After Mo's 3:28.81, what is the ideal tactic to beat him at 5K/10K?

Doping.

you mean nancy kerrigan, right?

Hear me out bro wrote:

The way to beat him is for someone to Tonya Harding his a5s

Take enough dope to make your head explode, and then as an insurance policy, pay someone to abduct him the night before the race and keep him in a cabin in the Black Forest of Bavaria until the WCs have ended. Or at least keep him on house arrest while the races take place

Borrow a certain picture from Meseret Defar and tape it to your chest.

Work as a team, run a 55 first lap just to open up a gap between the leaders, then run a string of 62s, which would force Mo to work to catch up. Once he does catch up, let the pace lag for a lap or two, wait for him to go back to mid pack and run a 55-57 to open up a gap and then run 62s to hold off Mo until it is time for the final lap. At that point, Mo will be gapped with a lap to go and someone like Gebrihwet or Alamirew can sprint away for the win

the waterboy your reading my mind! Lol

killarney wrote:

[Keyword HAS. Past tense. Gebremeskel and a couple others could outrun him in a time trial.

HAS is the present tense of the infinitive to have. HAD would be the preterite or past participle of the infinitive to have depending on how had is used.

Also only person with a chance to beat Farah is Alamirew.

Why would Salazar be showcasing Mo's closing speed so much if Mo's not in shape to run a fast time (or if he's using banned substances)? That would be suicide. I think he's encouraging the East Africans to make a fast pace for Mo so that there's a small pack going into the bell. A small pack means less chance that Mo gets boxed in or tripped, and a higher likelihood that the strongest athlete will win. I think Salazar knows that Mo is the strongest athlete in both events and can kick off a fast pace better than anyone else.

Teammate #1 goes hard from 600m out. Farah covers. Teammate #2 goes hard from 300m out. Farah covers. Strongest teammate hangs back a bit and kicks him down in the final 100m. Might work.

Joe Dirt wrote:

Teammate #1 goes hard from 600m out. Farah covers. Teammate #2 goes hard from 300m out. Farah covers. Strongest teammate hangs back a bit and kicks him down in the final 100m. Might work.

Who do you see being able to do this?

I think the only way at this point would be for someone to run a gutsy race, take it from the start, and try to gap him enough that his kick can't cover the distance. And even still, this would be a huge gamble, and likely to fail 9 out of 10. The fellow would have to have ideal conditions and run the race of his life.

killarney wrote:

[Keyword HAS. Past tense. Gebremeskel and a couple others could outrun him in a time trial.

Farah just ran a 3:28 1500m time trial, and he's better in the 5k than the 1500m. What makes you think these guys could time trail away from him?

The most likely tactic is going to be to bump Farah around, or worse.

I don’t think a fast pace strategy will ever work against Farah given his overall aerobic strength. If one studies the 2000 1500m Sydney finals and 2004 5000 Athens finals you will see the one who sits and waits favors the kicker and not necessarily the one with the strongest aerobic capacity. In the 2000 Olympic finals, El G was outkicked by Noah Ngeny in the final 100m after taking out the first 800m in 1:54, then holding a steady pace. Four years later, El G learned his lesson in Athens and did absolutely no work during the 5000m final waiting for the last 200m. In the 5Km Athens final, I think the first 1Km was at a pedestrian 3min. which was a huge mistake by K. Bekele, allowing El G to settle in for the final kick. If anyone is capable of finishing the last 300m (40s or faster) in the field off a sub 13:10 pace, you would think sitting on Farah’s shoulder during the entire finals is the best strategy while someone else leads / alternates at a moderate pace.

I doubt anyone will beat Mo Farah in the 10000m final as he is too strong. One could always hope Farah gets an adrenaline rush and hammers his final 400m in the 10000m final and is tired going into the 5000m prelimins. This is the same mistake Bekele made in the Athens 10000m final finishing the last 400m in 53 sec which probably costs him the double gold.

Hagos is training hard to repeat what he did to Rupp in the Boston indoor, a sudden surge.I have seen them train in Addis Ababa recently, and thier training is geared for a sudden attack, with 6-8 60second laps in a raw.

Best tactic? Raid his medicine cabinet.

Short of that, run away from him 3/4 of the way into the race. Or 1K in. Obviously these strategies require at least equal fitness, and maybe complicit teammates.

NOP Follower wrote:

We've seen that he has the best last lap in the world right now, so leaving it until the last 400-600 won't work. If his competition tries to go with 1600-2000 to go, it's doubtful that they can outrun a 3:28. Surging throughout the race doesn't seem to work either, as Mo usually runs in the middle to back of the pack in championship races to avoid going with those surges. It seems like the only tactic left is to go fast from the gun, but it seems like that wouldn't work considering Mo has pretty fast times across the board. Anyone have any input?

I agree that going from 1600-2000m out isn't likely to break Farah, as he has the strength to increase the pace as the laps wind down - if someone pushes, he won't lead, but he will be able to latch on and then take control and have the finish to beat them. He ran the last 2000m in the Olympics in under 5min. He did move up slowly but steadily from the middle of the pack, even as the pace suddenly dropped (3km was 842-high, and after a 246 3rd km, they suddenly dropped to 233 for the 4th) And he actually took the lead for the first time inside 2 laps to go and dictated the pace from there - the 3rd and 2nd to last laps were both 61s, then his finish. The thing about his finish was that he didn't even show a real change of gears - it was strength. His last lap was 52.94, and it looked like it was pretty evenly split, 26.x for each 200m. He may have pulled away in the home stretch, but to me it didn't look like he found an extra gear - he just outlasted everyone. Everyone knows about Farah's kick, but does he have a real change of gears in the last straight? Has he shown it? Even in Monaco, when he passed Ndiku halfway down the homestraight, was it really a change of gears? Or strength that let him sustain his speed?

The OP said that Farah isn't troubled by surges. I think that is because nobody has seriously tried to disrupt his rhythm. At Pre, they slowed down in the 3rd and 4th km, building to a finish. There wasn't much surging - everyone was preparing to battle it out over the final km, and that simply hasn't worked most of the time. I think surges are the key. What about a Daniel Komen-like surge? The 1997 WC 5000m was amazing, watching him run a 2-lap surge starting from 4 laps out (155ish, a 57.x and 57-high/low 58, which came after the pace really picked up in the 200m before - he was not leading with 4 laps to go, he passed his teammate on the curve.) It broke the field wide open, and he didn't need to finish with a strong last lap. I forget the splits for the last 2 laps, but I think the finishing time was a little outside 1310.

I don't think there is anyone out there now who can pull off a Komen. But maybe if the Kenyans or the Ethiopians really work as a team, they can use that tactic to beat Farah. Send someone out on an extended surge with a mile to go - Farah is usually still back in the pack stalking a that point, so a surge steals quite a bit of ground and leaves a little bit more work for Farah to do. I don't think anyone would just let someone build a big lead with 4 laps to go - Farah would 9presumably) have to respond, and the rest of the pack could follow him, make him do the work of chasing the break down (unless of course one of the other rival competitors takes it upon themselves to go after the break, and pull Farah along.) This surge would have to be sustained for more than a lap, at least - the longer the better. When Farah bridges the gap, presumably dragging some competitors with him, he would want to slow the pace, but here is where the team tactics will come into play - someone else would have to take up the pace, and push some more. This means that a couple of teammates would have to sacrifice their races to try and beat Farah, and run the risk of playing into their competitors hands.

The timing of the surge is key - make Farah work harder than he wants to from further out than he wants to, and then keep the pressure on. If this is done with 4 laps to go, it is early enough to maybe take Farah out of his rhythm. The key is to follow this up, keep the pressure on. Soi beat Farah at Pre even though Farah was able to run usual his race tactics - this isn't going to work with a healthy, 328ish Farah. But the 328 was done following Kiprop - I don't think even Farah would be able to cover a huge surge, and additional pressure, and then still be able to sustain a finish. Anyone think that real team tactics could work? Very iffy, a lot of variables. But really, I don't see any one person being able to take Farah on on their own right now.

Stupid post.

Farah has been beaten twice when he kicked too early. In the WC 10k in 2011 he was well ahead when Jeilan's magical kick, one of the best ever, caught him.

At Pre this year (when Farah might not have been at full health) he kicked from 300. Soi was more patient, kicked from 200 and won easily.

It seems this is the only tactic to beat him. You must make him kick too early. Give him the lead and the rail from 800. Then bait him by attempting to pass at 600, 500 and 400. He will hold his ground to avoid being boxed and might kick too early. This will require an honest pace of 12:10 or less at the bell.