Running With The Buffaloes gave great insight into the training of the 1998 Colorado team, but what are they doing now that is different?
The only thing I have heard is that they don't do their long runs as hard, rather focusing on just getting in a long run at altitude for their aerobic system, not necessarily hard on their legs.
Wetmore has said his formula is constantly changing, so what is it these days? Obviously they put in mileage, but what is the philosophy on workouts and intensities?
I don't know for certain as I don't have any current or recent connections to the team, but from everything I've heard, even if some details change, the focus is always on long term development through years of moderately high mileage, long runs, tempos, and lots of base throughout the year. Some teams are doing mile repeats and stuff like that in early September. I seriously doubt the CU guys are.
FWIW, I remember reading an interview with Ian Dobson back when he was with Stanford, and he said the key to his and Ryan Hall's success that year (the year they went 1-2 at Outdoor NCAAs and made the US team) was that they had not done ANY interval work during indoor track and had simply focused on base and threshold work, using only their races as speed workouts. It is my opinion that most programs focus WAY too much on speed and fail to emphasize long term development and solid periodization.
Guppy wrote:
FWIW, I remember reading an interview with Ian Dobson back when he was with Stanford, and he said the key to his and Ryan Hall's success that year (the year they went 1-2 at Outdoor NCAAs and made the US team) was that they had not done ANY interval work during indoor track and had simply focused on base and threshold work, using only their races as speed workouts. It is my opinion that most programs focus WAY too much on speed and fail to emphasize long term development and solid periodization.
Agreed. Note Cal does lots of speed work and consistently does the worst job with the best recruits.
But I'd love to see a breakdown of workouts CU does over the course of a year, just to get an idea of how they transition into vo2 workouts/other speed.
Listen to Coach Mark Wetmore explain it here:
Talent
Confident
Self Directed
Coaching is the last few percent
Start in mid June until November 22
It takes 2-3 years to develop into a high level runner
Hard work
Relentless
Patient
The team environment is supportive and teammates build each other up with motivation and encouragement
puzzle wrote:
Listen to Coach Mark Wetmore explain it here:
http://www.flotrack.org/coverage/237926-The-Wetmore-Factor/video/365286-Wetmore-on-successful-xc-runners-and-keeping-a-high-levelTalent
Confident
Self Directed
Coaching is the last few percent
Start in mid June until November 22
It takes 2-3 years to develop into a high level runner
Hard work
Relentless
Patient
The team environment is supportive and teammates build each other up with motivation and encouragement
http://www.flotrack.org/speaker/1-Mark-Wetmore
There are a lot of programs with this combination that don't get the same results.
I'm starting to think that an advantage CU has is actually their inability to run fast all the time due to being at altitude. It's starting to seem like race pace really is not as important as a lot of coaches make it out to be, and that in fact having the ability to run at an LT heart rate is far more valuable than actual LT pace, etc. They can't really thrash their legs, only their cardiovascular and energy systems, which keeps them uninjured despite the large volume they are doing.
I completely agree with doo doo and guppy - and probably Wetmore - about training philosophy. I train at the same elevation as Boulder with a very base-heavy, speed-light program. (Rest assured any similarity between me and Buff stars ends there!)
But this was the case in the Goucher era (I've got that book on my shelf) so I, too wonder: what the heck are they doing now?
Compared to other current teams, and maybe more impressively, to an all-time CU roster, these guys are out of this world. I, too would love to see a day-by-day schedule, but I wonder if that would tell us much. There must be something in the water!
well it's also nice to have legit hs studs, sub 9 guys in Hurysz, Moussa, Morgan, Saarel, plus Winter's outrageous altitude times. Throw in some nice development from Theroux (could be Wetmore's finest coaching job if he keeps this up and gets top 10 at NCAA's) and Murphy. Just one of those teams lined up right
buffs the vampire slayers wrote:
well it's also nice to have legit hs studs, sub 9 guys in Hurysz, Moussa, Morgan, Saarel, plus Winter's outrageous altitude times. Throw in some nice development from Theroux (could be Wetmore's finest coaching job if he keeps this up and gets top 10 at NCAA's) and Murphy. Just one of those teams lined up right
Yes they were all good in high school, but there are other teams with over 5 sub 9 high schoolers that CU is smashing, even putting 6 in front of their 1.
So the formula would be: hard long runs+ lt runs such as fartleks and tempos+interval training about 90 days or so from peak race+ consistent training and development over the years= success
In RWTB they literally had like 3 guys survive the season 100% healthy. Even some of the guys at NCAAs were banged up.
I think Wetmore learned from that year that the workouts themselves were fine but you can't have these guys hammering everyone Sunday and Wednesday like he did. I would guess the mileage of those runs is the same but he has them running much more controlled as opposed to racing on Magnolia Road.
No one is finishing off 22 milers with sub 5:30 miles like Goucher did.
Positive Contribution wrote:
In RWTB they literally had like 3 guys survive the season 100% healthy. Even some of the guys at NCAAs were banged up.
I think Wetmore learned from that year that the workouts themselves were fine but you can't have these guys hammering everyone Sunday and Wednesday like he did. I would guess the mileage of those runs is the same but he has them running much more controlled as opposed to racing on Magnolia Road.
No one is finishing off 22 milers with sub 5:30 miles like Goucher did.
This is seemingly the biggest difference I have noticed as well. They are still doing two hard efforts a week, but have stopped hammering the other days, which leads to less injury and thus more consistency.
I saw some flotrack video a couple years ago where they were doing Magnolia road, but Wetmore was saying they were just going up there and "bopping along" at 8,000 ft.
puzzle wrote:
Talent
Confident
Self Directed
Coaching is the last few percent
Start in mid June until November 22
It takes 2-3 years to develop into a high level runner
Hard work
Relentless
Patient
The team environment is supportive and teammates build each other up with motivation and encouragement
Altitude
It's a small difference for most athletes, but when a 2% improvement is equal to 30 seconds in a 10K, that difference is suddenly massive.
Put Wetmore at sea-level and he wouldn't have the same results. He's smart enough to know that, though.
Wasn't he just as successful at Fairleigh Dickinson?
Seton Hall.
They are finally listening to Jay Johnson.
Wetmore has said he would rather take boulder's training venues at sea level than altitude.
Uh no wrote:
Wetmore has said he would rather take boulder's training venues at sea level than altitude.
Disinformation or misinformation propaganda, but propaganda either way!
Two things I want to know is if they still foster a xenophobic mindset? Do they still strive to look like skeletons with condoms on their heads?
Goucher was always hungry to devour Kenyans.
Looks the guys eat nowdays so thats different.
In RWTB from what I could gather the summer prior to school starting was a base of 85 miles a week over a period of a few months. When the runners returned to school the 98 days leading up to nationals consisted of 4 hard days a week, one of which was a long run that made up 20% of the week's total miles. The other three hard days were things like milers, hard 10 mile runs, or fast long intervals on the cross country course. The difference today may be in the overall density of the training. The long run may be a little less intense. The intervals and fast tempos also a little less intense. In RWTB I was amazed at the number of hard days they ran. You have to be a serious runner to compete on the Colorado team. I hope they win Nationals again this season.