If 16-18 miles at MP is impossible for you, how do you expect to run 26 at MP?
If 16-18 miles at MP is impossible for you, how do you expect to run 26 at MP?
PSAT wrote:
If 16-18 miles at MP is impossible for you, how do you expect to run 26 at MP?
tailwind.
not to be a troll but do you think you can run about 2/3 of a distance of the race at race pace for a workout?
I'm no expert, but I'll use the 10k as an example.
don't tell me that you can run 4 miles of your 10k race pace straight in a single workout. you'de be lucky to finish a 6x 2 miles at race pace with 2 min recovery.
now given the same ratio to the marathon (which is evenharder I believe) just seems impossible.
just my 2 cent.
ask him yourself in Colorado! I am! http://www.distancesummit.com
hate to break it to you but, not everyone lives in Colorado. and not everyone can afford to buy a plane ticket and go. If I have the money and time, I would do it.
S.A.T wrote:
not to be a troll but do you think you can run about 2/3 of a distance of the race at race pace for a workout?
I'm no expert, but I'll use the 10k as an example.
don't tell me that you can run 4 miles of your 10k race pace straight in a single workout. you'de be lucky to finish a 6x 2 miles at race pace with 2 min recovery.
of course. as mentioned, if that's impossible, how can you expect to run a FULL race at that pace?
of course wrote:
S.A.T wrote:not to be a troll but do you think you can run about 2/3 of a distance of the race at race pace for a workout?
I'm no expert, but I'll use the 10k as an example.
don't tell me that you can run 4 miles of your 10k race pace straight in a single workout. you'de be lucky to finish a 6x 2 miles at race pace with 2 min recovery.
of course. as mentioned, if that's impossible, how can you expect to run a FULL race at that pace?
You're missing the point. No-one doubts that someone who expects to run a marathon should (at least close to race date) be able to run 16-18 miles at race pace. The point is: IS IT A VALUABLE / WORTHWHILE / ADVISABLE TRAINING SESSION.
I would say no. We never run further than 16k at race pace at any one time.
Red Cup wrote:
You're missing the point. No-one doubts that someone who expects to run a marathon should (at least close to race date) be able to run 16-18 miles at race pace. The point is: IS IT A VALUABLE / WORTHWHILE / ADVISABLE TRAINING SESSION.
I would say no. We never run further than 16k at race pace at any one time.
No, mate, you're not reading closely enough.
Give it another go and then try a relevant response.
I'll try again, and hate being rude...but is there a SIMPLE, not 100 page, breakdown of Canova's philosophies as opposed to someone like Lydiard or Daniels, specifically on improving threshold, etc.?
I am NOT trying to be rude...but I wish I understood what you were saying.
S.A.T.
During the specific phase of an athlete (the phase preceeding the race) I also recommend a simulation run of 60% of race distance at goal race pace. While this is certainly a tough workout if it is not doable than I've found the athlete has little possibility of completing the whole race distance at goal pace on race day.
And extra easy/recovery day may be needed after workout, but it should not be a race effort.
Here are the simulation distances I recommend for my runners:
5k Race = 3k simulation
10k Rcae = 6k simulation
Half Marathon = 12.5k simulation
Marathon = 25k simulation
In general I like to do the simulation run 2-3 weeks before the goal race for a 5k or 10 race, 3-4 weeks out for a half marathon and 4-5 weeks out for a marathon.
MPR
Canova recommends the following for his "aerobic endurance" sessions during the "specific" phase (follows, "general" and "special" phases).
Aerobic Endurance Workouts:
1) 18-22 miles steady run @ 90-95% of MP
2) 24-26 miles easy run @ 80-85% of MP
3) 18-22 miles progression run @ 85-100% of MP
4) 12-15 miles simulation run @ 100% of MP
5) 20 miles - last 5-10 miles @ 100% of MP
6) 20 miles incorporating 10 x 800 @ 103% of MP w 800 jog
7) 6-7 miles @ 85% + 6-7 miles @ 100% of MP (workout done AM and PM)
You'll see that he suggests a *maximum* distance of 15M @ MP.
Which is a little under 60% (i.e. 57%). So the previous poster has a similar % for their efforts. However I wouldn't call them "simulations", rather they are time-trials. A simulation generally refers to the full distance being completed with parts run at GP/RP and others as floats or recoveries of some sort. Just terminology I know, but I think there is a worthwhile distinction here.
I still don't get it.
It was posted on google docs here:
The document is dated "26 Sept. 2011".
Some initial feedback can be found here:
Would love to have a copy of your interesting article! Thanks in advance
I would love a copy of your article please: demonsamurai@gmail.com
Hey North Star i would be grateful if you could send me a copy of your Canova Article as I'm training for a marathon.
Keep up the good work.
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