If hypothyroidism is so rare then why do all of Salazar's athletes getting therapeutic exemptions for it?

maybe the symptoms of hypothyroidism are accentuated at high intensity - volume training?

bangalangadanga wrote:

maybe the symptoms of hypothyroidism are accentuated at high intensity - volume training?

Is that a wild conjecture or is that fact? If it's fact then how come out of all the distance runners in the world, only Salazar's "high intensity/high volume training" is causing hypothyroidism?

Hansons?

Hudsons?

Mammoth?

Zap?

Schumacher?

Warhurst?

McMillen?

only Salazar's runners are getting hypothyroidism? Really? if it walks like a duck and quacks when it sits on a needle it must be a duck.

Maybe it's not often checked for / diagnosed in the general public?

How many of them have therapuetic exemptions for TSH? Can you document your numbers?

bangalangadanga wrote:

maybe the symptoms of hypothyroidism are accentuated at high intensity - volume training?

This is what I often thought. All of that high level training has to have other impacts on the body than just the physiological changes we usually focus on.

I think the same is true of obese people that blame their condition on a 'bad thyroid'. Their thyroid is probably bad because they are 200 lbs overweight.

-How many of Salazar's athletes have hypothyroidism?

-Is there any drug given for the treatment of this problem that aids you in distance running?

-Does this waver allow an athlete to conceal some other drug that aids you in distance running?

I would point out that like every pro cyclist is "asthmatic" so that they can get a steroidal inhaler which is considered legal cheating in cycling. Not sure why that hasn't caught on in running yet.

1. You can't just wave your hand and say that elite athletes have different thyroids than normal people. Without any sort of basis, your statement is just hearsay.

2. Which of Salazar's athletes are on thyroid meds besides Galen? Again, need proof.

Hobo, read this thread. There are numerous peer-reviewed scientific studies on thyroid medications and EPO production.

http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=1892121

wowza wrote:

Is that a wild conjecture or is that fact? If it's fact then how come out of all the distance runners in the world, only Salazar's "high intensity/high volume training" is causing hypothyroidism?

Hansons?

Hudsons?

Mammoth?

Zap?

Schumacher?

Warhurst?

McMillen?

only Salazar's runners are getting hypothyroidism? Really? if it walks like a duck and quacks when it sits on a needle it must be a duck.

It's a fact that stress can cause hypothyroidism. World class distance training is a hell of a stress on the body.

I'm willing to bet you know nothing about any of the athletes in any of those other groups. So you have no idea who has it, who doesn't, who has even been checked for it.

AlSal is like the Rolls Royce of coqches... they are going to have every health thing checked. I have slight hypothyroidism, which I didn't know until a blood test for an unrelated reason. I doubt all of the working class runners are that diligent to get blood tests, pay for meds, or willing to take meds. I try to stay away from meds as mufh as I can.

Your epidemiology is off by a factor of ~10 or more.

According to the NHANES study, the incidence in the US population is ~3.5% of all adults. It is the second most common endocrine disorder behind diabetes mellitus.

Reference to the NHANES study:

Aoki Y, Belin RM, Clickner R, Jeffries R, Phillips L, Mahaffey KR. Serum TSH and total T4 in the United States population and their association with participant characteristics: National Health and Nutrition Examination Survey (NHANES 1999-2002). Thyroid. Dec 2007;17(12):1211-23.

Having said all that, the preponderance of young healthy hypothyroid men in a single training group throws up glaring red flags.

so how many have had TUEs for it?

anyone know?

what about mo?

med school professor wrote:

Your epidemiology is off by a factor of ~10 or more.

According to the NHANES study, the incidence in the US population is ~3.5% of all adults. It is the second most common endocrine disorder behind diabetes mellitus.

Reference to the NHANES study:

Aoki Y, Belin RM, Clickner R, Jeffries R, Phillips L, Mahaffey KR. Serum TSH and total T4 in the United States population and their association with participant characteristics: National Health and Nutrition Examination Survey (NHANES 1999-2002). Thyroid. Dec 2007;17(12):1211-23.

Having said all that, the preponderance of young healthy hypothyroid men in a single training group throws up glaring red flags.

But only if we've checked other training groups and found them to be normal. We don't know of other coaches even checking for this, do we?

med school professor wrote:

Your epidemiology is off by a factor of ~10 or more.

According to the NHANES study, the incidence in the US population is ~3.5% of all adults. It is the second most

What make you so sure the study you cited isn't off by 10 fold or more, and the study that I cited isn't correct? (A question not an indictment.)

Can anyone list these men? It seems there are several of us asking that question and nobody willing to answer it. Instead, people persist in rumor and innuendo. Are there really multiple runners in one stable on these meds?

med school professor wrote:

Having said all that, the preponderance of young healthy hypothyroid men in a single training group throws up glaring red flags.

This discussion is reminding me of an article from the Boulder Daily Camera from 2000 or 2001 during Kara (Grgas-Wheeler) Goucher's collegiate years that details the blood transfusions she used to "recover from anemia."

Anybody have access to that?

skeet skeet skeet wrote:

But only if we've checked other training groups and found them to be normal. We don't know of other coaches even checking for this, do we?

No, I/we don't know if other coaches are testing or other athletes' values.

wowza wrote:

What make you so sure the study you cited isn't off by 10 fold or more, and the study that I cited isn't correct? (A question not an indictment.)

I could quote you the Framingham study, too. The NHANES and Framingham studies are generally considered the most comprehensive epidemilogical health studies in the US. They have been so thoroughly vetted by so many people seeing and analyzing the data, that I trust them

The academic Hobo wrote:

I would point out that like every pro cyclist is "asthmatic" so that they can get a steroidal inhaler which is considered legal cheating in cycling. Not sure why that hasn't caught on in running yet.

It cerainly has! Noticed it first in 1978 when I returned from overseas to run some races in the US. Standing on a starting line at Harvard University indoor track, I was shocked at how many of my fellow competitors were taking hits on their inhaleres prior to the start of our 1000m race. I had progressed from knowing 1 kid in a high school of 2000 kids that needed an inhaler 8 years earlier, to being in a race where 6 of the 12 entries tossed inhalers to the side of the track as the gun was about to go off.

Having coached in both high school and college since that time, I am shocked at teh number of people who use inhalers. I think in high school, the rule is that it is ok if medical documentation is supplied to the meet director prior to each race. I have neveer seen this enforced.

The mean incidence is 3.5 per 1000 in women, and 0.6 per 1000 in men.

Sub-clinical hypothyroidism is more common than that. It's also quite possible that a degree of hypothyroidism that is simple not relevant to the general population is more of a big deal to the elites, who want their bodies to be working at 100%.

I also noted a couple of studies that show that vigorous exercise can exacerbate iodine loss and, if not monitored, can lead to thyroid problems.