New college coach, want base advice

New Dcoach wrote:

The only thing that worries me is that if i put them through too long of a "base" phase, will they have adequate time to peak?

Good question, and a real dilemma. But first: when you say a base phase for "the first 4-6 weeks," is that starting from now or starting from March 1? If it's the latter (I suspect it is), then four weeks is probably the outer limit of what you can afford.

...subject to your competitive schedule, though. Many/most DIII schools finish their season the first weekend in May, or even the last weekend of April. If your school does this, by the end of March you're going to *have to* be tilting more toward specific race prep.

BUT you can make this a smooth transition by making sure that the base period is not simply slow running. Please search for recent threads/posts from Renato Canova, particularly for the advice he (and others) have given re hills and strides.

Of course, the runners who've done nothing for weeks/months may not be able to handle much--or any?--of the more intense stuff like hill sprints, at least for the first week or two. But for those runners, I'm sure you'll make appropriate modifications of the training plan.

It would be great if you could bump this thread periodically and let us know how things are going. Good luck!

Why do they need another base phase? Why aren't they running high mileage through indoor track?

Individualize it based on how much each person ran over the winter. No point holding the overachievers back with a redundant base period.

@Lease

It is indeed the latter (march 1), and the season does end at the very beginning of may. I didn't plan on slow running, but instead (for the runners who can do it), a period of agressive aerobic work. Tempo's (aerobic threshold and lactate threshold), short hill sprints & long hill sprints (for the more advanced runners, canova strength hill circuits), vigil-style VO2 mile reps, and potentially some fartleks as well.

More similar to Canova's Fundamental Phase where he hits the athlete with a variety of different races paces, but not too much specific work. Then transition the end of that phase into a race/peak phase.

@Ralphy & former d3 coach

Well it'd obviously have to be individualized to the needs of the individual, but it's actually surprising how mileage can vary among D3 programs. I had a friend who averaged 65-70mpw in college; I on the other hand, barely avg'd 40. But most of my response is in the first paragraph.

Why did you take a college coaching job if you don't know how to train college athletes?

Base, base, base,.....then 3 to 4 weeks of "race specific sharpening/training".

New Dcoach wrote:

The team runs 5 days a week, with one day of cross training. Running another day is optional (i'm only the asst. so i can't change policy), and they'll race one of those days on selective weeks.

Is this a junior high program?

what school?

Disco Biscuit wrote:

Why did you take a college coaching job if you don't know how to train college athletes?

Agreed. I wish I could send this thread to your employer.

Disco Biscuit wrote:

Why did you take a college coaching job if you don't know how to train college athletes?

Ummmmmmmmmm maybe he was the best person available for the job.

Just a thought.

I'll just ignore most the insults because i couldn't really care less, but i'll answer some of the more important inquiries...

@Disco Biscuit & The Musket

I never said i didn't know how to train them; without sounding too egotistical i do feel i am able to coach college age athletes. However, my background in coaching (not coaching education) is primarily high school and club coaching. I've coached a local Cross Country for quite a few years now and we've been very successful; however, with it being in the fall, i'm able to work with the kids, to an extent, over the summer as well. With my club coaching, most of the runners are either A) looking to just get a more structured training plan then they already have for year-round running, or B) they're looking to run a great half marathon or marathon. In both cases the actual time available is very, very different then a D3 schedule. Like all new college coaches, i may know how to train athletes (to a degree, it is a learning process after all no matter what), but i still don't have college experience... hence being hired by them.

Although you may insult it, remember, it's D3, not D2 or 1. If I had a say in things, i'd have the kids gradually move up to 6 0r 7 days a week, with occasional rest days. However, by running 5 days a week and having 1 day of team cross training, that counts as practice 6 days a week. Which, for a school which is more academically oriented then athletically oriented, is seen as pretty good in the eyes of some (not all).

welcometothethunderdome wrote:

Disco Biscuit wrote:

Why did you take a college coaching job if you don't know how to train college athletes?

Agreed. I wish I could send this thread to your employer.

This is crazy. Anyone who thinks they know everything about any subject is an idiot. I most respect people willing to ask questions in any field, no matter their experience level. You can ALWAYS learn from others. I think the OP will do a fine job as a coach, as evidenced by the fact that he is asking questions, listening, and thinking. I am sure he will just add whatever he learns on this board to his knowledge base and his team will be great, subject only to their only limitations.

why not have em work on getting their mileage up, then if there is still some time put some workouts together. after all, this is LRC, high mileage works, think the long term rather than this season.

you idiots that don't like the op asking a question, i'd like you to talk to joe newton, lydiard, john wooden, bowerman, etc... all the greats... ask them if they never asked other people questions. the greatest coaches never knew everything and always had a passion, a drive, to continue their education in the sport.

New Dcoach wrote:

However, by running 5 days a week and having 1 day of team cross training, that counts as practice 6 days a week.

Not to mention that--as near as I know--the NCAA does not permit organized practices seven days per week. At least one day "off" is required.

What this means, practically speaking, is that a seventh day has to be on the athlete's own. However, you can certainly reward, if not require, the seventh day: institute an "extra effort" club, or simply mention the guys who run the seventh day at an appropriate time/venue. Doesn't have to be a big production--they just need to know that you're aware of their effort, and approve.

Don't knock the rest day.

I joined a club on leaving college, and it happened to be the one where Seb Coe was training on Sunday mornings (Haringey, UK, 1987). My coach (the one who helped him get back in 1984 onwards, not Peter Coe) gave me a schedule with a rest day. I said "What, a day off?" He called Seb over and said "Seb, what's the most important session of the week"? Seb said "Rest day" in about a tenth of a second. End of argument.

After enough years maybe your tendons adapt enough to not need it, but for people early in college (who are very injury prone) I think it's a good rule to have a rest day. Nothing to stop those people with excess energy from doing a run if they want to.

IMHO a mixed schedule with tempos, fartlek and sprints and (importantly) some long, easy untimed runs will get people 90% of the way to the shape they need. The time to build their mileage up for next season is July to September. Good luck.

In my opinion, a collegiate coach should prioritize the outdoor season above the indoor season. Therefore, all runners that compete in the 1500m or above should emphasize "base" work in the December through February time-frame. When March begins, retain mileage level but include hill work, long intervals, tempos, and a small amount of short but fast running. That is, use March as a link to more race-pace and speed work that will take place in April.

The mont of May is the time for DIII peaking at the DIII level. That's when you ease back on the long, hard training in order peak. Of course, you must individualize training in the late season to optimize results. One guy may need reduced training volume and short, fast repetition work; the next guy may need maintenance of mileage and reduction in the amount of hard interval work being performed. Sometimes only subtle changes are needed.Use your experience of coaching athletes over the years to recognize what each runner needs. Ask them questions, too, about what has an has not worked well in the past for them.

If you made the mistake of using low mileage and high intensity training during the indoor season, you will have to schedule base training for March. That doesn't meant your guys should only run a bunch of easy mileage, however. Instead, include tempo work, long fartleks at moderate speeds (15k-10k speeds is fine), some hill running at moderate speeds (like 70-75% of best speed on a hill), striders for quickness and coordination (5k down to 1500m speed is fine)in your March "base" period. As a result, your guys won't struggle in April when you prescribe race-pace training.

Regards,

Tinman

runfastcoach@gmail.com