So, you are wondering whether you should drive 4 hours out of your way to pick up your brother or have your mom drive 12 HOURS out of her way? What a great son and brother. I bet they are very proud of you.
So, you are wondering whether you should drive 4 hours out of your way to pick up your brother or have your mom drive 12 HOURS out of her way? What a great son and brother. I bet they are very proud of you.
reaaally wrote:
dead to me wrote:I'm not angry with him. I thought I made that clear.
I mean ... I'm pretty sure pushing him away for 'X' number of years has obviously helped. You seem to really be at peace with your relationship with him and he seems to have really made progress .... oh wait ... shoot i got that backwards. Soon enough one of you will die ... then the tarnish he brings to your life will be gone. With that in mind, Happy Thanksgiving :)
You have no business entering a serious discussion about a
dangerous situation, for both brothers.
Admit that you are a wet behind the ears punk and concentrate on your pimples.
Absolutely correct. This is BY FAR the best answer on this thread.
I hear ya, man wrote:
dead to me,
Some of the posters are confused as to the difference between forgiveness and reconciliation.
Forgiveness happens in your heart whereby you reach a point where you actually wish the best for your brother and that can mean hoping that he gets clean and sober and behaves rationally.
Forgiveness does not mean that you have no feelings or memory about being cheated or hurt by someone just because he is a family member.
You can feel angry about someone's bad behavior while still having forgiven them.
Reconciliation is another matter. You can be absolutely forgiving of your brother but still be under no obligation to be put into unsafe or demeaning circumstances.
You are fulfillng your responsibilities by sending him the bus ticket, which your mother should've done. It is a reasonable, caring compromise that does not put you in danger or make you a patsy.
Exactly...by continuously stepping-up despite his lack of concern to make a change, you are just enabling him. He has to hit rock bottom to change - which usually takes drastic measures. You can tell him you love him, but until he changes you are not part of his life. If he sees the light one day, he will thank you for what you did. People say "but he's your brother"...but is he?...do real brothers steal and threaten to kill their brothers? No. It may be leaving him alone on a Thanksgiving to make him wake-up.
oldXChasbeen wrote:
Absolutely correct. This is BY FAR the best answer on this thread.
I hear ya, man wrote:dead to me,
Some of the posters are confused as to the difference between forgiveness and reconciliation.
Forgiveness happens in your heart whereby you reach a point where you actually wish the best for your brother and that can mean hoping that he gets clean and sober and behaves rationally.
Forgiveness does not mean that you have no feelings or memory about being cheated or hurt by someone just because he is a family member.
You can feel angry about someone's bad behavior while still having forgiven them.
Reconciliation is another matter. You can be absolutely forgiving of your brother but still be under no obligation to be put into unsafe or demeaning circumstances.
You are fulfillng your responsibilities by sending him the bus ticket, which your mother should've done. It is a reasonable, caring compromise that does not put you in danger or make you a patsy.
dead to me wrote:
I know my mom would be super pissed at me if I didn't go get him though, because it would mean she would have to go get him.
What are your thoughts on the issue?
Why don't you ask your mom to drive down with you, and pick your brother up together? Chances are, he'll be much easier to handle if there's both you and your mom in the car. I'm sure you can think of an excuse why your mom wants to visit placetown.
Also, it sounds like a good compromise, because this way, both you and your mom have to invest some time, and you can show that your reluctance to fetch him alone isn't just because you're lazy.
Loser alert wrote:
reaaally wrote:I mean ... I'm pretty sure pushing him away for 'X' number of years has obviously helped. You seem to really be at peace with your relationship with him and he seems to have really made progress .... oh wait ... shoot i got that backwards. Soon enough one of you will die ... then the tarnish he brings to your life will be gone. With that in mind, Happy Thanksgiving :)
You have no business entering a serious discussion about a
dangerous situation, for both brothers.
Admit that you are a wet behind the ears punk and concentrate on your pimples.
Yes, I have obviously recently left my mother's womb. Your attempts at insults are very constructive in this 'serious discussion'. I'm glad you could really add valid input. I actually too have a brother who has been jailed multiple times, spent time in rehab, and sucks the life from my family. Please do not ever think you know everything about anyone, let alone someone on a message board. For years I pushed my brother away and watched him spiral further downward. I met someone who was experiencing similar problems and he told me to support my brother without coddling him. While it hasn't been flawless, it has definitely resulted in improvements for all parties involved. Please, please stop making sweeping assumptions, I promise you will experience a greater quality of life. I suppose I should go tend to my pimples.
There seems to be a consensus among people who dealt with people like my brother. Everyone else is just ignorant. Sorry, but it's the truth. He is the way he is because he wants to be. Everyone in the family tried to help him and get him straightened out for years. It never helped AT ALL, even temporarily. If he went to jail, rehab, the hospital, etc, as soon as he was out he was back on drugs and stealing from anyone he could. Giving him a place to stay is merely giving him a safe place to do drugs and potential things to steal. My parents tried that for years as well. All it did was allow him to further his drug habits until he tried to kill my dad one night. Are you guys reading the things I've said? Kill, yes, KILL. He's been tackled by the police before and run from them many times. He's been to jail over 20 times in the past 13 years. Again, he has no desire to change his ways at all and sees other people as means to get drugs and money. Nothing more. This is why nobody can have anything to do with him. Again, nobody wants him at Thanksgiving, not even my mother. Everyone who knows him knows that being around him is simply putting themselves in harm's way. The holiday would be ruined if he was there. The only reason he needs to go to Hometown is for court.
So yeah, everyone who's actually been in a similar situation to mine, thanks for the reassuring responses. Everyone else, you should probably get off your self-righteous horses and go spend a few years with someone who continually steals from you, threatens you (and anyone you have with you), cusses you out, brings criminals into your home, and will smile at you and lie through their teeth if they think it will help them take advantage of your naive kindness and has zero intention of ever changing. You can't help someone who doesn't want it. By bringing him back to Hometown I would be bringing him back to his drug-connections. My mom will enable his bad habits the rest of her life, but I will not, and I'm certainly not putting myself in harm's way to help him put drugs in his body. Apparently you guys would.
dead to me wrote:
There seems to be a consensus among people who dealt with people like my brother. Everyone else is just ignorant. Sorry, but it's the truth. He is the way he is because he wants to be. Everyone in the family tried to help him and get him straightened out for years. It never helped AT ALL, even temporarily. If he went to jail, rehab, the hospital, etc, as soon as he was out he was back on drugs and stealing from anyone he could. Giving him a place to stay is merely giving him a safe place to do drugs and potential things to steal. My parents tried that for years as well. All it did was allow him to further his drug habits until he tried to kill my dad one night. Are you guys reading the things I've said? Kill, yes, KILL. He's been tackled by the police before and run from them many times. He's been to jail over 20 times in the past 13 years. Again, he has no desire to change his ways at all and sees other people as means to get drugs and money. Nothing more. This is why nobody can have anything to do with him. Again, nobody wants him at Thanksgiving, not even my mother. Everyone who knows him knows that being around him is simply putting themselves in harm's way. The holiday would be ruined if he was there. The only reason he needs to go to Hometown is for court.
So yeah, everyone who's actually been in a similar situation to mine, thanks for the reassuring responses. Everyone else, you should probably get off your self-righteous horses and go spend a few years with someone who continually steals from you, threatens you (and anyone you have with you), cusses you out, brings criminals into your home, and will smile at you and lie through their teeth if they think it will help them take advantage of your naive kindness and has zero intention of ever changing. You can't help someone who doesn't want it. By bringing him back to Hometown I would be bringing him back to his drug-connections. My mom will enable his bad habits the rest of her life, but I will not, and I'm certainly not putting myself in harm's way to help him put drugs in his body. Apparently you guys would.
Great ... end thread
Also absolutely correct. This is BY FAR the 2nd best answer on this thread. People who don't get this and are saying "Be a good brother and help him out" have never dealt with a selfish, anti-social, alcohol- or drug-addicted family member who causes mayhem, chaos and heartache everywhere they go. I had a cousin who was like a brother to me and my brother. He died at 32 of a drug and/or alcohol overdose. I loved him because we grew up together and at one time were very close. It was tragic but, sadly, not unexpected. Before he died he caused our family all manner of grief. Among other offenses, he showed up at a family reunion drunk and rowdy. When some of us asked him to calm down or leave he actually started a fist fight with us. I had to take him down and hold him to the ground and make him leave. He once pushed my pregnant sister against the wall and grabbed her by the throat. (I wasn't there for that or I might have killed him). She never forgave him for it. He also usually had with him several loser hangers-on/friends that were just like him.My brother used to let my cousin stay at his house when he had nowhere else to live, because, you know, he was "family". When my sister-in-law came into the living room one night to find my drunk cousin pissing on her Christmas tree, that was her last straw. My brother's irrational and enabling support of a "family" member was one of the main causes of his divorce after 10 years of marriage.My aunt and mother routinely took up for my cousin and encouraged us to just love him because he was family, we don't turn our backs on family, etc. He might never have changed any way, but I believe my aunt is now without her son because no one would use tough love and let him suffer the consequences of his actions so that he might turn his life around.
dad of a reformed drug addict wrote:
1.Do not pick up your brother just because it is Thanksgiving, regardless of what any one on this thread says.
If you do, you are an enabler.
2. Some on here say maybe he wants to make amends or reform. I say it's up to him to take those steps. NO ONE else can do it for him. Yes, you could pick him up. However, he could be dead the next day too. You have no control. He either hits rock bottom and decides he wants to make his life better and face his demons or he continues to live the life of an addict.
3. Sure your mom may be upset with you but you explain to her that you will NOT be an enabler. End of story.
4. I have been thru this, spent hundreds of thousands (yes, you read that right)of dollars on treatment, all the stealing, lying, cheating, crying, anger, and on and on. The point is, IMHO from speaking with world renowned pros, not one treatment professional from any program would recommend you pick your brother up.
5 I hope you can enjoy your Thanksgiving but remember, it is only a day, not some emotionally conceived holiday where you are made to feel guilt because you didn't pick him up. It's on him, not you.
All the best,
So you've got it figured out, great. See you in a month when you come back on the board begging for advice regarding Christmas!
SO I just read this from start to finish and it appears you never were going to pick him up.
You essentially asked a question,while only accepting one out of the two answers. Why ask?
Also, if you are going north, but have to go 90 minutes south first, then you are adding 3 hours onto your trip not 4. That's 25% less time than you advertised.
I feel for you. You have a clear understanding of how it was and will be, sad to say.Let your mom send him the $$$ to show up in court. I'd be willing to say he doesn't show up. Again, sad to say.He can only be helped if he is willing. I sincerely hope that day comes for you and your family.To all the others: in drug/alcohol family matters, I would say that until you have been in that situation then you really don't have any ability to constructively comment (unless you are a professional who deals with these issues).Keep running. Get some therapy if need be. Go to the support groups to see if that is for you.Peace.
dead to me wrote:
There seems to be a consensus among people who dealt with people like my brother. Everyone else is just ignorant. Sorry, but it's the truth. He is the way he is because he wants to be. Everyone in the family tried to help him and get him straightened out for years. It never helped AT ALL, even temporarily. If he went to jail, rehab, the hospital, etc, as soon as he was out he was back on drugs and stealing from anyone he could. Giving him a place to stay is merely giving him a safe place to do drugs and potential things to steal. My parents tried that for years as well. All it did was allow him to further his drug habits until he tried to kill my dad one night. Are you guys reading the things I've said? Kill, yes, KILL. He's been tackled by the police before and run from them many times. He's been to jail over 20 times in the past 13 years. Again, he has no desire to change his ways at all and sees other people as means to get drugs and money. Nothing more. This is why nobody can have anything to do with him. Again, nobody wants him at Thanksgiving, not even my mother. Everyone who knows him knows that being around him is simply putting themselves in harm's way. The holiday would be ruined if he was there. The only reason he needs to go to Hometown is for court.
So yeah, everyone who's actually been in a similar situation to mine, thanks for the reassuring responses. Everyone else, you should probably get off your self-righteous horses and go spend a few years with someone who continually steals from you, threatens you (and anyone you have with you), cusses you out, brings criminals into your home, and will smile at you and lie through their teeth if they think it will help them take advantage of your naive kindness and has zero intention of ever changing. You can't help someone who doesn't want it. By bringing him back to Hometown I would be bringing him back to his drug-connections. My mom will enable his bad habits the rest of her life, but I will not, and I'm certainly not putting myself in harm's way to help him put drugs in his body. Apparently you guys would.
dead to me wrote:
.... What are your thoughts on the issue?
Let me stress that if your thoughts don't match mine, you are ignorant!
OP, you're understandably going through a lot and dealing with many emotions: anger, sadness, fear...You don't have the brother you wish you had, strong, reliable, decent, and that sucks. It's tough on you. If you can, I would suggest talking to a therapist. Take care of yourself.
I would send your brother a bus ticket, or talk to your parents or sister about it. Whatever you choose to do, I hope you'll also take the time to think of all the good things going on in your life.
UR just getting sentimental.
If you haven't been able to help him resolve his issues all these years, I doubt a single 4hr trip in a car will fix it. Best thing would be to him take a bus to your town and then you drive up to home at 90-100mph so as to minimize the discomfort. Your mom sounds like she feels guilty and blames herself for the way your brorhter has turned out. Thanksgiving is just another holiday. No need to lather it with the gravy of guilt.
dead to me wrote:
I've had as little to do with my brother as possible over the last 7 years. He steals, he does drugs, he threatens violence, he never shuts up and babbles on about nonsense because his brain is fried,
I think the confusion results in your poor description in your first post.
We go from "threatening violence" to "attempting to kill father". From "mom will be pissed if I don't get him" to "NOBODY wants him here for Thanksgiving, he only needs to be here for a court appearance".
Don't pick him up. Brush up on your ability to write succinctly and with needed detail.
It's prety clear that the entirety of the choices throughout your lives of both you and your brother is just a playing out of the oldest and most basic source of human conflict - Sibling Rivalry.
The solution is easy, tell your mom you won't be home for Thanksgiving if your brother is there so she finally makes it clear to each of you who she loves more, and one of you can finally be declared the victor. Sure a few people may end up miserable, but afterall it's the Holidays!
I didn't think I would need to explain to anyone that drug addicts can be violent as that's usually a given, and I acutally did explain his threats and potential violence in my second post only halfway down on the first page. Maybe you failed to read it?
It doesn't matter if he's dead to you or not, you're still blood, still brothers.
Man up and go get him.
dead to me wrote:
I didn't think I would need to explain to anyone that drug addicts can be violent as that's usually a given, and I acutally did explain his threats and potential violence in my second post only halfway down on the first page. Maybe you failed to read it?
No, violence from a drug addict is not a given. Why state someone who has attempted murder is somebody that "threatens violence", it is quite the understatement. I guess we could say that JW Booth was not a fan of Lincoln, but that fails to express the extremity of his actions. Very much like you fail to write well. On this last post you still refer to "threats and potential violence" didn't he attempt to kill your father? This fine citizen has ACHIEVED his potential, much like you have achieved a high level of douchery.
Your family wants you to give him a ride in the hopes that he has another successful violent episode and keeps you both from attending the event.