Why not just do every run at Marathon Pace?

5 a day at 7 pace isn't running 303 wrote:

If you are in good shape, marathon pace is pretty hard. If you aren't in that good of shape, marathon pace may be slower than your normal running pace.

This is certainly the answer for slower runners, especially those not running much volume. Hell, if you are only running 3-mile runs, it's not impossible to run most of your easy days at close to tempo pace (~1 hr race pace). If you only have 20 minutes a day to train three or four times a week, this may even be the optimal training strategy.

I do classic marathon training (although low-mileage) with tempo runs and long runs slower than marathon pace.

But the last 14 days I only do 3 MP runs per week. Often not so easy to hold this pace for 5 or 10 miles.

To get my legs used to the pace.

Got this from a free Asics online marathon schedule (which no longer exists).

I participated in a 10 k race a week ago. There is a guy from my local running club I don't know really well (he is a member for one year maybe now), but he posts all of his training at strava. In principle he does 10 k runs 20 s slower than my actual 10 k pace and some 20 k runs just about 30 s slower than my 10 k pace, so always about the marathon pace range. I won't be able to match his stride more than occasionally. But he runs just every second or third day. I do run these paces maybe once a week in a faster 5 mile to 10 k run, but even faster in 1-2 workouts per week, and most times my daily 10k run is up to one minute slower than his usual running pace. Indeed I do not even carry a watch then.

However, I was afraid that newby might be able to beat me in that 10 k race if I have a sub-optimal day. Guess what - I had quite a bad day but nevertheless beat that guy by almost 2 minutes.

He was simply not able to run more than 5-10 s faster in that 10 k race than his normal training pace. So running all your runs in that marathon pace range is far from a good training program. Run faster to stress your body, run much slower to recover and adapt. Repeat this multiple times and succeed.

Exactly. He is conditioning his body to become super effective at running his MP. As soon as he has to do something faster, he breaks down.

You also have an automatic win against him if you know how to deal with him - just do a nice acceleration or "pick-up" during the race. He will try to hang but get dropped fairly quickly, because he is just a one-dimensional runner that would start to produce way too much lactate when you do your pick-up. Then you can slow down to your average pace again and never have to worry about this guy anymore.

I follow a guy on strava who runs 90-100 mpw. Regional caliber racer. Runs all "normal" runs at 6:00 pace or even below. It's incredible the way this guy can hammer daily. I NEVER see him run 7 or 8min miles. Does huge long workouts sub 6.

He recently ran a 1:06 13.1 mile workout. A few weeks later he ran a HM race in .....1:06.

He races much slower than elites I also follow (who run ALOT at 7min pace or slower) but trains MUCH faster. I don't think it's smart. Must feel fried all the time.

On a side note, strava has really opened my eyes to how slowly many top runners put in the miles. They still put in 90mpw or more, but much over 7 pace. Hard workouts, and tons of 7min miles.

That's too hard that's why. You'd have to quit your day job if you have one and take some (likely illegal) drugs to assist recovery and even then I'm not sure you'd recover fast enough.

Running every day just a touch slower than MP as opposed to a whole minute slower is legit though. May be not the most effective type of training but not the worst by a long shot. Throw in some workouts and you have Hadd. More workouts and it's basically Canova.

hj53 wrote:

That's too hard that's why. You'd have to quit your day job if you have one and take some (likely illegal) drugs to assist recovery and even then I'm not sure you'd recover fast enough.

Running every day just a touch slower than MP as opposed to a whole minute slower is legit though. May be not the most effective type of training but not the worst by a long shot. Throw in some workouts and you have Hadd. More workouts and it's basically Canova.

This approach worked for Steve Jones.

I do 35 mpw with almost all of it at 8 min/mile except for the workout. If I started doing 35 mpw with almost all of it at 6:30-6:50, why wouldn't I improve? That's almost 2 minutes per mile faster.

simply UPDATE CODE 2 the appropriate pace & view