Student loan forgiveness - Lol if you actually paid your student loans back.

How does it feel to get trolled?

OP

you are the problem. And, unfortunately, the future of this country. No longer are people serving their country, or volunteering for their communities. They are looking for ways to "get over"

While most people looked for part time jobs in high school, in the 50's- 1990's, the newer generation is being made into soft, lazy, jean wearing Pillsbury doughboys.

Your generation wears jeans to weddings, and are never seen before 6 AM anywhere.

I am afraid of what this country will become with the shrinking military, sledgehammers to the catholic churches, and gender-fluid people everywhere. Not to mention parents dressing their sons in dresses so they can "identify" their sex.

Go away. Get a job. Serve your country. volunteer. Or just go away

should take into account the return on investment when considering going to college. If you knew the jobs you could get with a philosophy degree would not be able to pay off your debt that on you.

Exactly5 wrote:

OP

you are the problem. And, unfortunately, the future of this country. No longer are people serving their country, or volunteering for their communities. They are looking for ways to "get over"

While most people looked for part time jobs in high school, in the 50's- 1990's, the newer generation is being made into soft, lazy, jean wearing Pillsbury doughboys.

Your generation wears jeans to weddings, and are never seen before 6 AM anywhere.

I am afraid of what this country will become with the shrinking military, sledgehammers to the catholic churches, and gender-fluid people everywhere. Not to mention parents dressing their sons in dresses so they can "identify" their sex.

Triggered by jeans? That’s a new one!

But seriously, you strike me as someone living in fear while the world passes them by. What a depressing existence that must be.

I also wonder how many times you’ve loudly declared, while around strangers, that you’re “officially done watching the [insert any professional sport that has black athletes]. “

I actually did receive public service loan forgiveness for six figures worth of loans and it was life changing. The program requirements are strict but if you are good at filling out paper work and following instructions then you can save boatloads on your loans. I recommend checking out https://www.reddit.com/r/PSLF/ if you need more info.

I think the issue here is considering cause. Does Exactly5 think people just decided to be lazier than his generation, which obviously was tougher? Maybe the environment changed. Also, people have always complained about "kids these days." The earliest recorded instance is thousands of years old. Probably because they assume their generation was more like them personally than it really was.

I think joining the military has become pretty unattractive for a lot of people after the Iraq war. Engagements like that dont feel much like serving your country.

Great handle donkeydoug.

I didn't apply for it, was surprised by it, but my student loan was "forgiven" after I'd worked a couple years as teacher in a state hospital Adolescent Program. I think there are some agencies that follow such things and recognize the use of loans for social betterment.

Philosophers make good money out of college, a lot more than welders, Senator Rubio, and mid-career 90th percentile earnings are over $160k.

I looked up rich philosophers and the results returned were:

1) Marcus Aurelius (Roman emperor)

2) Francis Bacon (Chancellor of England) (Does Queen Christine of Sweden count? She was a student of Descartes)

3) Bertrand Russell

4) Ayn Rand

5) Wittgenstein (a member of one of the richest families in Europe, but he renounced his wealth)

6) Seneca the Younger

7) Carl Icahn

8) George Soros

9) Bill Miller III (gave $75 million to the Johns Hopkins Philosophy Department)

Good try but every philosophy major I know from college is doing super well for themselves. This conservative nonsense about college might strike you as funny but student debt is out of control & even you can't deny that. There is zero reason for college to be as expensive as it is. The money flows to endowments, admin, and athletics. The system needs an overhaul.

FWIW it's this exact for profit education system that is ruining XC + T&F programs. Everything is connected.

I don't understand why people don't hold the schools accountable for this garbage. They claim to be uber-liberals, but they're the most money-grubbing, greedy, capitalist institutions on earth.

They take advantage of young kids, they waste tax-payer money, and when the government decides to help out students with federally-backed loans, they jack their tuition rates up to unbelievable prices.

Still... it isn't their fault.

WAKE tf UP!!!

#3 is well known now as far as I can tell, which is good.

Many of those millennials were absolutely lied to and told consistently by society and trusted people to "do what you love" and go to school for "what you're passionate" about with no concern for practicality. It was always "oh as long as you have a college degree you'll be well employed and easily able to find a job".

#1, #2, and #4 are all fairly valid, but I don't think it's reasonable to hold millennials responsible for #3.

Yeah, I did. I pay all my bills.

Exactly5 wrote:

OP

you are the problem. And, unfortunately, the future of this country. No longer are people serving their country, or volunteering for their communities. They are looking for ways to "get over"

While most people looked for part time jobs in high school, in the 50's- 1990's, the newer generation is being made into soft, lazy, jean wearing Pillsbury doughboys.

Your generation wears jeans to weddings, and are never seen before 6 AM anywhere.

I am afraid of what this country will become with the shrinking military, sledgehammers to the catholic churches, and gender-fluid people everywhere. Not to mention parents dressing their sons in dresses so they can "identify" their sex.

Go away. Get a job. Serve your country. volunteer. Or just go away

Everyone I know still looks for jobs. Volunteering might be declining...but that's difficult to tell if it's a result of mindset shifts...or just from people being swarmed with vastly larger amounts of debt and massive housing prices forcing them to work long hours to keep up.

The whole "ax religion thing I don't like. I certainly don't believe in god, but I think religion has a hell of a lot of value, and we are too quick to tear it up. Military might be a concern. Hard to tell.

Gender fluid is a really, really good thing. One of the three or four things conservatives struggle to see the most. Parents dressing their sons in dresses or vice versa is comically rare. Perhaps 1 in 10,000 to 1 in 100,000 arch liberal parents do stuff like that. I've never met or seen that happen in my entire life. If it was happening consistently, sure I would question it, but I don't worry about things that are stupidly rare.

Gender fluidity is huge because of the changes in dating and the resulting events of men. Since online dating went big in 2013 the number of men who want to be in a relationship but have never been has been jumping around 500k per year, and is over 20% now. That's a staggering figure with tremendous implications.

Biologically and culturally it's a huge deal to have a mate. The effect to a man's psyche and confident if he isn't able to find anyone is massive. It obviously makes you feel worthless and unwanted. Moreover, the reasons for this increase is very easily seen (incorrectly, but easily nonetheless) as being women's fault, which engenders anger as well. Anger at the system that got there, and at women. Angry young men are NOT a good thing. Even more so, angry young men without a significant other. Being in a relationship has massive benefits for preventing violence and other outcomes in young men.

The societal repercussions of this are truly unnerving. Which brings me back to gender fluidity and it's value. Homesexuality is great, because guys find a partner of some kind. M2F gender fluidity is even better, because it kills two birds with one stone; not only does that guy appear as female and find male partners, he provides an additional "female" partner to males.

That's a very good outcome, vastly superior to the alternative outcome of exponentially growing legions of angry young men disenfranchised with their ability to even find a partner as a consequence of today's altered dating landscape.

NERunner053 wrote:

Good try but every philosophy major I know from college is doing super well for themselves. This conservative nonsense about college might strike you as funny but student debt is out of control & even you can't deny that. There is zero reason for college to be as expensive as it is. The money flows to endowments, admin, and athletics. The system needs an overhaul.

FWIW it's this exact for profit education system that is ruining XC + T&F programs. Everything is connected.

Schools have culpability....but it's not "their fault". At the end of the day consumers support the schools. Sure, some of the state schools receive significant government funding...but they still rely deeply on tuition.

People vote with their wallets, and the excess largely comes from those pocketbook votes. Kids have been wanting ever more elaborate college experiences, and parents have continued supporting it incrementally because it's become what's expected and there is an idea that kids "deserve" that experience.

College isn't necessary for many careers, and for the ones it is, you can still go to community college and pick up 50% to maybe 75% of the required classes for far, far less.

Culpability lies at the level of the government, at the university level, but perhaps most at the individual level for continually supporting the desire to give these more and more elaborate educational vacations.

Parsec wrote:

Schools have culpability....but it's not "their fault". At the end of the day consumers support the schools. Sure, some of the state schools receive significant government funding...but they still rely deeply on tuition.

People vote with their wallets, and the excess largely comes from those pocketbook votes. Kids have been wanting ever more elaborate college experiences, and parents have continued supporting it incrementally because it's become what's expected and there is an idea that kids "deserve" that experience.

College isn't necessary for many careers, and for the ones it is, you can still go to community college and pick up 50% to maybe 75% of the required classes for far, far less.

Culpability lies at the level of the government, at the university level, but perhaps most at the individual level for continually supporting the desire to give these more and more elaborate educational vacations.

Same goes for the big banks. I mean, all these fools who think they "deserve" a house when they absolutely cannot afford it. It's on them, not the banks. I mean, they could live in a trailer or an apartment.

They could. Up to a point.

I don't think you've made any point though. Is there something you are trying to say?

Individuals do have some culpability for what happened in that case. You're not arguing that many of the individuals that took those loans made quality financial decisions are you?

Individuals do have less culpability than compared to the college example because banks and housing is not a good comparison to universities.

Universities are playing on extra services not fundamental to basic life. Banks were playing with housing, which is a fundamental necessity to basic life.

It's pretty reasonable to want a decent place with reliable utilities and living conditions in a fairly safe neighborhood. That's basic Maslow's and pretty much a fundamental need. That need is not necessarily met (it can be though) in trailer parks or apartments in poor places of the city far away from work.

You can make the case, easily and often, that it's unreasonably difficult to not have a decent place that provides safety within a reasonable travel distance to where one works.

It's almost impossible to make the case that eliminating elaborate athletics stadiums and programs, meticulously cared for lavish fields and campuses, etc. make it unreasonably difficult to get a degree.

Parsec, I agree with you. I was giving you a hard time because you seem to want to absolve schools and blame the consumer. I see it a bit differently. The schools realize the Federal government is subsidizing loans and they can charge whatever they want, so they start an arms race - even/especially the public schools - and the students no longer have much of a choice.

Sure, they can go to Community College, but even small state schools have found a niche and can justify charging $15,000 a year in tuition alone.

I think the important thing is that you and I see the solution being a solid education at a reasonable price. I slept in what was basically a prison quarters when I was a freshman, LOL. I had a blast.

Blame Schools wrote:

Same goes for the big banks. I mean, all these fools who think they "deserve" a house when they absolutely cannot afford it. It's on them, not the banks. I mean, they could live in a trailer or an apartment.

Actually, this deserves a unique call out. You're roughly trying to parody what I said...but did so disingenuously. Your parody attempt suggests I said that it's all on individuals and not on universities.

My statement explicitly was that responsibility falls somewhat to individuals, somewhat to schools, and somewhat to government (because of their hand in public universities).

Since you've shown an inability to discuss something with integrity and in good faith I don't think there is much to discuss.