First Marathon Training for 3:40h range - long run question

I'd think that the 15 miler would be too short. Also, I would look a bit at pacing as it seems that 2:30+ would get them more miles than that.

How far out are you planning their long run from race day?

The other question I would pose (no idea what the answer is): Does the percent of total mileage "rule" apply the same way for average runners as it does for faster ones?

radiostar wrote:

I'd think that the 15 miler would be too short. Also, I would look a bit at pacing as it seems that 2:30+ would get them more miles than that.

Honestly, both of them run their LONG training runs too fast rather than too slow already.

How far out are you planning their long run from race day?

plenty of time - late spring and other one is fall marathon

Generally, I have the concern that the training will end up being the weekly long run and then 3-4 recovery runs to recover from the long run. I don't think that's ideal, on the other hand, they need a long run.

Just build them up gradually to about 3:15-30, but make sure the runs over 2:30 have an easy week after. If these runners are good enough to shoot for 3:30- 50, they will be able to handle being on their feet for over three hours. It is just a matter of making sure they recover before doing any workouts. For first timers, the real battle is the distance, not as much the speed. The more you can acclimate them to the distance, the better.

3:30-3:50 is quite fast for a first time marathon. My first was 3:59, and I was first among all of my Team in Training team, including some very good athletes (in other sports). One of those over 4 hours finishers was on the world championship crew team, and another now runs sub 2:50.

Why aren't they running the usual 20-22 miles in training? It works for TNT and every other program I know of. "Percentage of total miles" is more of a concern for track work than the long run.

They can use a HRM to manage their pace. You know the rule: "run your slow runs slower, and your fast runs faster."

just say no wrote:

They can use a HRM to manage their pace. You know the rule: "run your slow runs slower, and your fast runs faster."

Not a fan of HRM. You can tell by how out of breath you are if you're running too fast or too slow.

And yes, you're right: one of the challenges is that they're running the same pace, no matter if I prescribe a recovery jog or a tempo run or a long run.

just say no wrote:

3:30-3:50 is quite fast for a first time marathon. My first was 3:59, and I was first among all of my Team in Training team, including some very good athletes (in other sports). One of those over 4 hours finishers was on the world championship crew team, and another now runs sub 2:50.

Why aren't they running the usual 20-22 miles in training? It works for TNT and every other program I know of. "Percentage of total miles" is more of a concern for track work than the long run.

They can use a HRM to manage their pace. You know the rule: "run your slow runs slower, and your fast runs faster."

Nice troll job.

Just checking the math. 2:30 gives them about 15 miles. They are doing long runs at 10 min/mile?

If so, they shouldn't have too much trouble recovering from long runs. Are you having them run long every week or do you alternate (15/10, 16/11)? Of course, this can also be accomplished by time 2 hour/70 minutes...

I would definitely be doing faster paced stuff mid-week and probably doing the shorter "long" runs at increased pace.

I've got nothing against slow long runs (time on the feet) but I worry that long slow runs lead to slow times (even at the modest targets your runners are aiming for).