FRUITARIAN DIET WILL TRANSFORM YOUR RUNNING!!! According to an excellent runner. Must read.

Really, beyond your pretend use of jargon, you are not saying anything, assuming you mean:

EAA = Essential Amino Acids

BCAA = Branch-chained Amino acid.

Rice and beans is fine for this criteria. If you are going to say I'm wrong, you better say why. (eg. Why is it low quality? What is your criteria of quality? I'm not saying you don't potentially have a point, but you have not raised it--I'm not going to do your own argument for you)

Otherwise, you are not engaging in argument. You are just saying someone is "wrong" without contributing anything to the discussion. Interesting how you are quiet about everything else now. haha

Also, you don't give any support for your idea that rice and beans would not provide enough raw total protein (grams). So, Einstein, how much protein do athletes need per day or per week, for a particular weight? And what scientific support do you have for that quota? In my experience, there are a lot of people, even some serious athletes, who accept at face value our culturally-ingrained notions that we need (vaguely) "a lot" of protein.

My ultimate point is that you simply cannot decide what amount of protein (in total amount) is a good amount without adequate scientific studies supporting high protein intake and also studies examining levels of protein intake lower than what most Americans think is necessary (lower protein intake schedules).

I know of a decent amount of studies that suggest that excessive protein intake is not a good thing--excess protein is not utilized well. Either the body converts it to sugars or fats or the body has to deal with it as a waste product, and the excess protein is difficult on the system, if not outright toxic (and there are studies which directly support the notion that excess protein--in particular animal protein, and most particularly, casein protein from dairy--is, in fact toxic to the body and associated with dramatically higher cancer rates and other health problems and even death, as compared to dramatically lower protein-intake schedules). In both those cases, that excess protein is not resulting in any athletic benefit along the perceived and intended lines.

Then, you have to consider that the benefits from even what little protein you might be getting, say from meat, that isn't excreted or turned into fat, well, those benefits are subject to how well the digestive system can process (I'm not sure if it is 100% catabolic, or if it is catabolic but then compounds are added, etc afterwards) and absorp said protein. Going heavy on the meat and protein powder at the expense of fresh vegetables may backfire for precisely the reason of messing up your digestive system.

In the end, the choice is yours, but if you want to deplete your digestive compounds and enzymes, run the risk of gallstones, ulcers, and all numbers of other digestive system ailments, and, to boot, not even absorb nutrients from that meat very well (I have heard stories of heavy meat eaters who had severe iron-deficiencies, not because their meat lacked iron, but because their body was not absorbing it, due to such a crappy diet destroying their digestive absorptive capacities),

then by all means, take a chance.

(As for the golden number of raw protein intake: I myself do not, of course, have the definitive answer on what amount of protein, in total amount and as a percentage of calories, from any source, is an optimal amount for a particular person and weight, and I think, even when I am finished examining the scientific literature on the subject, there will still be questions and room for more research.)

lol did you seriously just imply that protein will turn into fat?

You realize that proteins would have to be turned into carbohydrates (you know, the stuff that comprises 80% of your mythical diet) and then in turn become fat via de novo lipogenesis... which is practically impossible under normal dietary circumstances.

Christ, please take a basic nutritional science class. This is just sad, kid.

striving for it wrote:

LOL just gotta laugh at this post. I have been eating a high fruit, not fruitarian, high carb low fat low protein low sodium vegan diet now for 3 years and i am in the best shape of my life.

Trust me, you get all of your nutrients as long as you eat enough. that includes greens which many skimp on and then say "OH this diet doesnt work"...no shit, you werent getting your minerals. 1-2 heads of greens for me per day, 4000 calories, 4+ quarts of water per day, and 10 hours of sleep per day. I have never felt so energetic and healthy

This is the same guy who a couple years ago said not to eat any vegetables, only fruit, and thinks his 37 minute 10k is world class - delusional.

lulz wrote:

lol did you seriously just imply that protein will turn into fat?

You realize that proteins would have to be turned into carbohydrates (you know, the stuff that comprises 80% of your mythical diet) and then in turn become fat via de novo lipogenesis... which is practically impossible under normal dietary circumstances.

Christ, please take a basic nutritional science class. This is just sad, kid.

If you are such a genius when it comes to human organic chemistry, how come you can't respond to anything else I've mentioned? The most you can do is pick on trivial details. Apparently, you haven't learned at any point in your life, much less your basic Nutrition and Biology classes, much less advanced ones, that plant foods can cover your essential amino acids. You also don't seem to know that there are some plant seeds and nuts that contain Omega fatty acids! That's just sad, kid. Gawd.

In response to your contention, I'll admit I'm not an expert on protein metabolism in the body. But last time I checked, after digestion, amino acids get metabolized in the liver, and some products do end up as sugar molecules or fat molecules. Your statement of it being "impossible" is ridiculous.

i remember wrote:

striving for it wrote:

LOL just gotta laugh at this post. I have been eating a high fruit, not fruitarian, high carb low fat low protein low sodium vegan diet now for 3 years and i am in the best shape of my life.

Trust me, you get all of your nutrients as long as you eat enough. that includes greens which many skimp on and then say "OH this diet doesnt work"...no shit, you werent getting your minerals. 1-2 heads of greens for me per day, 4000 calories, 4+ quarts of water per day, and 10 hours of sleep per day. I have never felt so energetic and healthy

This is the same guy who a couple years ago said not to eat any vegetables, only fruit, and thinks his 37 minute 10k is world class - delusional.

First of all, it's not very respectful to call someone delusional.

Second of all, are you referring to the poster or to the titular athlete of the thread?

As for the poster you are responding to, this person is advocating a very reasonable and scientifically supported diet. What he did in the past does not necessarily matter (e.g. whether they were too heavy on fruits in the past). You are being mean and I doubt anyone with a 37m 10k is bragging on Letsrun about it, so you are surely engaging in hyperbole. The person is giving, apparently, a relative testimony, and, aside from their openness which you shouldn't attack, there is no reason to doubt that such benefits would transfer over to well established elites near their performance ceiling, since this diet is scientifically supported as being productive across the board.

ttc wrote:

Eclo wrote:

Actually, Arnstein is not even that good at ultras. He has a rating under 90% at UltraSignup.com, and has only one major ultra victory to his name. If you think 16th at Badwater is good or the fact that he loses to an elite woman at every race, then you need to adjust your standards. He can't even finish or line up at Western States.

He ranks **9th all-time for N.Americans** in the 100 mile distance (12h 57m). Yea, not many do ultras- but that's impressive. You'll prob reply only 5 good ultra runners in history.

He's run a 2:28 marathon.

How "awful".

He ran sub-13 once and then DNFs the majority of his big races because his diet is absurd and he can't get enough calories in to make it to the finish. He would be faster if he ate normally. And as posted before, 2:28 is very very far from elite.

Fun fact: The banana tree is an herb, but the banana is a fruit.

Kipketer_Pumpkin_Eater wrote:

I doubt anyone with a 37m 10k is bragging on Letsrun about it

Did you even check the video. Don't be a dodo.

That was durianrider, who has the webside 30 bananas a day. Yes he has bragged about "winning" 10k races in 37 minutes and eating ONLY fruit, nothing else. He disparaged people who ate anything else, even vegetables. Check out his other videos on youtube if you're skeptical, but meanwhile stop bleating in ignorance.

lulz wrote:

Rice and beans doesn't, actually. The protein quality for rice & beans alone is horrible,

Beans as a main source of proteins work well for the Kenyan runners.

We have to take him at his word. Otherwise who says he eats only fruit; maybe when no one is around he cooks up some nice juicy steaks or sneaks a hamburger. We're not going to get a study on this or even a handful of other people trying it. I have a feeling he is telling the truth though; what purpose would lying about supplementation serve.

i remember wrote:

Kipketer_Pumpkin_Eater wrote:

I doubt anyone with a 37m 10k is bragging on Letsrun about it

Did you even check the video. Don't be a dodo.

That was durianrider, who has the webside 30 bananas a day. Yes he has bragged about "winning" 10k races in 37 minutes and eating ONLY fruit, nothing else. He disparaged people who ate anything else, even vegetables. Check out his other videos on youtube if you're skeptical, but meanwhile stop bleating in ignorance.

Why don't YOU, MEANWHILE, quit BEING AN A**HOLE. If you have eyes, you could have seen that I asked in that same post to clarify to whom you were referring--the poster or the athlete.

yogibear wrote:

Fun fact: The banana tree is an herb, but the banana is a fruit.

I've been surprised by how many species of fruit and vegetable producing plants have edible leaves and such.

billy babbit wrote:

I'm curious to hear what you think, xfit guy.

Alright, here we go:

A diet without meat, fish or eggs is not just STUPID, it is outright dangerous and selfish towards societies where the community takes on the healthcare costs (hello Obamacare).

Why?

Because you will not be able to get enough:

- protein*

- vitamin D*

- EPA/DHA*

- saturated fat

- Vit B12*

Also, you will load up your body with toxins in

- grains

- beans

(* supplements to fight the deficiencies in the above mentioned are made from animal sources)

mako wrote:

Beans as a main source of proteins work well for the Kenyan runners.

Lol, have you seen those Kenyan runners? Extremely frail. You certainly don't want to look like one of them...

Virginia Runner wrote:

We have to take him at his word. Otherwise who says he eats only fruit; maybe when no one is around he cooks up some nice juicy steaks or sneaks a hamburger. We're not going to get a study on this or even a handful of other people trying it. I have a feeling he is telling the truth though; what purpose would lying about supplementation serve.

Why do we have to take him at his word when what he says is contrary to all scientific evidence and he has provided no proof?

He likely supplements with large amounts of proteins; likely through powders like pea protein or soy protein and lots of vitamin/mineral combinations. His diet is not tenable long term without heavy supplementation. I wouldn't be surprised if he is on TRT or thyroid replacement either.

mako wrote:

Beans as a main source of proteins work well for the Kenyan runners.

Is this supposed to be a good thing? Men under 130-140lbs?

Plus, the top guys generally have some form of meat. The problem is if you exclude meat entirely, you need a very large amount of protein from rice/beans (much more than you will get in this fruitarian diet) because the protein quality is so low. When you have very low protein (10%), it needs to be from very high quality sources (hell, probably direct BCAA and EAA supplementation) for there to not be substantial issues.

Apples contain iron if you eat 150 a day as well as the 30 bananas you are good

Kipketer_Pumpkin_Eater wrote:

If you are such a genius when it comes to human organic chemistry, how come you can't respond to anything else I've mentioned? The most you can do is pick on trivial details. Apparently, you haven't learned at any point in your life, much less your basic Nutrition and Biology classes, much less advanced ones, that plant foods can cover your essential amino acids. You also don't seem to know that there are some plant seeds and nuts that contain Omega fatty acids! That's just sad, kid. Gawd.

In response to your contention, I'll admit I'm not an expert on protein metabolism in the body. But last time I checked, after digestion, amino acids get metabolized in the liver, and some products do end up as sugar molecules or fat molecules. Your statement of it being "impossible" is ridiculous.

I'm letting you use your words to wrap a noose around your frail neck. Every post makes you sound dumber and dumber, so hopefully people don't take this insane advice.

Nowhere have I said you need meat. Unfortunately for you, if you were to eat 80/10/10 as claimed, there would be no way for you to be eating many nuts (which are often predominantly fat and protein) nor beans, which aren't even fvcking fruits.

Vegetarianism is stupid as it is, but what you are talking about is many steps beyond that.