breaking 17 minutes in the 5k

I'll beat everyone to the punch. I'm assuming you're a High schooler.

-Run a lot this summer. Start with 30-45 minute runs, maybe a 60 minute long run. Gradually add time/miles

-Don't do speedwork on the track. Don't do speedwork for a while in fact. Start by doing a tempo run once a week, then add a fartlek mid-summer. Your coach will have plenty of speedwork for you.

-Find some good road races/fun runs instead of tempos/fartleks some weeks.

-mix up the running surfaces.

-pay attention to stretching, nutrition, and overall fitness.

I ran sub 18 a month after a 4:46 1500m. With a 4:40 1500m it's apparent that all you need is ENDURANCE.

Forget your absurd weekly schedule with 5 quality runs and only one easy day.

Max out at TWO workout days a week and start doubling up on easy days. You just need to run more at this point. Save the ridiculous amount of workouts for later (or never, because that's a bad plan to begin with).

[quote]Bdubs wrote:

"-Don't do speedwork on the track. Don't do speedwork for a while in fact. Start by doing a tempo run once a week, then add a fartlek mid-summer. Your coach will have plenty of speedwork for you."

That is interesting that you suggest I reduce speed work because based on other forms for a fast 5k time many runners suggest track workouts. And yes i am a sophomore by the way. What mpw would you suggest?

Young runners need to build strength...you have natural speed already; you need to build a big aerobic engine.

I'd start with whatever mileage you're currently at. A 12 week buildup could look like this:

25,30,33,30,35,38,42,35,45,48,50,40

Find trails, friends, dogs to run on/with.

Ride your bike, play basketball, swim, be an active teenager.

alright thanks for the advice everyone I'm now thinking for a weekly schedule:

-2 speed workouts (one track session, one tempo run)

-4 long runs

What intensity should the long runs be? easy-medium?

jeff5 wrote:

alright thanks for the advice everyone I'm now thinking for a weekly schedule:

-2 speed workouts (one track session, one tempo run)

-4 long runs

What intensity should the long runs be? easy-medium?

why are you so gung-ho on a track workout?

that should NOT be your focus over the summer.

you need STRENGTH and ENDURANCE.

Get over the track. sub 17 is nothing. don't go fry yourself running intervals on the track just to break 17. think long term. think sub 16, sub 15, etc. go run some friggin' miles.

Okay well as you suggested 2 quality workouts a week earlier, what should those workouts look like?

I also run track and am interested in my 1500 and 3000 meter times, so that is the purpose of the track workouts. I guess I'll talk to my coach about it though since you seem to think they aren't that important.

You can take this advice, or leave it, either way, it's all I'm giving out today.

Track workouts are important...just not in the summer.

If you ran 30 minutes easy, 4-5 days a week, and 60 minutes easy once a week (so basically no schedule), you would probably break 17 minutes within your first 3 races.

Finally, you're getting ready for xc, not track....so you should probably be training over multiple surfaces, finding hills, etc...

if you ask for help, be receptive and not stubborn.

If you do your 4 hard runs/week schedule you'll get tired, hurt, frustrated, or some combination of all three.

tempo (not 10k tempo, like marathon pace tempo)/progression/steady runs and fartleks.

Just about all you need. Maybe some sprints/strides a few times, too.

yeah, talk to your coach then. what's the point of coming on here? first you ask about a 5k, now get all snippety about doing 1500s and 3ks? whatever, bro.

and no, doing track workouts every week of the summer is NOT that important. 1500/3000/5000/10000 require STRENGTH and ENDURANCE, like I keep saying over and over again.

Listen to yuck yuck.

We're snarky because we're right.

Thank you guys so much for the reply. I can promise you that i was not trying to be snippety or stubborn i just clearly need some guidance for work over the summer, as i now realize how crazy and pointless my other schedules were. Thanks again for the advice sorry for the misunderstanding.

Hey there Jeff,

I can speak to you as someone whose experience closely resembles your own, to offer you advice, and things to look out for.

As a sophomore, I had my best season of cross-country/track in HS. I jumped from 5:13 (1600) and 17:45 (5K) to 4:55 and 17:10. What was the difference? That summer, I went on sites like LetsRun. I breathed in Lydiard, Daniels, Coe, Malmo, everything I possibly could muster - and went out and ran a good, solid summer base. More miles I'd ever run before. I was still young so my body absorbed the new stimulus and came out stronger than ever before. With that summer base, I was able to do tick off workouts, that fall and spring, like they were nothing - it was like being on a whole other stratosphere.

Takeaway: Build that summer base.

For the next two years I languished. I never ran faster than my sophomore year in HS because I suffered a stress fracture in my shin, along with various other little injuries. Forget the injury part. I believe the main reason why I never ran faster was that I plateaued. I expected that by continuing to do the same workouts my body would naturally continue to evolve. However, your body needs change.

Takeaway: Mix it up.

I finally broke 17 my freshman year of college. The next year I opened the season with a 16:48...then improved 30 seconds in the space of 3 weeks to a 16:18. What caused it? One, I had just done a few weeks of my highest mileage (w/ doubles). Two - I always had known I was in that kind of shape. It just took "That" race, for whatever reason, to break through.

Takeaway: Have faith, and mileage is truly king.

NOW.

I was, and always have been, like yourself. I'm an idealistic person. I love plotting out my plan of attack and thinking about how, eventually, my plan will make me a whole new breed of runner - a running god. I love seeing, "60 min easy," "12x400 w/ 1:30 recovery, "prog run" etc. on my weekly schedule.

And you know what, there is nothing wrong with that. You are young. I don't know that I could do that kind of thing now because I'm (at 22 years old) not as youthfully self-regenerative as I used to be; and if I could, I would take back some of my choices, when I pushed too hard; but I truly believe that you need that experience, to push you to that final, ultimate level of what you can achieve - that is, to your potential.

I would say, first and foremost

1.) Make mileage be your most important factor. But don't try and make a number happen. Just remember, the less you pay attention to it, the more you'll be able to look back, a week after the fact, and think, "Damn! I ran that much without even thinking about it!" How easy is that?

2.) Go ahead and do a track workout if you feel like it. The most important thing about summer training is that it should be FUN. Building up a fun base that keeps you spry and excited, ready for the fall competition, is just as important as building up a base. Run the track workouts (by the way, they don't need to be on the track - go find a stretch of dirt somewhere, where you have no idea of its distance, and blast it a couple, few, several, or many times) as hard as you want, BUT - try to keep those fast workouts to just 1 a week. If you can bottle up your fire, you'll be raring to go when the season really begins.

Most importantly - relax. We runners are very fortunate in that we compete in a pure sport and so are very in tune with our bodies. That's the beauty of running. You don't have to think. You'll know if you could have gone faster a certain day, you'll know if you've just completed an epic run that was a breakthrough. Have fun with it. It's your summer and it doesn't last forever.

Good luck, my friend.

-yourshoes

I also want to point out that a good way to re-assure yourself that all your hard work during the summer is paying off is running in a local fun run every 4 or so weeks.

That way, there is no pressure on you. If you improve your PR each time (which you probably will), you'll reap your fine efforts. If, on the other hand, you see that your time is slowing,

a) you can amend your training so that it includes more quality (fast) running - (but don't be too eager about it)

b) well, here's part of the secret - racing every 4 or so weeks is exactly that stimulus you need, with your majority of easy running, to keep improving your fitness.

In other words, one step backward will soon be outdone by a leapfrog forward.

Thanks for the reply and encouragement! I will for sure follow this advice sounds good.

Yes, listen to the ones who say mileage is the key to summer victories. I also had my best year as a sophomore in High School. The single-most thing that I did correctly the summer beforehand was run over 400 miles. My coach set out a goal for me and I mixed it up and had fun. A lot of my runs were the same 5 mile course around town, where I was able to compare times to see if I was having a good day or bad day. My speed workouts were once every week or two at the local 5k races where I mostly ran fast but didn't go for the win every single time. My easy days consisted of "garbage" miles where I just ran until I got bored to see how many of that 400 mile goal I could knock off. The most important thing between the 3 main workouts I focused on was to mix it up and have fun. It's okay to go out and totally suck every now and then. Appreciate those days you are losing because it makes winning and good workouts THAT much more motivational (runner's high!). Go out and meet people and run with them. Expand your familiarity with members of the running community to become more invested and stay hungry. Then finally, wear the proper gear but don't go too crazy. Form your own habits that make you comfortable. I never ran with a shirt on and I went through icy hot like it was magic juice! That was just my style.