maurice mitchell noticed?

Maurice Mitchell seems to be one of those poor start guys, but a lot of poor start guys are very fast when they're actually moving. Biggest example of this is MJ. 19.32/19.66 and maybe slightly under 10.0 if he trained for it.

Don't think Mitchell will be in the relay pool though.

Kimmons, Rodgers, Gay, Gatlin, Bailey, Demps/Patton.

I'm assuming Demps is 100% recovered from the hamstring issues he had in the OT's.

Demps had hamstring issues and still ran 10.2?

I was wondering what was wrong with him, I was expecting a 9.85 from him.

Both he and Dix shouldn't have run then unless his intention was to get into the relay pool. But he probably could have done that skipping the trials and ripping a 9.9-9.8 in Europe once he got better Europe.

I beleive there might be a health issue with M. Rodgers. Jeff Demps pr came in High school. I think with a running start MM could holod his own with most everyone else in this relay pool. Still we are running for the Silver.

As I expected . no one responded to this thread(oh sorry 4 did). MM was overlooked for his accomplishments when it comes to relay duty for the USA. Can someone tell me how Darvis Patton gets a relay spot over MM on the USA team for London. With M. Rodgers apparent injury, there are two spots open. Kimmons is going to lead the relay off even though he doesnt get the baton thru the zone as fast as Demps did at Monaco. That leaves Patton and MM for the last spot. Let's see if JD picks with his heart( the TCU alum) or his head( the guy that runs on fast relays all the time USA,FSU,RSHS).

sprcoach--

Relax, nobody on this board seriously cares about sprints except for a handful of us.

As far as MM goes on the relay squad, you are entirely correct that he has been reliable on relay squads in the past. IMO, that should count for something in the selection process.

However, at trials, he only finished .10 ahead of Patton in the 200, and was a full .25 behind Patton over the 100.

That quarter-second deficit is just too big to overlook. It is HUGE, especially in the relay--remember, relay legs are only around 100m, after all.

Any case that could be made for Mitchell could be made, perhaps more so, for Spearmon. I tried to make that case, and nobody bought it, and maybe that is a good thing, considering who will be on the team in the end.

There is no way that Spearmon would displace either Gatlin or Gay on the team. Those 2 positions are locked-up.

The next narrowest position, IMHO, is leadoff, which neither G nor G will run. It was always Kimmons' to lose. Demps has underperformed this year, his recent leadoff in Monaco notwithstanding, and Kimmons has performed consistently well both indoors and out.

The only other spot is the last position. It appears that JD would rather have Gay on 3rd and Bailey on anchor than MM on 3rd and Gay on anchor. If that is the choice that is presented, I would be hard-pressed to choose until I consider that, all other things being equal, MM is more than a quarter-second slower than Bailey in the 100. Again, HUGE.

Then you come to the question of alternates. Patton, Rodgers, and Bailey are all roughly the same speed. Rodgers is very reliable. Patton is excellent, apart from his bad luck on 3rd leg last year. Demps was slower at trials, but seems to have recovered nicely, has proven his ability to run leadoff, and the curve on 3rd as well.

MM is way down the list. For my money, BOTH Patton and Rodgers are ahead of him for either 3rd leg or anchor, Bailey is ahead of him for anchor, and Demps is ahead of him for leadoff.

There isn't much chance that Kimmons will go down--he's not doing any open events, and he has been solid in the 100 all year, so choice of alternates should come down to 2 things: giving G&G a rest, and running a good curve.

Lane draw in the final is important. There is no way I would sacrifice .25 up-front, using MM--in the prelim, somebody else could sneak in and displace the US from a good lane.

I like MM very much, as I do Spearmon, but IMHO it is tough to make a compelling argument that either of them should be on the relay squad.

Since he was at mtccca conference recently why don't you just call John for your kid Maurice Mitchell? We all know that you coached Maurice and I am certain Vince Bingham has his number. Btw I agree with you coach maurice runs a great curve and I believe prs don't matters as much as how a kid runs a leg and Maurice runs a heck of a curve.

Actually PR's do matter.

Mitchell ran a great leg but he's got to translate that into a fast time at some point every other guy in the pool has done that at some point, and every other guy in the pool has done it this season ahead of Mitchell.

He had almost 3 weeks after the trials to drop a fast time, and should have.

btw, watching Mitchell run that leg again was impressive but he has to have the time to back him up. Plenty of guys have run one great leg and then nothing.

Rodgers goes down with a stress fracture, and is replaced by...

...Demps!

http://www.usatf.org/News/Demps-added-to-Team-USA-roster.aspx

Excellent choice--not only is he more versatile than MM, but very likely substantially faster right now over 100m.

BTW, for all you knobs, I was right again--see paragraph 10 in my earlier post.

I should add that I think that Demps would be a better choice on 3rd as well as leadoff.

The bottom line is that MM is not fast enough to make the US 4x100 relay team.

Jeff Demps more versatile. jeff Demps SUBSTANTIALLY faster.

LET US EXPLORE sprint geezers statements.

MORE VERSATILE

jd has run anchor and lead off for florida

MM has run third and second and lead off at FSU

jd has run one time for USA -lead off at monaco

MM has run twice for the USA 3rd at the W'11 and 2nd in monaco

jd ran the open 200m maybe twice in his whole college career

MM ran the 200m and 400m and 4 x 4 through out his career

SUBSTANTIALLY FASTER RIGHT NOW

jd all-time pr 10.01

MM all-time pr 10.00

jd 2012 pr 10.11

MM 2012 pr 10.03

geezer c'mon now what am i missing. yes Demps and Mitchell faced off once during the outdoor season at the trials and Demps beat MM. i guess your using that one race to make such a blanket statement.

Maurice Mitchell is faster than anyone he U.S. can put on 3rd leg except Tyson Gay and Gatlin

Thank you body!

jus want a lil props to go his way.

Frankly, from what I saw in Monaco, I don't think I'd change a thing except the baton (ahem) "technique":

Kimmons

Gatlin

Gay

Bailey

Obviously, Gay is very rusty from not having done it for a long time. But if they can just get two of those exchanges, well, not even great but just decent...I think they can threaten the WR.

I believe Mitchell MIGHT be a better 1st leg then Trell Kimmons. Poor decision on Jon Drummond's part to have him run 2nd leg. If it was to see who fits where Mitchell should have definetly ran toe to toe with Trell.

In fact, Jon Drummond is probably the worst relay coach. His orders make no sense and don't play to certain runner's strengths.

Why is Demps first leg? His start is not good and he's never ran a curve. The logic that first leg has the slowest runners and that's where you put "the other guy" is completely flawed thinking.

Why is Doc Patton continuously 3rd leg? Do you think he wants to keep running that cursed leg that brings back such painful memories?

Gatlin is our fastest runner as of now. Did you see how dramatically he had to decelerate to get the stick to Tyson Gay? Gay is terrible at accelerating and thats asking for trouble. Gatlin should be anchor leg.

DEMPS!!!

If he's healthy he will give team USA a great leg.

Most explosive start in the USA right now.

The order should be Kimmons, Bailey, Gay, Gatlin. They would run 37.3 or faster and have a legit shot at winning Gold. Bailey can handle the second leg well and is only going to run a straight no matter what, and Gay is the only one who can maintain through the zone in order to hand off to Gatlin at top speed.

What about Kimmons - Gay - Gatlin - Bailey?

Gay .20-.25 faster than Bailey on 2nd, Gatlin=Gay on the turn, and Bailey only .05-.10 slower than Gatlin on anchor, means a net benefit of .10-.20

Also, this order would preserve Gay handing off to Gatlin, since you suggested that "Gay is the only one who can maintain through the zone in order to hand off to Gatlin at top speed".

sprcoach--

Versatile is relative to the requirements of the team.

The team needs someone who can sub for G or G, and someone who can run any leg if needed. Demps just proved his ability to run at least as well as Kimmons on leadoff, something that MM has not demonstrated. I'm not saying that he COULDN'T demonstrate it, just that he HAS not, in a head-to-head matchup, the way that Demps just did.

MM looked good against Gatlin on 2nd, but Gatlin didn't seem to be going all-out. Maybe the same thing applies to Kimmons on 1st leg, which would nullify my argument--but it really LOOKED to me like Gatlin wasn't full-out. Plus, on leadoff, I think that Demps was actually BETTER than Kimmons, whereas MM was only equal to Gatlin.

I still think that Demps is more versatile with respect to the requirements of the team in London.

And Demps proved at trials that he IS substantially faster than MM right now over 100m--.13 faster, to be exact, and Demps probably could have gone even faster, as he finished first in his heat while MM couldn't even match the ailing Walter Dix for 2nd place. .10-.15 is a huge difference, and a head-to-head matchup is really the best way to tell who is faster. Furthermore, Demps has been improving post-injury. There is every reason to believe that he is faster than 10.10 right now.

As far as the 200 and 400 go, well, this is the 4x100

I understand your cheering for MM, no doubt he is great. We are probably talking about miniscule differences here, although on paper that .10-.15 looms large. Realistically, either Demps or MM would be good enough to get the USA into the final--the real question is who would you rather have available for the final.

I'd rather have Demps, although a point in MM's favor is that he hasn't had Demps' injuries this year...but I can't get out of my mind that MM couldn't even beat an injured Walter Dix, head-to-head, when the stakes were large.

Demps.

Having Gay run the turn doesn't seem wise, considering that he is skipping the 200m precisely because he doesn't think he can stay healthy this year with that turn. You could have Gatlin run the turn instead or have Gay run 2nd and Gatlin 4th, and then each handoff includes one absolute professional (hopefully less likely to mess it up). As coach indicates, the 2nd leg of the 4x100m is a good spot for a great curve runner with a poor start, like Mitchell, because the start is of diminished significance when you can start pretty much whenever you want so that you are fully up to speed when you get the baton. But what I took from Red and Blue at Monaco was that we put down something like the 12th best and maybe 20th best 4x100s on the same day and didn't drop the baton (well, one of the women's teams did), which gives us a small shot at Jamaica if they don't have four healthy horses hammering out another world record.

As an aside, what if they have a healthy Blake, Powell, maybe Ashmeade, and Bolt out there, all in top form?? Could they break 36? I think they could. They might eventually lose their medals, a few years down the road, like many of our old 4x4 teams, but still an epic relay.