Why so concerned with retirement?

Are you a runner? I don't know how any runner who puts in miles who can get away with only spending 110.00 a year on clothes. Shoes alone will kill that budget.

Also, health fund 200 dollars....what exactly is this? Are you in the US? Do you have health insurance?

It looks like your net income is 22k, not your real income. You've been a bit misleading.

No phone or internet...how are you posting this?

Business trek wrote:

Why are people so concerned with this one short span of their lives that they will sacrifice their youth to it's benefit?

A recent poster had 1.3 million and most advised him to keep stressing and pushing.

Have you guys lost all perspective? People would rather slave away for 45 years in a job they only mildly like or hate so they can be a comfortable old person.

Enjoy your resources while young! Find something you love! It's so silly. If I reframed the question and said "would you prefer to start life as a frugal old man for 15 years so you could live passionately for 45 as a young person or live 15 years as. Comfortable rich bugger and then the next 45 hoarding away money and working in a job that made economic sense" what would you pick?

I hope your genitals fall off.

You are correct! Saving money opens up a lot of doors for you; part-time work or a job you really want that pays little. I know a guy who was an engineer and hated it. At age 38 he had saved enough money that he went back to school and became a teacher. I know another guy who was a big wig at an insurance company, but he hated the culture and so he saved and invested a huge portion of his income so that he and his wife retired at age 53. No part time job for them either...just flat out retired.

business trek wrote:

I've found my way. I feel it is a good balance.

Society is just conditioned a certain way in the US to believe we need to work a certain amount and save a certain amount and buy certain things.

I have aligned myself with a lifestyle and mindset that I believe will lead to an engaging and happy life and is more akin to lifestyles in other countries where people are happier.

Are you evading the question about the purpose of our existence? You made an earlier statement that we exist to travel, experience culture, and meet people. In the above post, you seem to suggest that engagement and happiness are the ultimate goods. Is that a fair representation of your position? I don't want to misrepresent what you're claiming. Is this really what you mean?

What if, hypothetically, you are wrong on the reason for our existence? What if there's a bigger picture that far outweighs mere enjoyment and happiness? And how do you define happiness? Is it mere enjoyment of a given moment? What if you are meant for something more and greater than enjoyment?

Could it be that "retirement vs. enjoying life" is not only a false dichotomy, but is actually asking the wrong question to begin with?

And if there is a greater purpose than mere enjoyment, shouldn't someone who loves "ongoing learning, exploring, other cultures" be willing to seriously explore these questions?

[quote]Business trek wrote:

Why are people so concerned with this one short span of their lives that they will sacrifice their youth to it's benefit? [quote]

You are making so many assumptions with this question. Did you happen to grow up in a middle class family because they breed thinkers like you. You probably think 1 million is a lot of money.

Why are you making the assumption that saving money means you have to sacrifice? This must be something your parents taught you. If you grew up in a rich family they would have told you how to properly think about money.

Second, why are you assuming saving money is the only way to wealth? I agree that people who push saving tons of money and working hard to make money are misguided. Saving money is only part of building wealth. The second part is making investments, and if you think that means buying mutual funds, or stocks on wall street, again, you are misguided.

Building real wealth is fun, easy, and you don't need money to do it. You need to start thinking about money differently and stop valuing it so much. People who build real wealth value time not money. You need to build assets that you can later sell. It's not hard, what is hard is changing what your poor parents taught you.

So please next time you post on here try not to show your ignorance so much, and stop making so many assumptions.

I stick running in the misc. category. I run among other things but own a bunch of shoes from a previous job at a running shoe store so don't spend anything there.Yes health fund is insurance and emergency fund.My gross is almost net - you probably make a much higher income but at "poverty" incomes you effectively have no tax.I use city/ library etc for internet. Also mooch off a roommate in return for her borrowing my bike and gardening tools.

A bit skeptical... wrote:

Are you a runner? I don't know how any runner who puts in miles who can get away with only spending 110.00 a year on clothes. Shoes alone will kill that budget.

Also, health fund 200 dollars....what exactly is this? Are you in the US? Do you have health insurance?

It looks like your net income is 22k, not your real income. You've been a bit misleading.

No phone or internet...how are you posting this?

The keyword from above that sums up you and your existence:mooch

This helps with my point:Your engineering friend thought it better to do something he hates for 15 years then do something he loves for 25 years then be bored and rich for 15 years.Why not cut out the middle man and just do something you love for life. Period.Also your 53 year old friend elected to do something he hated for 30 years then retire and try and make up for that lost time. Sure he doesn't have to work part time but I would rather spend my life doing things I love and keeping actively engaged and contributing then doing something I dislike for a long time then nothing at all.The concept of retirement is silly but sadly perpetuated by the government, banks and wall street who all heavily benefit from it. Since this board contains a lot of older 9-5ers I expect to receive backlash for thinking differently.

Share would be a better word. Community is another one.

Charlie wrote:

Business trek wrote:

I stick running in the misc. category. I run among other things but own a bunch of shoes from a previous job at a running shoe store so don't spend anything there.

Yes health fund is insurance and emergency fund.

My gross is almost net - you probably make a much higher income but at "poverty" incomes you effectively have no tax.

I use city/ library etc for internet. Also mooch off a roommate in return for her borrowing my bike and gardening tools.

The keyword from above that sums up you and your existence:mooch

Business trek wrote:

Share would be a better word. Community is another one.

Why are sharing and community good things to pursue? Where did that idea come from? I am not trying to be cute. I agree with you that they are good things, bit I am curious why you reached that conclusion.

After all, in your first post, you said, "enjoy your resources while young". What if sharing my resources with my community prevents me from enjoying them? After all, if I share my food with you, I can no longer enjoy that food.

What if sharing with my community means I have less money to travel? Which of those two is a greater good? And yes, sharing with my community also means I'll have less to save for retirement.

What if sharing and community reduce my enjoyment of life? Which do I choose, and why?

Cute sentiment OP but that is the exact opposite of what the average American need to hear right now. Most Americans are on track to retire broke and dependent on their families (if they have them) and the government. Younger generations will be guilted into saving their a$$es.

False dichotomies are false.

I used to think like the OP, then I turned 23.

Life is hard, finances are hard. The prospect of facing old age in poverty is absolutely terrifying. Therefore, I save like a squirrel.

I fall in the flagpole camp. Work at all costs, sacrifice, and save like the devil. Friends, family and fun can wait intil retirement.

Wouldn't travelling and experiencing other cultures be way easier if you retired? How often do you actually go on vacation? Two weeks a year? Versus retiring and being able to afford to do it all the time.

Someone on this thread I bet a wealthy 75 year old would trade places with a younger man. That may be true to a certain degree but I can assure you would not want to trade places with one of my grandmother's friends who is 84, didn't save anything, was terrible with money and only has social security to live off of. His kids actually died before him (really sad) and he is quite scared / lonely.

These are two pretty extreme examples but everyone's career has a shelf life so you need to plan and saving is so much more powerful when you are a younger. If you live like a miser in your 20s it can pay huge dividends later. Also being 70 and just doing whatever the heck you want sounds pretty incredible.

Lastly think of it this way. If you save 10 - 20% of your income every year you could be rich by retirement. I doubt your lifestyle really changes all that much on the last 10% so for intents and purposes lets say you aren't going to be "rich" or living lavishly when you are in your 20s. On a scale of 1 to 10 your happiness is a 5 and if you spent the last 10% of your income it would be a 6. Lets say you are millionaire or wealthy by the time you retire and your happiness jumps to 8. Would that be better than living your whole life as a 6? I would argue yes.

Conservatively I travel 6-8 weeks a year. On top of traveling more than I ever could if I just worked and did it when I was older I get to travel when I'm young AND see a nice cross section of cultures and people as they grow over time. I have friends in tons of different countries and regions. Something I would not have if I just took 2 weeks vacation with my full time job and waited until I was 60.

TAA wrote:

Wouldn't travelling and experiencing other cultures be way easier if you retired? How often do you actually go on vacation? Two weeks a year? Versus retiring and being able to afford to do it all the time.

No your lifestyle doesn't change at all on the last 10% but it does on the first 90!ie. getting a stock standard 9-5 job so you can even afford that 10-20% in the first place is what I'm referring to. How about live your whole life as an 8 and the last 15 years as a 6 instead of your whole life as a 6 and the last 15 as a 7

I am materially happier when I live in a nice house / apartment and for better or worse you need to have a job to get decent health insurance. Also my family has no money so need to work to eat and live.