Road Racing and Training Thread - Week Ending 9/30/18

team 1 wrote:

question for the group re: M pace long runs several weeks before a marathon. i'm a little (a lot) undertrained so i'm balancing earning time on my feet with some race pace muscle memory and i have tentatively planned my two longest runs 4 and 2 weeks out from the race. First was going to be 20 with 16 at M pace plus 15 seconds. Second was going to be 23 with 18 at M. but considering scrambling the paces (running M pace for 16 and M+15 for the 18).

thoughts?

I’ve come to the view that M pace runs don’t provide as much bang for your buck as long runs with 6-8 miles mixed in at T pace eg 2E, 4x1T, 8E, 3T, 2E. If I were pressed for time I’d probably did very little M work and just focus on the faster stuff. If you do attempt a 15-18 miler at M I would be very impressed if you could hit the VDOT prescribed pace, or the pace that you untimely run in your race for that matter. I have a hard time getting within 10-15 seconds of my marathon pace on untapered legs for runs of that length.

... that should be "daughter-in-law..." Meanwhile, my former daughter-in-law (other son's ex) is running Chicago in the morning ... feeling under the weather she says on Facebook ...

Allen - Love the photo! The famous east veranda AND the family. Would love to join you out there for a glass of wine. Got my pinot tonight for $5.42...for the price, it is very good.

Had a nice one in the hills this morning. All things considered, I felt very good, and closed well again...15.14 at 6:38 overall...6:09, 5:57, 0:47 to finish.

outsiderunner wrote:

Had a nice one in the hills this morning. All things considered, I felt very good, and closed well again...15.14 at 6:38 overall...6:09, 5:57, 0:47 to finish.

Excellent run, and great deal on the pino. I have opted for a pre-dinner glass of mead. We have a wonderful little meadery in the nearby village. Maybe a beer with dinner. Swordfish and salmon, sauteed veggies, baked potatoes.

Be well!

And best wishes to all the marathoners tomorrow.

The menu sounds great. I had stuffed shells, made by my eight-year-old daughter, meatballs, and a salad. The wine goes well. Have not decided whether I will run some tomorrow or take a rest day. At 53 miles right now in five days.

Be well, my friend!

I would say the opposite. Long, long runs at a strong aerobic effort but not too taxing.

Good luck to the Chicago Peeps tomorrow. Some hard hot work was put in this summer... very impressive stuff on this thread.

T minus 12hours

Best of success to our Chicago racers.

I would have to agree with you, too hot. Strong aerobic long runs have built my foundation...and more.

outsiderunner wrote:

Strong aerobic long runs have built my foundation...and more.

To be honest, OR, as I formulate 2019 plans, I am considering borrowing a page or two from your playbook.

I'm gonna get my long run done in the late afternoon and try to find some kind of online stream. Do we have bib numbers from people interested in sharing?

team 1 wrote:

question for the group re: M pace long runs several weeks before a marathon. i'm a little (a lot) undertrained so i'm balancing earning time on my feet with some race pace muscle memory and i have tentatively planned my two longest runs 4 and 2 weeks out from the race. First was going to be 20 with 16 at M pace plus 15 seconds. Second was going to be 23 with 18 at M. but considering scrambling the paces (running M pace for 16 and M+15 for the 18).

thoughts?

If I'm remembering right, you're doing a downhill marathon on relatively short training. In that situation, I would be inclined to say that success/survival is likely to depend on how well your legs can handle the pounding. So, it seems like it would make sense to do at least a few long runs with a lot of downhill running in them, and maybe take one day a week to emphasize downhill running in general. Not necessarily running fast/hard downhill, but doing enough volume to harden your legs for the eccentric stress. (Best not to injure yourself in the process, of course.)

Slo: Thanks for the info on recovery from the long-fast runs.

hantph: Good to hear the PF is doing better. To be honest, I mostly dealt with mine by trying to ignore it and hoping it would go away, which it seems to be doing. Wearing comfortable shoes all the time (i.e., not going barefoot around the house) also seems to have been helpful. Sounds like you have a smart routine going. I should probably do more of that stuff, though I've actually been healthier over the last couple of years doing virtually no supplementary stuff than I was when I used to do quite a bit more. Not sure what to make of that if anything.

Allen: Good to hear the hamstring is on the mend. And that's a really nice photo - cool to see the veranda. You look good in plaid, by the way.

Good luck to the Chicago guys!

Borrow away, my friend...and you may end up increasing your joy in running, in addition to perhaps decreasing your paces...

Good Luck tomorow!!!

Allen, how can you already be making 2019 plans? Or are you just putting down some rough drafts? I think some of OR's playbook could be good for you. Try to figure out how to get some strides in though.

I just read NAU's Mike Smith's training. Very interesting how little work they do at VO2max or faster.

pewow: Great racing!!! I bet it was fun. I doubt you'd done much better with cross spikes on. I watched more than a few bail today at the meet I was at. Luckily you and they didn't get hurt.

I've found the Chicago local stream...good enough... see if I can find the olympic channel pirated stream. Have a great day!

pewow - I enjoyed the race report. Sounds like you had a fun race in that mess.

Chicago Watchers - All I have is 638 and 5242. Given that these they have posted personal information here before, I don't think they would mind me posting on their behalf.

Thanks, SI. Really rooting for good things to happen today.

Smoove, Andy D and AJ taking it out at goal pace through the half. Gordon T dropping the hammer from10-15k

keep the updates coming!

googles giphy of crickets...