick fast guys ever ran as fast as our Oregon Ducks on this course and yet there are people that say they only ran this fast cus the course is so fast!!

I LOVE THIS CRAZY WORLD BWAAAAAHHHHHH!!!!!!

Very funny wrote:

So none of these sick fast guys ever ran as fast as our Oregon Ducks on this course and yet there are people that say they only ran this fast cus the course is so fast!!

I LOVE THIS CRAZY WORLD BWAAAAAHHHHHH!!!!!!

Best comment of all.

not only has centro run the equivalent of about 3:47, but Alexander's 3:34 is equivalent to 3:51, and Muir and Simpson both ran slower than their equivalent 1500m times this year. Sometimes a lot of people pr in the same race simply because the weather is cool and there are very fast pacers going a long way, as was the case here. Yes, the course is fast, but when you have guys going out in 1:53 with no net downhill yet--the first quarter is down, the second quarter is uphill, and their pace actually slowed down a bit over the downhill second half, there is the opportunity for a very fast time. I bet that Jenkins could break 3:33 in Brussels. 3:32.03 is the equivalent of 3:49 mile. Every race where guys go with the pacers is a fast race. They just don't get enough opportunities in the U.S. to go after fast times.

Centro could have run a lot faster…and won the race easily…if he had not followed Alberto's stupid idea to look to his left before the finish…to try to do a silly impression of John Landy.

I noticed that Eric Jenkins does look a little bit like Sir Roger Bannister of Britain. (Dr. Roger Bannister of Britain…is a useless Brit doctor.)

Here is my reaction to Centro's race:

https://mobile.twitter.com/MattCentrowitz/media/grid?idx=7

Go the Real Merbotâ„¢!!!

Go Sir Eric Jenkins!!!

Hey Centro!

Your father still has a faster 5k PR than you... Mr. Fancy Pants.

Your father's 5K PR is 13:12.91…set while DESTROYING ALBERTO SALAZAR!!!

Let's take a look:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_SkBU09maA

OK?

I think you should see if you can finally run faster than your father at 5K…Mr. Fancy Pants.

And when you do that…will you also please DESTROY MO FARAH with your finishing speed (which is even better than Mobot's finishing speed!!!)!!!

Thank you.

Absolutely correct that Americans running in the states don't have many opportunities at all to run fast. To run a fast mile, we just saw what splits you need to be hitting along the way. With Kemboi pacing at Tracktown and then at the 5th Ave race we just saw, the splits were really fast. You never ever get that anywhere else all year long in the U.S.

In the DL Meets that is what you get. Smokin' splits. That is why the world lists are dominated by Africans and rarely do Americans make the top 30 list. We #1 don't have many Americans running DL 1500's and miles and #2 the races we run here are "rabbited" by inferior " rabbits".

The pacing that Murphy and Blankenship laid down set it up for a really fast time.

OP your post is false on so many levels. Where to begin? I'l crush your points one by one.

No it doesn't. The 27 feet drop more than compensates for having to go up hill in the 2nd quarter. Even if you say the uphills hurt you 50% more than the downhills help you (which isn't true) so it's it's -1.8 seconds for every 10 feet down and +2.7 for every 10 feet up, then you still gain a lot.

I had read the course used to drop as follows per quarter.

[-18, +24, -31, -5]

Now that adds up to -30 feet and it's only -27. So let's say it's

-15+24-31-5 by quater.

WHat would you get? Youd' still get an aid of 2.7 seconds. Add in the fact you are running exactly a mile and you get why it's faster.

No he wasn't pushed to his max. A guy who has been celebrating his Olympic gold for two weeks was pushbed but he looked over the wrong shoulder and was nipped at the line. Had he known Jenkins was there, he would have won.

Colby Alexander is a great story but he's not as good as any miler in American on any given day. He's a 3:34 guy on a GREAT day. Centro is a 3:29-3:30 guy on a Great Day.

It's like comparing a 4:03 guy to a 3:59 runner in college. It's not even really the same class of runner. One is a conference level stud, one is a national level stud.

Colby is a good American miler. Centro is the Olympic champion.

In case you forgot, here are the Olympic Trials resutls:

1500 m    Previous results 10 July

1 Matthew Centrowitz 03:34.09

2 Robby Andrews 03:34.88

3 Ben Blankenship 03:36.18

4 Leo Manzano 03:36.62

5 Craig Engels 03:37.66

6 Johnny Gregorek 03:38.76

7 Colby Alexander 03:38.90

8 Daniel Winn 03:39.22

9 Kyle Merber 03:40.27

10 Izaic Yorks 03:40.34

11 Eric Avila 03:41.21

12 Andrew Wheating 03:41.22

13 Jordan McNamara 03:49.44

Jordan McNamara also ran 3:51.0 on the course in 2014 and his PB is 3:52.89. The course is simply aided.

My college roommate ran 4:32 in the 40+ race. He went 2:21-2:11. He said that had he run it more even he'd have broken 4:30 and he knows he's not in sub 4:30 shape.

-rojo

PS.

We've updated the article to reflect the course goes NE to SW so it definitely wasn't a big cross wind. Basically more of a tail wind.

PPS. In case you don't know, the OP is reacting to our WTW piece on the front page:

Da Judge says... wrote:

John Walker

Ray Flynn

Eamonn Coghlan

Bernard Lagat

Alan Webb

Frank O'Mara

Jose Luis Gonzales

Mike Boit

Tom Byers

Peter Elliot

Nick Willis

And dozens and dozens of other ALL-TIME GREATS...

Have not run the 5th Ave course faster than the trio of Jenkins, Centro and Alexander did Saturday.

Nuff said.

So what are you saying? Are you supporting my point that it was aided?

Or are you saying that Jenkins is a better miler than Lagat, Willis and Webb?

I'm not denying that they ran fast and it wasn't tactical (probably becuase the conditions were perfect and they had the bonus for the 800) but I'm just saying you need to add 4+ seconds to those times.

I hadn't even thought of the most obvious reason why a road mile is faster than a track mile. You only run 1 mile and nothing more.

They always have the half-mile primer bonus. Or at least the last 7 years

rojo wrote:

[quote]

I hadn't even thought of the most obvious reason why a road mile is faster than a track mile. You only run 1 mile and nothing more.

You also don't have to slow down behind the pack because there is no turn to worry about. You don't have to get out exceptionally fast. Going around people is easy because it is now just a step to the side and you don't have to worry about finishing moves before the turns.

I think the downhill halfway has a Psychological benefit as well (it gets easier right when the race is starting to get very hard normally). There is probably someother psychological advantage at seeing the finish line once you crest the hill. Chasing the lead car is also fun

Also drafting probably works better since there can be, for example, 4 people across breaking the wind for everyone. Rather than just one in a line.

But the only difference this year from any other year was the very apparent tailwind. The weather is always pretty cool since the race is usually a few weeks later than it was this year. Possibly the earlier date helped since people weren't extending their seasons longer than they would have otherwise

So Muir and Simpson were battling to the line in a 4:03+ 1.5k effort? The last week sure put some serious lead in their pants, adding 6+ seconds to their performances. Maybe a delayed zika virus?? Thanks for the lulz,rojo

rojo wrote:

I'm not denying that they ran fast and it wasn't tactical (probably becuase the conditions were perfect and they had the bonus for the 800) but I'm just saying you need to add 4+ seconds to those times.

rojo

Let's leave 4:42 milers out of the discussion. Not applicable when talking about a talent level light years beyond his.

Centro was pushing very hard. In his post race interview he said when he saw the 3 quarter split he thought if he put the hammer down no one could hang.

He was maxed out. I'm not saying Jenkins could have won gold in Rio. Two diff races. This was balls to the wall. Jenkins showed he can beat Centro this way. Cuz he did.

Also when I said Colby can beat anyone on any given day, I mis spoke. He has never beaten Centro.

But let's look at the all the top American milers and how he has fared against them all minus Centro. He has raced Blankenship 3 times and Andrews 3 times and is 2 for 3 over both. With. 3:34 and a 3:50. He's beaten Manzano about 4 or 5 times this year. He's beaten Gregorek and Merber more than they've beaten him. Murphy, Winn, Yorks, JMac, Wheating, Heath, Crawford, Soratos, Casey, Leslie, See, who ya got? He hasn't lost to any of them.

I correct my statement. It should say "on any given day he can beat anyone BUT Centro". Why? Because he has.

I think by heat 3 at the Trials he was out of juice. But on any given day, one race, he can get it done vs anyone.

Comparing PR's is not a good way of rating athletes as long as they've raced each other. IMO if you beat someone, especially consistently, you're better until the other guy proves you're not. Times are secondary. Racing head to head is apples to apples. Comparing PR's is apples to oranges. And it doesn't really matter cuz Colby's PR's are better than these guys anyway for the most part.

As for all those formulas you brought up, it's like paying your builder for building your home. You have no way of proving he gouged you. Same thing with the fancy formula. No way to prove it definitively. Can't do it except on paper. Just look at every single post on this thread. Your opinion is an outlier.

Oh and rojo, that last post was obviously by me, the OP. In my haste to reply I forgot to post as my original "Give 'em Credit.

Give 'em credit wrote:

Oh and rojo, that last post was obviously by me, the OP. In my haste to reply I forgot to post as my original "Give 'em Credit.

You should have just posted as "Colby's mom."

Jenkins & Centro

https://cdn.letsrun.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/Centrowitz-JenkinsLook1a-5thAve16.jpg

Hey where is he

https://ixquick-proxy.com/do/spg/show_picture.pl?l=english&rais=1&oiu=http%3A%2F%2Foxford-royale.co.uk%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2012%2F03%2FStatue.jpg&sp=481f661b0092e781127657071dfb8892

rojo wrote:

he looked over the wrong shoulder and was nipped at the line. Had he known Jenkins was there, he would have won.

He should have been able to hear him. In a road race with just a few people you can always hear people coming up on you.

Unless they run quiet. Maybe Jenkins is a ninja. Good strategy if so.

Do you think that Sir Eric Jenkins looks like Sir Roger Bannister?

I do.

Oh boy Centro.

You should not listen to Alberto…with his stupid idea... of looking to the left.

(Centro had nothing to do with Alberto's stupid idea.)