just go through the 2016 otq race list and look at the total qualifiers
just go through the 2016 otq race list and look at the total qualifiers
FormerTree wrote:
Napa has been mentioned as a downhill course, but it has produced 4 sub 2:19 performances in it's history. It might be slightly better as a women's qualifier, but still you're probably only talking about a finisher every minute or so between 2:30 & 2:45.
Napa is a rolling course, with many highly crowned gradual turns, definitely NOT a fast course.
The one year I ran it there was freezing rain blowing on my chest through my singlet all the way.
I was shaking and shivering and had to drop out at 23 miles. I would not run that course again and have not.
I’m planning to do Grandma’s. It’s a bit late but seemed to be the best option.
Please realize that times from Boston are not considered an OTQ unless you land in the top 10. It has too great a net drop in elevation to count.
No OTQ at Boston wrote:
Please realize that times from Boston are not considered an OTQ unless you land in the top 10. It has too great a net drop in elevation to count.
Not true.
No OTQ at Boston wrote:
Please realize that times from Boston are not considered an OTQ unless you land in the top 10. It has too great a net drop in elevation to count.
If you smoking something, you sharing dawg.
The avenue of the Giants in northern california.
People have run 2:20 there, but very infrequent. Though considering the course profile, time of year, weather, climate, The Ave is the type of course where if one is truly ready to run a certain time, then one can't blame the course if one falls short of a goal time.
As another poster stated, i doubt the course is sanctioned (though it is certified).
goodbye Heyward wrote:
OTQ hopeful wrote:
Eugene was actually one I was eying. All the turns on that course scare me a bit.
I ran Eugene last year (albeit in the 3:00 range, not 2:19) but I didn't notice any issues with turns. Looking at the map it seems the course is very similar to last year except it runs much of last year's course in reverse. Instead of starting/finishing at Heyward it starts/finishes at Autzen. The only tight turn I remember was going up onto the bridge at around mile 21 or so (mile 17 on the current course, opposite direction). One thing that bothered me was the full and half started together on the same course until around mile 9 I think. Half runners turned left and full to the right and suddenly half of the field was gone. Lost a lot of people I was pacing off.
Eugene is known for being high percentage concrete. The concrete runner would love it. They also hold the date to have sunny hobby jogger weather, the opposite of what they should do for serious runners. It should be a month earlier. Lots of pollen too. Hobby jogger marathon like the rest of them. They don't have the "finish on historic Hayward Field" draw anymore, what's the point of catering to destination runners who wanted to run on historic Hayward? Give it a 6.5/10. Mediocre.
Sloinnorcal wrote:
The avenue of the Giants in northern california.
People have run 2:20 there, but very infrequent. Though considering the course profile, time of year, weather, climate, The Ave is the type of course where if one is truly ready to run a certain time, then one can't blame the course if one falls short of a goal time.
As another poster stated, i doubt the course is sanctioned (though it is certified).
You're joking right? A race where the winning time last year was 2:35 and no one has run the current OTQ time since 1975? That's your suggestion as the best equivalent of CIM's depth?
Zee wrote:
What about Illinois Marathon in April? Anyone ever run this and what did they think? Looks like decent prize money for a medium sized marathon.
I’m running it this year. Depending on how my buildup shakes out, I’ll be going out in 1:09:30-1:11:30 range. Hopefully 1:09:30.
Fasterrr wrote:
just go through the 2016 otq race list and look at the total qualifiers
http://www.marathonguide.com/news/exclusives/2016USAOlympicTeamTrialsMarathon/QualifierLists/CreateReports.cfm?Order=Races&Sex=M
It looks like Grandma's is the answer to OP's question.
It does not seem that bad of an option for a spring marathon. Ottawa and Grandmas will probably have the most men running in the sub 2:19 range however, the weather in the spring even in Duluth can sometimes be hot. If someone can plan to acclimate for heat that'd be smart to cover all bases. The profile for the course at Illinois seems fast and the weather looks like it's quite a bit cooler. I wonder if anyone knows how crowd support is because that might help too
Hearing that CIM won't count as an OTQ anymore (after the 2020 trials window closes, I guess). Too much downhill and too many "illicit" (my word, not theirs) qualifiers that don't place in the Trials. There's some expense that CIM needs to cover to keep in the USATF good graces and they just can't pay it anymore.
Ackley wrote:
It looks like Grandma's is the answer to OP's question.
the only catch is, just like Boston, the weather can be hit or miss - some some years Grandmas looks *amazing* for results but other years works completely against you
however if you are seeking an otq "pack" it's likely others will be there to share your misery regardless of the weather
personally I think it would be a reasonable idea to eliminate point-to-point courses as qualifiers towards an international event that does not allow point-to-point for records and the actual trials course also is not point-to-point or generally descending, it's going to be a challenging event
it would also "spread around" the otq locations, we're not exactly short on marathons in this country
Snickers in Georgia at the start of March was mentioned earlier and yeah that's a nice little quiet marathon like Jax Bank that is popular with BQ and age-groupers but OTQ folks haven't caught onto yet, someone could get a group together
Save your pennies and go to Europe or Japan. Way more options and deeper fields. Plus, you can turn the trip into a mini vacation.
Sacramentoutsider wrote:
Hearing that CIM won't count as an OTQ anymore (after the 2020 trials window closes, I guess). Too much downhill and too many "illicit" (my word, not theirs) qualifiers that don't place in the Trials. There's some expense that CIM needs to cover to keep in the USATF good graces and they just can't pay it anymore.
0/10
GBohannon wrote:
Zee wrote:
What about Illinois Marathon in April? Anyone ever run this and what did they think? Looks like decent prize money for a medium sized marathon.
I’m running it this year. Depending on how my buildup shakes out, I’ll be going out in 1:09:30-1:11:30 range. Hopefully 1:09:30.
Switch out and run Boston. If you have a decent resume, send it over to the RD at Boston and you'll at least get an entry. Looking at the elite field currently, there will be plenty of non John Hancock elite American's in the field that are 2:15-2:25 guys.
Another option could be to train and race Boston, unless the weather is bad, then drop out and go to Grandma's Marathon. Many runners have done that, and Kellan Taylor is just one that comes to mind recently (Rupp is another of course). Runners have done this in the Fall. They have raced or dropped out of Chicago, and come back and run CIM. Granted, CIM has more predicable weather and was a US Champ with a slew of men/women going for the standard. So basically a Boston/Grandma's double is possible.
However, if you do Grandma's and have bad weather there as well, then the chances of recovering and gearing up for an early fall marathon are hampered.
Ackley wrote:
Fasterrr wrote:
just go through the 2016 otq race list and look at the total qualifiers
http://www.marathonguide.com/news/exclusives/2016USAOlympicTeamTrialsMarathon/QualifierLists/CreateReports.cfm?Order=Races&Sex=MIt looks like Grandma's is the answer to OP's question.
This past Boston is an outlier, so it's hard to say if Grandma's has more potential qualifiers than Boston. Grandma's definitely does a better job at helping out the OTQ people, so it's a toss up.
Zee wrote:
It does not seem that bad of an option for a spring marathon. Ottawa and Grandmas will probably have the most men running in the sub 2:19 range however, the weather in the spring even in Duluth can sometimes be hot. If someone can plan to acclimate for heat that'd be smart to cover all bases. The profile for the course at Illinois seems fast and the weather looks like it's quite a bit cooler. I wonder if anyone knows how crowd support is because that might help too
The crowd support at Illinois is weak at best. The course is flat, but the weather at that time of the year in Champaign can be anything from snow to 95 degrees. Also, the course record is 2:20:xx so if you are planning to OTQ there you will either be running alone or with a couple C level Africans who are just trying to beat you for the prize money.
This is exactly my point. Point to point course can take advantage of a north breeze on a cool day.
Fasterrr wrote:
Ackley wrote:
It looks like Grandma's is the answer to OP's question.
the only catch is, just like Boston, the weather can be hit or miss - some some years Grandmas looks *amazing* for results but other years works completely against you
however if you are seeking an otq "pack" it's likely others will be there to share your misery regardless of the weather
personally I think it would be a reasonable idea to eliminate point-to-point courses as qualifiers towards an international event that does not allow point-to-point for records and the actual trials course also is not point-to-point or generally descending, it's going to be a challenging event
it would also "spread around" the otq locations, we're not exactly short on marathons in this country
Snickers in Georgia at the start of March was mentioned earlier and yeah that's a nice little quiet marathon like Jax Bank that is popular with BQ and age-groupers but OTQ folks haven't caught onto yet, someone could get a group together