Coe, Ovette and Ryun over 400m

Ryun may not have competed regularly over 800 but in '66 at age 19 he ran virtually as fast as Ovett ever did on faster tracks 15 years later. Both had similarly powerful finishes. I really don't see anything to choose between them over one lap given they were competing on the same tracks. Maybe Ovett would have the speed edge - just.

Worst take here.

800 Meters - July 1, 20.00 Hr
1. Dave Wottle (BG) 1:44.3 =WR
2. Rick Wohlhuter (UCTC) 1:45.0
3. Ken Swenson (US-A) 1:45.1
4. Jim Ryun (CW) 1:45.2
5. Ron Phillips (Ill) 1:45.3
6. Rick Brown (Cal) 1:45.4
7. Marcel Philippe (Fordham) 1:46.0
8. Tommy Fulton (TSU) 1:47.3
Semi-finals: - First 4 qualify, June 30, 19.00 Hr
1/ 1. Ryun 1:47.3, 2. Philippe 1:47.4, 3. Wottle 1:47.4, 4. Brown 1:47.5, 5. Ken Sparks (UCTC) 1:47.6, 6. Rob Mango (Ill) 1:47.9, 7.
Tom Bach (Nwn) 1:48.3, 8. Bob Smith (LSU) 1:52.0
2/ 1. Wohlhuter 1:47.2, 2. Swenson 1:47.2, 3. Phillips 1:47.3, 4. Fulton 1:47.4, 5. Tom Von Ruden (PCC) 1:48.0, 6. Steve Straub
(Husky SC) 1:48.8, 7. John Mock (Husky SC) 1:53.0, 8. Juris Luzins (USMC) 1:55.4
Heats: - First 4 qualify, June 29, 18.00 Hr
1/ 1. Ryun 1:48.7, 2. Brown 1:49.1, 3. Philippe 1:49.3, 4. Sparks 1:49.3, 5. Mark Winzenried (CW) 1:49.4, 6. Ken Schappert (Vill)
1:49.7, 7. Lowell Paul (UCTC) 1:51.2
2/ 1. Fulton 1:48.3, 2. Swenson 1:48.6, 3. Luzins 1:49.1, 4. Mock 1:49.4, 5. Ken Popejoy (Mich St) 1:49.5, 6. Tony Waldrop (NC)
1:49.8
3/ 1. Wohlhuter 1:49.2, 2. Straub 1:49.3, 3. Phillips 1:49.5, 4. Von Ruden 1:49.6, 5. Wilbur Hawkins (Tenn) 1:49.9, 6. Clay
Lowrey (Or St) 1:50.8, 7. Mike Mosser (WV) 1:51.8
4/ 1. Wottle 1:49.8, 2. Mango 1:49.9, 3. Bach 1:50.1, 4.Smith 1:50.2, 5. Steve Bence (Or) 1:51.0, 6. Art Sandison (Cougar TC)
1:51.5, 7. Willie Thomas (Tenn) 1:52.9
This was a superb 800m race, one of those which leaves the watchers drained from the emotion of it, and followed a series of surprises.
The fastest American of 1972, front-running Mark Winzenried, was outkicked by 3 men in the first heat won from the front by
resurging Jim Ryun. Another front runner Tommy Fulton was the fastest man (with 1:48.3) in the heats. The seeding worked well in the
semis with the 8 fastest times split 4-4 between the two semi-finals, with Ken Sparks the fastest non-qualifier on 1:47.6.
Fulton set the pace in the final, passing 200 in 25.2, and went past the bell in 52.0, with Wottle at the back of the pack in 52.9.
Ryun suddenly kicked with 300m to go, drawing Swenson and Wottle with him, and leaving a gap to the slender Wohlhuter. Ryun's
sixth 100 was run in a too fast 11.5, and his third metric furlong took 24.8. Only Wottle was able to stay with Ryun, and the two of them
were 5 meters clear of Swenson as they entered the finishing straight. Wottle held form well and moved ahead, as the others began to
close in on Ryun. Wohlhuter and then Swenson passed the tiring Ryun, who fought back unavailingly. Wottle won by 6 yards, but there
was less than 4 yards between 2nd and 6th, with Ryun, Ron Philips and Rick Brown losing out. Only Swenson and Ryun failed to set a
pb, and from a larger perspective, it was the first race to produce more than 2 men at 1:45.5 or better...6 men managing 1:45.4 !
Wottle's fine negative split (52.9 first lap, 51.4 second) suggested that he was capable of 1:43 in the heat of competition

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the information above is the 1972 Olympic Trials 800 from T&F News. We see Ryun competed in the event before winning the 1500 later in the week

Here's a minor observation; Ryun's best is reported here as a 46.9 440y relay leg. It's generally accepted that a 400 meter time is worth about .3 faster than a 440y performance. Can we then grant Ryun a mark of 46.6 for a 400m relay carry?

I'd agree that overtraining messed up Ryun's running career, he was past his peak by '68, his motivation seemed to suffer. (Although his 3:52.8 mile in Toronto in '72 was, I believe, the 3rd fastest mile ever at that point.)

Interesting but you have completely diverted from the subject of the thread.

I agree that Ryun's peak was over by 1968, when he got mono. He flared at a very young age, from 18-20, and then faded. His is a story of what might have been if he hadn't encountered health issues and trained more wisely, as you say. But for two seasons - 1966/67 - he was breathtaking. I will never forget when he destroyed Elliott's 1500 record - and Keino - in the '67 Colosseum Relays.

The faster? Lol

So how was Ovett likely to be faster than Coe over the shorter distance?

Anybody close to a current WR is a doper.

The only one clearly on drugs here is you.

For the fun of it, I would add to the race

Wilt Chamberlain

Tyreke Hill

Dieter Baumman

Sydney Mcghloughlin

Me, and also anybody close to a current WR.

I corrected the post that said Ryun didn't run the 800 in the '72 trials. Just getting the facts straight on the thread.

You're the only one we can prove is high.

We?

Besides yourself, who is "proving" something with your very unique sort of reasoning?