A "big" runner with low BF

First, running is just a hobby, doesn't strike me as worth interfering with your hormone levels, peers who suggest otherwise might lack a sense of the big picture :)

Second, I like this article

https://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/20/sports/20iht-20bodies.15452513.html

-- Erin Donohue is "is 173 centimeters tall and weighs 66 kilograms — heavier than all three men on the United States Olympic team in her event." (that's 5'8" and 145 lbs, which is almost exactly my size (I'm a boy) -- but I once passed by ED at a track meet and she seemed a lot shorter than that to me.)

ED has a glass-half-full interpretation of things:

"Donohue, the 1,500-meter runner, is perhaps the most puzzling to exercise researchers.

"She runs like a big person — heavily," Coyle said. "There is less bounce in her step. She is kind of slow in reacting. She looks like she is muscling her way through the race."

...

Donohue has her own thoughts on the matter. She says she knows she is large for a runner, something she cannot help noticing when she stands next to someone like her teammate Shalane Flanagan, who won bronze in the 10,000 on Friday.

"My shoulders are twice as wide as Shalane's," Donohue said of Flanagan, who is 165 centimeters tall and weighs 47 kilograms. "There is no way I would ever look like that."

But in the 1,500, she said, speed and strength are important, so she can use the extra muscle that comes with her weight to push her way through a race. She has been running since she was very young, she said, and has developed great endurance. She runs 110 to 130 kilometers, or 80 to 90 miles, a week and has never had a serious injury.

Winning the 1,500 usually comes down to which runner can sprint the fastest at the end. "I have the endurance to get to that point," Donohue said, "especially against smaller girls who may not have the strength.""

Yikes, idk why letsrun has to bother every woman who posts.

If you eat 1500-1800 every day on 40 mpw at your height and weight, you would be losing weight and fast. That's a 800-1000 calorie deficit. But you aren't losing weight. How is that possible?

Personally, every time I track calories I gain weight. The extra mental effort just makes me hungry LOL. Your diet sounds perfect, so it is up to you to evaluate what's going on. Honestly, if I had no other info about you than that post, I would suspect disordered eating, which can definitely lead to weight gain by messing up your metabolism.

Maybe try eating intuitively and increasing training time (if you can't run much, cross train.) Weight lifting is good but I wouldn't overdo it.

my thoughts wrote:

Yikes, idk why letsrun has to bother every woman who posts.

If you eat 1500-1800 every day on 40 mpw at your height and weight, you would be losing weight and fast. That's a 800-1000 calorie deficit. But you aren't losing weight. How is that possible?

Personally, every time I track calories I gain weight. The extra mental effort just makes me hungry LOL. Your diet sounds perfect, so it is up to you to evaluate what's going on. Honestly, if I had no other info about you than that post, I would suspect disordered eating, which can definitely lead to weight gain by messing up your metabolism.

Maybe try eating intuitively and increasing training time (if you can't run much, cross train.) Weight lifting is good but I wouldn't overdo it.

I'm not a female, it was an April Fool's Day joke. Only 3 of you figured it out, geez!!!

This is a prime example of a thread that is useless without pics.

Stop eating dairy and animal products.

longbutnot wrote:

This is a prime example of a thread that is useless without pics.

It was a male on April 1st, joking.

Read the post above yours and get a clue.

John Utah wrote:

Stop eating dairy and animal products.

+1

You are a female and I know why you now claim to be male. Take advantage of the academics. The coach there doesn't have time to give you personalized attention, he has too many ponies in his stable. You'll have to figure out on your own what is going to work for you.

Fatbutnot? wrote:

I am a 5'5" college female who weighs 133 lbs and runs primarily the steeplechase, but also run 1500 and 5k. Everything and anything about getting faster talks about losing weight and ideal weights put me at 118-125, but I'm already at 18% body fat, and when I lose more, my hormones are thrown off and I don't get a period, but will just endlessly bleed and get iron deficiency (yes, male counterparts, bleeding does not automatically mean period). I have big boobs for a runner (DD) and I even got a mammogram to see if they are fatty or dense, and turns out they are denser than average (aka not going to get them much smaller).

Do I just give up on getting lighter? Doctors are not helpful. I run 40 ish mpw, but that's because I am slowly building back from the low iron.

Wife had almost exactly the same build, height and issues more than 20+ years ago running D1. She spent a lot of time injured and out of sorts due to the weight issues - the fact is that it is very difficult to compete in the distance with girls 20 pounds lighter. She also had a lot of problems with coaches who called her 'soft',though she was quite talented - they blamed it on her eating too much ( I can vouch for her, as we lived together - she was eating very little - diet similar to yours). So, the best things that worked for her, with a lot of trial and error: a high protein, high fat diet with basically zero carbs (responded in no time, and lost excess weight, which was impossible for her on a carb-based diet). Lose the carbs almost entirely. No bread, no cereal, no pasta, no rice, no potatoes, no sugar. Eat meats and greens. Hard at first, but it works, and the body adapts to it - the high fat will help the hormonal system to regulate itself too. They put her on the pill with similar issues you describe above also - it was very bad for her - it made her weight issues worse, and she put on another 5 pounds or so. Weight training is something she responded to well as well. You could also up the mileage slightly (50+ mpw). Don't forget - you're unlikely to compete with the Africans or be competing professionally in the coming years - enjoy this part of your life, do your best - but don't forget running isn't the 'be all and end all'. Use the discipline and the lessons learnt to move on in life smoothly. Running can be a great companion in the coming decades, but keep some perspective.

In summary: combining mileage 50+ mpw, a high fat/high protein diet (CUT the carbs at all costs - the body should respond and the fat in the diet regulate your hormonal system, and you'll lose weight simultaneously) and weight training 3 x per week [very surprised you aren't doing it already]. Do NOT go on the pill unless forced/necessary.

Gotta keep it real wrote:

Male wrote:

I'm a male. You didn't mention weight training. If you can find both the time and energy, vigorous weight training x 5 days per week will lower your body fat percentage.

Yes, absolutely. She should try weight training. She should start with 2-3 days per week, starting with 5 days is too much. Women tend to respond very quickly to weight training and that could be the edge she needs.

ya if ur training 5 days a week "vigirous" ur either doing body part splits or on insane amounts of gear or arent training as hard as you think

Hutch?

jimmyjinlondon wrote:

In summary: combining mileage 50+ mpw, a high fat/high protein diet (CUT the carbs at all costs - the body should respond and the fat in the diet regulate your hormonal system, and you'll lose weight simultaneously) and weight training 3 x per week [very surprised you aren't doing it already]. Do NOT go on the pill unless forced/necessary.

There have been a couple people posting as me saying this is an April fool's joke or that I am actually a guy. Those people were not the actual OP.

Clearly, most men have no interest in actually learning about what women have to go through when you aren't naturally a size 0 with AA cups or tiny hips. A size 4 is small to the rest of the nonrunning world, but it is huge for a runner and I am just looking for support. Unlike my husband, I can't retain six pack abs while doing nothing and eating cheap, but I can get a somewhat toned four pack if I work my butt off.

And for those who think I was "bragging" about the catcalling, I don't think you understand how humiliating it is to have someone sexualize you while you are working your butt off to improve or how terrifying it is when it looks like you are about to be assaulted. I had someone swipe at me with their car when I didn't respond to their catcalling. Is almost getting killed really sound fun to you? I'll be a male runner over a female runner for that reason alone. Maybe if men called each other out instead of thinking catcalling is NBD, we could get somewhere.

Jimmyinlondon thank you for sharing about your wife. I am hoping to get off the pill soon, but if it didnt solve the issues I have, I have to get surgery. I follow a similar diet to what your wife did and was losing weight just fine. I had gotten to 128, but I guess the pill is throwing things off because I changed nothing about my diet, but suddenly am stuck at 133.

I do weight train 2x a week and I am trying to build to 60 mile weeks, but I was set back because of the iron deficiency I mentioned that I only just now seem to be on the other side of enough to do longer and more intense workouts without seeing stars or passing out 2 laps in.

As a type A personality trying to maximize the smidgen of talent I have, I am trying to get all these things right. It is good to know I am doing a lot right and have to keep working hard and hopefully my body will function like normal once I get off the pill. I tend to retain fluid easily (hence, cutting out carbs), and the doc did say that is probably increasing my fluid retention, no matter what I do. I just didn't want that to be an excuse.

The good thing is, I had an initial bump after starting the pill and have lost some weight after the first rollercoaster month of being on it (seriously guys, you have no clue, can't you just be sympathetic for once). So, maybe when I get off it and the fluid retention goes down, I will see more of a weight I would expect to.

I am not going to post anymore, so I guess people can pretend to be me, although why you would, I dont know.

Also, thanks to the Donahue article poster. I also appreciate women like Kieffer and Purrier.

I'm glad the poster backed up my diet recommendation with the example of his wife. I agree the pill is probably a compounding issue. Also make sure you are getting enough sodium, potassium and magnesium. I know of many women athletes who have straightened out both hormonal and weight issues with LCHF diet.

Have you considered focusing more on the 1500 and 800? I gained 20 lbs of muscle in my 20s and while my 5K suffered, my times below 1500 got faster (1500 stayed the same).

Your boobs are denser than normal? Tell me more. Lol. JK. You should talk to some sport scientists or sports doctors.

FWIW I coached a woman marathoner who was DD from 3:10 to 2:50 FTW in one year. She didn't have hormonal or weight fluctuation issues to my knowledge though (she was age 29)

puerto ricans or?

EPIC 11/10 TROLL!!!!

where are all these ~130# DD runners @ wrote:

puerto ricans or?

American with Mediterranean ethnic background. Never seen any runner as good with the same "configuration". With a reduction she would have been at least ten minutes faster IMO.

Fatbutnot? wrote:

So what do I do? I track my calories and eat 1500-1800 a day. I am increasing mileage and will continue to do so. I eat 8-12 servings of veggies and a piece of fruit, lean meats, no desserts. Do I just trust the process and be patient? Do I drop to 1200-1500 calories? I weight lift 2x a week, I could go 3-4x.

I'm obsessed about performance, and I just want to do all the little things right. Do I try to get to 15% body fat?

* Yes, try dropping 300 calories a day or 2100 per week. This will allow you to lose 0.6 lbs/week, which shouldn't be too stressful.

* Increase your mileage by 21 per week, which will save you another 2100 calories per week, which will allow you to lose another 0.6 lbs/week, for a total of 1.2 lbs/week. So after 10, weeks, you'll be down 12 lbs to 121 lbs.

* Stop weight lifting for the upper body if your event is longer than the 1500m. The extra arm weight will slow you down if you are a 5k or 10 k runner.

* "8-12 servings of veggies and a piece of fruit" seems like too many veggies and not enough fruit.