He's only been a US citizen for 24 months and he expects to get the opportunity to bully Americans and get all the money ?? (and national titles to boot)
Obviously he didn't just come to America so he could join the army and fight a war; he came here to be the top American runner and get famous.
As a member of the armed services he deserves some respect regardless of where he was born.
What the f*** is wrong with you?
Either the OP is sarcastic or a troll - though I guess they could be a sarcastic troll.
Having coached military teams in the past I have seen many foreign USA Military members. You do not need to be an American citizen or promise to become one to join. You just need to swear allegiance to the USA.
Some who join eventually become citizen, some don't. The reasons they join are varied. Most a job skill, benefits for them and their families, and that can mean extended families if they can prove they are dependent on the individual military member. I have seen mother's, father's grandparents, brother's and sister's etc become dependents of a single person. They are all eligible for benefits.
Quite a few joined when there was no conflict and no worries about being sent overseas. It was a good way to get started in the USA and be legal and not on public assistance. This has been happening since the end of World War II. In this day anyone who speaks Arabic or many of the African dialects is a desired recruit.
As to the USATF's rules, it is the same as many other countries and not unreasonable. It keeps out people who are not only ineligible but who may interfere and knock out an eligible person for a team. I mean "knock out" as in impede, trip up etc. It was one reason for the rule change years ago when we did allow foreigners and non-eligible people to compete in National meets where we picked international teams. There were some ugly race tactics going on. Purposely trying to keep our best runners from making a team. Cold War on the track!! We learned the hard way.
Look, I know plenty of people who run and serve. I know some who run and "serve". When you are in WCAP, you are not taking bullets.
The Army got their hooks into him and he is a Private. I could (officially) look, but he has not deployed and as long as he is in WCAP he won't.
Don't turn this argument into one about him being in the Armed Services and can take a bullet blah blah blah.
As long as he can run and serve WCAP's needs, he won't deploy. He may even have terms in his contract that gets him out of service after 2012 (when he may actually have to really serve).
I think by representing that he is a real soldier is doing discredit to the ones who have served, fought, and died throughout the years. It is apparent WCAP has him as a runner, before the Army has him as a soldier.
It's too bad he can't run (even though the rule is in place), but this added P.R. hoopla is a waste of resources and is appalling to hear about.
If Chirlee is indeed not in any danger of being deployed, he is a scumbag for using the "take a bullet" stance.
Former Captain wrote:
I think by representing that he is a real soldier is doing discredit to the ones who have served, fought, and died throughout the years.
Military Coach wrote:
It was one reason for the rule change years ago when we did allow foreigners and non-eligible people to compete in National meets where we picked international teams. There were some ugly race tactics going on. Purposely trying to keep our best runners from making a team. Cold War on the track!! We learned the hard way.
You posted this in the other thread, and I asked you to substantiate it. When did this occur?
He could easily become active duty. As pointed out in the article:“We all know if we don’t make the Olympics, we go back to regular Army duties,” said Chirlee, who said he received an Army stipend of $1,600 a month. “I know they could call me any time. I am ready. I will defend the country if asked.”Rainsberger said she had worked with three runners dropped from the Army athlete program who served in Iraq and in Kuwait.
I Am Disgusted wrote:
If Chirlee is indeed not in any danger of being deployed, he is a scumbag for using the "take a bullet" stance.
Former Captain wrote:I think by representing that he is a real soldier is doing discredit to the ones who have served, fought, and died throughout the years.
Here's the situation Chirlee finds himself in. He's currently on WCAP. He joined the Active Duty, I believe, thus if for any reason he is dropped from WCAP for not meeting performance standards (WCAP just dropped a couple guys after CIM) he'll be reassigned to a regular unit.
Unlike previous Reserve or National Guard members who were activated for the the cycle of the program and then returned to their unit after cycle or if they were dropped.
A good example is Mickey Kelley, a pentathlete. After the last Olympic "cycle" she was sent to a regular unit and then deployed, either to Iraq or Afghanistan, after the deployment she has to reapply for the program again.
Guys like Nate Pennington have deployed previously.
So I don't think Chirlee is hiding behind anything.
Great! He could. You could too, my friend, with a little thing called The Draft.
My point is that Dan Browne did not go to West Point to join WCAP, run for Nike, etc. He joined to serve and the rest was a lucky by-product.
As a Private "serving" in the Army, he is not here to go to Iraq and Afghanistan but instead run for WCAP.
Some day he may serve. Some day you may serve.
It doesn't mean that he is now or that angle should have been used.
(I don't like the USATF as an organization, but I don't appreciate the P.R. approach included in this piece.)
Guess what I already served, 22 years, retired, multi time All Army Runner, multi time CISM runner, never fast enough for WCAP...so we don't have to go there.
Dan Browne is a perfect example of what I'm talking about. You are spot on..he went to WP, then OB, then straight to WCAP, then after WCAP he went into the National Guard...his only goal after WP was to RUN, WCAP, and then NIKE, Then WCAP, he's never served active duty other than schools, WCAP...everything else is one weekend a month..
If you believe he is is only in the Army to run..then why are there WCAP athletes, Olympians who are currently deployed, Mikey Kelley I've already listed, there is a Bobsledder as well.
However, I will concede this...if Chirlee does make an Olympic Team...WCAP may not release him until he decided to do something with his career if thats the route he wants. And I will also concede that he may stay at Fort Carson for many years.
GaryB, it wasn't directed at you, in as much as it was a general statement. I have a similar background minus the 22 years, but my background is what excites my chiming in on this topic.
Don't put the cart before the horse! He has signed on to the Army to run. DB signed into WP for school/Army - not a WCAP application at the same time.
I'm arguing my side point, which has less to do with him running at USATFs and more to do with the way the article was written (either directly by the author or by the mis-information provided by coach/athlete).
Former Captain wrote:
Great! He could. You could too, my friend, with a little thing called The Draft.
My point is that Dan Browne did not go to West Point to join WCAP, run for Nike, etc. He joined to serve and the rest was a lucky by-product.
As a Private "serving" in the Army, he is not here to go to Iraq and Afghanistan but instead run for WCAP.
Some day he may serve. Some day you may serve.
It doesn't mean that he is now or that angle should have been used.
(I don't like the USATF as an organization, but I don't appreciate the P.R. approach included in this piece.)
Dan Browne has yet to serve his country. He is/was a great runner, but we should not degrade those that have actually served by putting him in the same catagory.
As a Private in the Army Chirlee is payed to serve his country. He is a talented runner and probably will never actually do anything other than run. If he chooses to reenlist and continue a career in the Army I will be impressed (and suprised).
Former Captain wrote:
GaryB, it wasn't directed at you, in as much as it was a general statement. I have a similar background minus the 22 years, but my background is what excites my chiming in on this topic.
Don't put the cart before the horse! He has signed on to the Army to run. DB signed into WP for school/Army - not a WCAP application at the same time.
I'm arguing my side point, which has less to do with him running at USATFs and more to do with the way the article was written (either directly by the author or by the mis-information provided by coach/athlete).
No worries..I think we are on the same thought for the most part..however I would submit to you, classmates/teammates at WP of DB would argue the he never planned on Active Duty service...it was more about running..not a big deal..he took advantage of a system that worked out for him.
GaryB,
I agree about DB & his intentions after WP. Jason Stewart was an athlete in the same boat, but he chose to actually pay back what he was given by allowing himself to be deployed to the hellhole in Bosnia. There is a HUGE difference between the two officers that were produced by that system, and it shows.
ALL and I mean ALL Soldiers who have or ever will be accepted into the Army WCAP program should know that they raised their right hand to defend our country and Constitution FIRST. IF, any Soldier is lucky enough as I was to be a part of the organization serving your main role as a Soldier after your WCAP should be mandatory.
I personally do not like the realization that some Soldiers have simply used the system soley for their athletic pursuits and really had no interest in being Soldiers. Great unit to be a part of, great people and MANY of our Soldiers have deployed in combat zones but there are some who have simply never been anything but athletes.
Nate
90's Runner wrote:
GaryB,
I agree about DB & his intentions after WP. Jason Stewart was an athlete in the same boat, but he chose to actually pay back what he was given by allowing himself to be deployed to the hellhole in Bosnia. There is a HUGE difference between the two officers that were produced by that system, and it shows.
Best line I heard about Jason was in Ireland while we were there for CISM World XC...someone said something to the effect of "Damn Jason, a year ago you were up to your ass in mud in Bosnia.." Also remember a story about Mike Bernstein in Runners World or Running Times and they talked about how he had to get his first run of the day in prior to first formation in the Motor Pool where, as a Platoon Leader, he had to actually "LEAD" soldiers.
90's Runner wrote:
GaryB,
I agree about DB & his intentions after WP. Jason Stewart was an athlete in the same boat, but he chose to actually pay back what he was given by allowing himself to be deployed to the hellhole in Bosnia. There is a HUGE difference between the two officers that were produced by that system, and it shows.
Stewart also served in Germany and in the Pentagon. Bosnia is/was just the tip of the iceberg.