Question about Stanford and other top universities

You need to get in contact with the coach to find out information like this. I would imagine that a 4:15 miler would be someone Stanford would be interested in talking to.

My recommendation would be to not focus primarily on the good "big name" schools (Stanford, Harvard, etc.) There are a LOT of VERY GOOD top-tier schools, especially in specific fields, that are less "well-known," and thus may be easier to get into and less expensive, while offering the same (or perhaps greater) education.

I have experienced both Ivy League and "smaller specialized" education (undergrad and graduate level), and I can easily say that I was let down by the quality of an ivy league education. That is not to say that it was "bad," just not what it is hyped up to be.

You should look at Bucknell. Donner coached Brian Sell in college and the school is on par with the Ivy league schools. I believe that you would need a 30 ACT score or a 1300 SAT. Good luck with the search. My advice would be email a bunch of coaches and see who bites.

Yeahboy! wrote:

You should look at Bucknell. ... and the school is on par with the Ivy league schools.

I see we have a Bucknell alumnus amongst us... and someone who actually believed the bombast they tell you at graduation.

*That's right future Bucknell graduates... you REALLY ARE as good as all the ivy-leaguers that got into schools which you couldn't get into.*

Isn't believing the ridiculous speeches they give at graduation proof that you've been inadequately educated?

Assuming that your parents can afford the tuition, you should also be looking at good D3 schools. Remember that our 1:43 800 guy, Nick Symmonds was a Catholic school boy from Boise who went to a D3 school, Willamette University.

If you can run a 4:15 mile, Stanford would be at least interested in talking to you. I wasn't aware the mile was contested outside the United States, but for now, I will assume it is. The rapport you have with the coaches will be essential. It they believe you can improve and will be a solid team member, getting an endorsement from a coach can do nothing but help you gain admission to a University like Stanford.

stanford is really the only place worth going to if you're fast and smart

The op used the word 'keen,' so he is probably British and they do run the mile there and in Commonwealth countries like Australia and New Zealand. Stanford might have some interest in a 4:15 miler, although if the OP drops six or seven seconds outdoors this year, that would increase. The freshman profiles aren't up yet on their track website, but among the others I saw hs times of 1:49, 13:55 (derrick obviously), 1:52, 9 flat, 8:46 (2M, Elliott Heath), and a 4:14. But among those with credentials around 9 flat or above, they all had at least one footlocker xc finish in the top 14, usually top ten, and most of these guys who were slower in high school not only redshirted their freshman year but competed in just a few meets (were not on the travel team). Also Stanford does not look for foreign distance runners, unlike, say, UNM, Providence, or Arkansas. The upshot is that unless you improve a good deal, you will be more attractive and able to compete a lot more (getting a lot more coaching) at some other very good schools that are not as elite in track and xc (e.g. Harvard, Princeton, UC Berkeley maybe, Williams, Haverford).

NoFatty wrote:

Yeahboy! wrote:

You should look at Bucknell. ... and the school is on par with the Ivy league schools.

I see we have a Bucknell alumnus amongst us... and someone who actually believed the bombast they tell you at graduation.

*That's right future Bucknell graduates... you REALLY ARE as good as all the ivy-leaguers that got into schools which you couldn't get into.*

Isn't believing the ridiculous speeches they give at graduation proof that you've been inadequately educated?

rejected from bucknell? happened to me too...

Well it can't hurt to try bro. Call the coach in advance and tell express yo ur interest maybe he can help you a little bit. I would not count on getting in solely on your athletic talent. Stanford is a pretty tough university to get in to for anyone, you will need to have certain level of academics to get in. Since you live outside the US your most important factor will be your standardized test scores. This is a good thing because you can really effect these still. Take the time to prepare for them using some sort of class even if you have to do one online. Learn as much as you can about the test and try to really peg out the score. This will help you a lot. Also make sure you have any essays you submit to the college reviewed by some one who really knows english writing well. Good luck.

Asiatic ? Stanford racially discriminates against Asiatics limiting the entering freshman class quota to 20%. Jews are not racially targeted by Stanford. Edrick can get around the racail quota if he wants you.

Coaches at top universities in USA can definitely help with admissions if they want you. What that means is that they can get you an early read on your college application. You still have to qualify academically. Stanford or Ivys will not take a student with bad grades and test scores. But all these schools take less than 10% of applicants, so being placed in the athletic pre-read pool will definitely help. The coach can't get you admitted but can certainly advocate for you.

Whether Stanford needs another 4:15 miler is something you'll have to ask them. It's very competitive. Email them.

As far as D3 schools are concerned, most are just as expensive as Stanford and Ivys. I don't see any advantage to them unless you like the small school atmosphere.

Are you looking for a full or partial athletic scholarship, or just asking about the probability of getting in?

If money is not the issue (lucky you), then there are many excellent schools around the US that may not be as world famous, but offer an undergraduate experience perhaps better than Stanford's, and are very well known to elite employers. With your 4:15 you could be one of the better runners at a smaller school, rather than the slow guy at Stanford.

Someone mentioned Williams. I know two recent undergrads who loved their experience there.

I run on the Stanford track, have an Ivy League degree, and have friends from all the Ivies. You should realize that most (not all) of the famous schools, are much more focused on research than on teaching undergrads. Someone mentioned Berkeley. Undergrads are lower than dirt in the eyes of Berkeley faculty and administration.

Not sure if you're up for texas, but Rice is a great school.

BTW Aren't most applications due by now?

Lehigh is better than bucknell.

Thanks so much all for the advice,

I should probably clarify a few things.

I still have another track season to go before I graduate high school, obviously I would love to improve my times to somewhere in the range of a sub 3:55 1500 or 4:10ish mile, but until I do there's no use speculating!

The reason I ask about a school like Stanford despite the fact that I'm currently a bit slower than their incoming freshmen is that I'm likely to graduate with leaving scores just inside the top 1% of my state. Of course I will have to sit the SAT's and write essays and all of that but I guess I thought I should give you guys a ballpark indication of my academic ability.

Final question, how important are cross country results for coaches assessing recruits?

Once again thanks so much everyone!

One problem for 'standard' foreigners (and you would fit that bill) is that they do not know how to parse the students record. I had a nephew that grew up in the UK and had trouble getting appropriate appreciation for his record (he went to Vanderbilt).

Stanford does not have that problem, they get an eclectic mix. They will take unique individuals with good records. Unfortunately, you are just a bit outside of being unique in this case -- that might change with another year of competition, but that would always hold for track athletes, so the standard has to be not HS PRs but PRs in the prior year, which makes your mark better. However, US distance runners also have the XC season, culminating with Footlocker (and that odd race up north), which does give them one more bite at the apple in their senior year.

Good luck, my wife is an alum and she liked, but that was a generation and a half ago.

hey wrote:

NoFatty wrote:

I see we have a Bucknell alumnus amongst us... and someone who actually believed the bombast they tell you at graduation.

*That's right future Bucknell graduates... you REALLY ARE as good as all the ivy-leaguers that got into schools which you couldn't get into.*

Isn't believing the ridiculous speeches they give at graduation proof that you've been inadequately educated?

rejected from bucknell? happened to me too...

Bucknell is garbage! Ok its not that bad, but no where near ivy league quality.

And that's half of it, the name. Who is going to get the job? A guy from bucknell or a guy from harvard?

I can only speak to my son's experience. He wasn't much of a miler but ran well at 2 miles and xc. Programs like Stanford definitely looked at his xc performance, especially performance in our national meets like Foot Locker. It may be less important for a miler but you'd have to be really really good. There are plenty of 4:10 milers in the states who are also nationally ranked xc runners. It's a bonus for the program if you can do both.

Top tier Ivy league schools without nationally ranked running programs would be happy to hear from you. 4:15 would be a very competitive time at a place like Harvard. Combined with good xc times, programs like Princeton would probably also be more than happy to hear from an excellent student athlete. Combined SAT scores around 2100 would be considered. For nonathletes, many 2400's get rejected. It definitely helps to be recruited.