Bowerman athletes all broken

Shoebacca wrote:

Glad we all agree Salazar is a cheating idiot.

Crazy Cubano, Si.

..... wrote:

[quote]peekay wrote:

Rupp must have been running on it for a long time with pain, because when they finally pulled him he had to have surgery and his dr put out some weird statement about Rupp's achilles being so effed up that he must have the highest pain tolerance the dr has ever seen.

Tramadol is one hell of a drug.

no muscle & injured wrote:

I'm sorry but WTF wrote:

Look like the legs of someone who just escaped Auschwitz.

Jerry Schumacher's daughter, on the far left, has stronger legs than Gwen.

Skinny legs are more economical for distance running

Agreed. Even the running we did in college caused half the team to be consistently banged up can you imagine the pros. It’s not easy to stay healthy at that level of training and competition. If you do it seems your pretty lucky genetically or just in general. The guys I knew to be durable seemed to have more muscle mass than the rest of us.

my personal opinion and I’m not a doctor or sports therapist BUT have you noticed how much strength excercises they constantly do? I follow most of them on social and it seems all they do is band resistance workouts, Pilates, pure barre, balance beams and all that crap more than they actually run. Specifically quigley and Infeld, who happen to be the ones who seem to struggle the most. Maybe rid themselves of all that nonsense and just keep the running and I bet they’d have less injuries because they’d be able to recover quicker.

Number of instagram photo ops is not proportional to actual time spent on an activity

Stats McKenzie wrote:

The idea that one group gets injured more than this or that other group lacks statistical rigor (any statistical analysis, that is) and is therefore meaningless. It would be pretty hard to compare anyway: sample sizes are too small, no controlling for factors (mileage, history of injury, etc), lack of transparency about training and injuries, and on and on.

It doesn't lack statistical rigor, it lacks discrimination power. As you say, this may make the analysis based on such a small sample useless, but that doesn't make it lack rigor.

Justathought1 wrote:

my personal opinion and I’m not a doctor or sports therapist BUT have you noticed how much strength excercises they constantly do? I follow most of them on social and it seems all they do is band resistance workouts, Pilates, pure barre, balance beams and all that crap more than they actually run. Specifically quigley and Infeld, who happen to be the ones who seem to struggle the most. Maybe rid themselves of all that nonsense and just keep the running and I bet they’d have less injuries because they’d be able to recover quicker.

I don't know anything about those two, but your analysis seems pretty suspect.

Maybe, maybe not, who knows.

These athletes are trying to wring out every last bit of performance where fractions of a second matter and therefore spend a large portion of their week seemingly doing trivial things that (may) have a small chance of facilitating a small improvement.

Any benefits are small and therefore difficult to observe and the pool of athletes doing this is relatively small making any particular observation relatively worthless, re: the statistical discussion. Combine these two facts and we have a situation where there's just a lot of hocus pocus going on.

Hardloper wrote:

no muscle & injured wrote:

Jerry Schumacher's daughter, on the far left, has stronger legs than Gwen.

Skinny legs are more economical for distance running

Of course Jerry’s athletes get hurt...he is training them to be at the level that very few white runners have ever approached. Solinsky had the fastest 10k ever by a non African, Jager is the only white runner to run 8 flat in the steeple, infeld is a world champs medalist and Olympian, houlihan is the American record holder in the 5k, shalane won NYC, Frerichs has a medal and is the fastest white woman ever in the steeple, Quigley ran 9:10 last year.

The BTC is effectively the greatest training group of non African runners in the history of the sport. The Oregon Project has not had the same team level of success. To be on that level, the intensity of training has to be incredible, and if we assume they’re clean it’s even more impressive. Surprising, really, that more of them aren’t hurt.

Shoebacca wrote:

Glad we all agree Salazar is a cheating idiot.

No! I don't agree. Salazar is a coach doing the best he can in an environment where his every move is analyzed at a microscopic level. Given the degree of observation and scrutiny NOP faces, it is much more likely that "cheating" is occurring within the Bowerman camp and other camps that face much less "sunlight."

Not weighing in on the debate here, just a funny photo on a few levels:

https://i2-prod.mirror.co.uk/incoming/article1221805.ece/ALTERNATES/s615/Olympics-Day-9-Athletics.jpg

Face Farter wrote:

ncrecuvuer wrote:

Centro had hardly been injured til 2017 and he had an illness in conjunction with his hamstring problems. He got back to decent health in 2018 winning USA's and running 3:31. Centro was banged up late 2018, but he's back running now and should be fine for worlds unless he gets injured again.

You lose all credibility if you think he was hardly injured until 2017.

Okay, well then show me some of your credibility

Don't call me out and don't back yourself up, name his impacting injuries he had pre-2017

Alright, well then specify your point, what did I miss?

Am I wrong to believe that both teams are aging considerably? I feel like Rupp and Centro went about a decade without major setbacks, but they're into their twilight years now.

A lot of these folks also take thyroid meds to maintain sickly low weight, right? So that can't help.

Hardloper wrote:

no muscle & injured wrote:

Jerry Schumacher's daughter, on the far left, has stronger legs than Gwen.

Skinny legs are more economical for distance running

I feel like they are also more economical for stress fractures

A lot of posters have hit the nail on the head. BTC trains hard. High mileage, long tempos, long workouts like 8-10xMile, etc.

They push it a bit more than most groups it seems and the result will be more injuries. Maybe they could do a bit less mileage and intensity but maybe they won’t be as good.

We can all agree BTC and NOP are both better than OTC. OTC has been a total graveyard and has a significantly worse track record (pun intended) than BTC and/or NOP.

westsouthrunner wrote:

Hardloper wrote:

Skinny legs are more economical for distance running

I feel like they are also more economical for stress fractures

Being that emaciated is not healthy; being that emaciated while training with intensity, doubly so.

However, it's a numbers game. Runners in an emaciated state increase their odds of injury (they're almost certainly compromising their general health and longevity, but that's par for the course), but this may be what is necessary for them to have a chance at being competitive. It's the old "throw 'em against the wall and see what sticks" filter when you have a large pool of candidates like Schumacher's training group.

Kind of sad, really. Stay in school kids.

westsouthrunner wrote:

Hardloper wrote:

Skinny legs are more economical for distance running

I feel like they are also more economical for stress fractures

Even if your (unsubstantiated) feelings are true, so what? Stress fractures heal, slow times don't