Steve Jones Winter Training.

Somebody must have something to add?

Have a look at this (scroll down past the Chicago diary), but I don't know how accurate it is as, if I remember rightly, Noakes' Lore of Running reported something different (which equally may be inaccurate).

http://www.runnerslife.co.uk/latest-news/steve-jones-training-diary-leading-to-chicago-marathon

The Noakes book has a table that puts him at 135-180 km for what looks like a typical week. The Michael Sandrock book "Running With Legends" has a training week of about 85 miles, though I'm having to guess on wu time, cd time, recovery between intervals, etc., so the mileage is pretty close from both of these tables. Under 100.

Lorenzo the Magnificent wrote:

The Noakes book has a table that puts him at 135-180 km for what looks like a typical week. The Michael Sandrock book "Running With Legends" has a training week of about 85 miles, though I'm having to guess on wu time, cd time, recovery between intervals, etc., so the mileage is pretty close from both of these tables. Under 100.

Sandrock describes his final weeks leading up to one marathon.

I asked Jonesy once to comment on Sandrocks published account, and was it typical of his training? He said "no". I asked how much he typiclly ran during training. He said "100". I asked "80, 90, 110, 120?" Jones emphatically said "100. I think I ran 115 once, but my training weeks were 1000 miles"

I then told him I wanted to repeat what he said, which was fine with him. Jones ran 100 miles per week. FTHM

The Noakes version was taken from the same leadup to Chicago article, which he changed to kilometers.

Jones stated in the original interview that he always trained the same way, including 45 second reps up a hill in the winters, with a jog back down to the bottom, which sounds like the hill version of the 16x 1 minute reps.

Cheers for the info.

The link puts his winter training week at:

Mon - Am - 10miles @ 5min milling / Pm - 12miles @ 5min miling

Tues - Am - 4x5mins Hard / Pm - 10miles

Wed - Am – Race

Thur - Am - 10x2min Hills / Pm - 10miles

Fri - Am - 8miles / Pm - 10miles

Sat - Am - Race or 16x1min

Sun - Am - 20miles @ 6min milling

whereas Noakes (I forgot he was in there) reports it as:

Mon: 7-10m @ 5m/m / 6-10m

Tues: 7m incl 4 x 5:00 hard / XC or track race

Wed: 7m / 6-10m

Thurs: Hills (10 reps) / 5-13m

Fri: 6-7m / Race or track session (16 x 1:00 or 10 x 2:00 or 16-24 x 0:45)

Sat: ?

Sun: 15-20m @ 6m/m / 12m @ 5m/m

I suspect that Noakes has made some transcription errors.

malmo - do you happen to know what his typical weekly structure was over winter, and if, as J.R. has said, the original interview stating that he always trained the same way was accurate?

I've had a look at the Sandrock chapter on Jones in Running with the Legends, and though malmo has said, FTHM, that the listed typical week was not a typical week, there was some info earlier that does back up what malmo has reported (again FTHM) about the 100 mile weeks.

Page 256 says that he 'spent the winter of 1984-1985 repairing fighter planes at St. Athans RAF Base and rebuilding his base, putting in 100-mile weeks in difficult conditions along the Welsh coast'.

Unfortunately it doesn't go into any further detail on the structure of his winter training, though later on it makes reference to him doing 3 quality sessions a week, with two of them being 1:30 runs during which he done his fartlek sessions. Again though, it doesn't explicitly state whether this is winter or summer.

malmo, is it possible/probable that he did some form of periodization whilst retaining the same training structure throughout the year; i.e. just changing the emphasis depending on which race he was targeting? Similar to De Castella's logic (amongst others) in essence?

4x5mins Hard. 16x1min.16 x 1:00 or 10 x 2:00 or 16-24 x 0:45.

Recovery ? ? ?

From the links I've seen the recoveries appear to be:

4 x 5mins hard (90s)

16 x 1min (1min)

10 x 2min (1min)

Can't find the recovery for the 16-24 x 0:45 at the moment.

bump in the hope that malmo will see it/has some more info (please)? :)

Welsh Iron wrote:

bump in the hope that malmo will see it/has some more info (please)? :)

No I don't have more info. But if you want me to ask specific questions about his typical training, or how he phased it over the course of a year, I'll try to corner him in August for you and get the answers -- all FTHM.

Sounds like a plan?

That would be awesome malmo, cheers :)

And yes, you've nailed pretty much what I was looking for - a rough idea of his typical training structure at various times of the year (and it's purpose) and how he phased it over the course of a year.

It would also be good to understand how he worked up to be able to absorb that kind of training (I presume even somebody as reputedly hard as he didn't jump straight into that kind of mileage at that kind of effort).

Wasn't he also supposed to be writing an autobiography btw? Given the scarcity of accurate information on his training, added to his reputation, it would surely sell very well!

My email address is linked if you'd rather reply there, but I'll bump the thread at some stage in August as well.

Thanks again :)

Remind me before Falmouth (August 11).

I will tell you the story when Paul Cummings visited Jonesy in Wales(?). Apparently, they went for a run together and Jones went out the door at 5 min pace. Ran down a road, then suddenly Jones stops and climbs a fence into a pasture where he resumed 5 minute pace. I'll get Jones to confirm.

I'm hanging out with him here at Peachtree with Reebok. His training cannot be replicated.

Will do malmo, and stories like that are why he's a legend - I think my legs would explode if I tried to run fast right out the door :)

Csis - not trying to replicate, but who's to say we can't learn from it? :)

Steve was comfortable at 5:00-30 pace day in day out , its just what he ran , vs the higher miles. He has stated more than once he was runner not a marathoner.

Yes he did run through plowed fields but not as a sudden whim , it was part of his run . He would often when living in Wales join his club mates for their track workouts. His intensity was just easy for him , others would call it pounding it out , he would call it just running.

Not sure what you can learn from it. I mean you can't replicate it because of his environment and state of mind. Steve ran on feel, he ran hard, day in and day out. Hard to replicate because of the high level of intensity and density of volume, at the same time, which is not advised anymore, unless you are a Canova athlete. Another caveat, he worked hard in wind, massive, miserable winds back home... much akin to constant fartlek training.

One of my favorite videos of all-time is when he goes from the gun and drops the rabbit at Chicago with a 9:00/2 mile split. Amazing display of running off of feel.

Csls, you could ask the same question about anybody's training on that basis surely? I mean why look at what Canova's athletes do unless you're going to go live at altitude in Kenya. Similar for Lydiard and so on and so on.

As you intimate there is too much caution applied to training nowadays, so what's the harm in seeing how somebody who applied less caution approached it?

I feel there is always something you can learn from what others have done, plus Steve Jones is one of my running heroes and I've always wanted to know how he trained :)

This is not atypical for Welsh training to do a high quality stuff. It was very common, Mick Morris trained in similar fashion in that he did not waste his time in training.Same with Kevin Glastonbury. Training ( ie chasing him) I ran my best stuff and never felt over trained and seemed to be able to recover quickly between workouts. Key is they listened to their bodies and how they were absorbing what they were doing. No heart rate monitor and blood lactate kits. Stress, rest recover and race.