Waldemar Cierpinski

he got a bronze in the marathon at the 83 world champs, nailing the swede kjell-erik stahl in the last 100m on the track.

tilastopaja.com lists some races:

13:36.6 (1975)

28:28.2 (1975)

8:32.4 steeple (1974)

It is "widely believed" that he took drugs to the same extent that it is "widely believed" that Washington was the first president. The opened files, though coded, pretty much prove the case.

cierpinski is #62

I think he retired in '84 (age 34)when he realized he wouldn't get a shot at a third medal. Plus Frank Shorter had issued death threats if he showed up in LA.

Waldemar Cierpienski, along with Abebe Bikila, the only two runners to win the Olympic marathon twice.

Cierpienski was an amazing competitor, running out of his head in the major competitions. If I recall correctly his Moscow marathon finished at 4:34 pace the last 2 kilometers, a faster and more competitively finished marathon than the one 4 years previous.

He liked running distance through the forests, and repeat sessions like 10-20 x 1000 meters.

After the Olympics he was a major part of starting a national fitness program in Germany.

Supposedly the evening after his Montreal win, he was so pumped that he couldn't sleep, and went for another run!

he was also a stasi informer.

Yeah, he was a Stasi informer or else. Like Heike Dreschler.

At age 51, I know I'm up there with the old timers...anyway, the thing that struck me watching Cierpinski is that he had an incredibly smooth stride albeit with a slight "bounce" that hinted at great elastic recoil in his legs. As much as Frank has been (appropriately) showcased as an elegant runner in regards to his stride, Cierpinski did not look "clunky" or awkward running beside Frank. Even allowing for Frank stiffening up somewhat in the rain, Cierpinski clearly showed that he could cover a lot of ground in an efficient manner. His run at Montreal looked just as smooth. Doping or not, he obviously had great talent.

Indiana

Not much credit should be given to Waldi (IMO) because even if all the other top marathoners had been on a systematic doping program (The Sohs and Seko of Japan, and all the top Americans) their program could not have come close to the meticulously planned and financed one of the East Germans.

I am in no way suggesting that every top runner had a doping program, but Track and Field News voted Cierpi' the top marathoner of the century and defended their choice by saying that all the runners passed the same (ineffectual) tests during the 70's and Cierpi' passed those also. Therefore even though he was an exposed drug cheat... he was ... in their book ... no worse than any other top competitor in the marathon.

I have no opinion on drugs during that time (at least not one I will share with you), but when asked in 1980 how many runners on the U.S. road racing circuit were doped Frank Shorter and Rod Dixon said 30-40%. When asked how many were doped when you include blood doping they said 70-80%.

Anyway, if you read just a little about the East German sports machine you get a good feel for how they didn't hold back anything when it came to preparation and no holds were barred when it came to experimenting with PE drugs.

I have a hard time seeing how the other 2:09-11 guys of the era could have had as sophisticated a program going. This is not based on inside info though, just speculation.

The Fixer wrote:

when asked in 1980 how many runners on the U.S. road racing circuit were doped Frank Shorter and Rod Dixon said 30-40%. When asked how many were doped when you include blood doping they said 70-80%.

not everyone was doped to the gills like shorter and dixon though.

TomM wrote:

Still, I'm interested in his career: what times did he run for shorter distances, how did he do in other marathons, when did he retire, does he have any comment himself on doping, etc etc.

Thanks

He raced against Jerome Drayton, Canada's best ever marathoner, after the 76 Olympics at the Fukuoka marathon

With 1976 being an Olympic year, Drayton poured all his energy and focus into winning in Montreal. One week before the event Drayton was to come down with a head cold, leading to further frustrations and a 6th place finish in a time of 2Hr 13min 30sec. With the disappointment of Montreal, Drayton travelled to Japan to contest the Fukuoka marathon against the Olympic champion Waldemar Cierpinski. The two athletes ran shoulder to shoulder for the first half of the race before Drayton asserted his authority to take victory in 2Hr 12min 35sec. This was Drayton's 3rd victory at Fukuoka.

taken from

The Fixer wrote:

I am in no way suggesting that every top runner had a doping program, but Track and Field News voted Cierpi' the top marathoner of the century and defended their choice by saying that all the runners passed the same (ineffectual) tests during the 70's and Cierpi' passed those also. Therefore even though he was an exposed drug cheat... he was ... in their book ... no worse than any other top competitor in the marathon.

In my March 2000 issue, their All-Century team lists Abebe Bikila as the greatest marathoner of the century. Cierpinski was listed as the best of the last 1/4 century -- and I'm firmly of the opinion that it was a wrong choice regardless of drug issues. Shorter's lone failure in the early/mid 70s was a silver medal in Montreal, whereas Cierpinski only had two notable wins in his entire career. The Olympics are big, but if they were using the same criteria as for their World Rankings, they'd have to take the whole career into account. All in all, I'd say Shorter is the #2 most-accomplished marathoner in history. I don't think the editors at the Holy Book of the Sport spent more than an afternoon on their All-Century team.

I recall Don Kardong lobbying hard to have Cierpinski's records expunged a few years ago when information about the GDR doping program came to light. Kardong would've won a bronze if that happened.

did he take drugs? what about Frank Shoter? still now days not very many americans running at his time. let's be honest waldemar was a Phenomenon marathoner.

Indiana wrote:

At age 51, I know I'm up there with the old timers...anyway, the thing that struck me watching Cierpinski is that he had an incredibly smooth stride albeit with a slight "bounce" that hinted at great elastic recoil in his legs. As much as Frank has been (appropriately) showcased as an elegant runner in regards to his stride, Cierpinski did not look "clunky" or awkward running beside Frank. Even allowing for Frank stiffening up somewhat in the rain, Cierpinski clearly showed that he could cover a lot of ground in an efficient manner. His run at Montreal looked just as smooth. Doping or not, he obviously had great talent.

Indiana

Here is some great footage of Cierpinski's smooth and efficient running action.

TomM wrote:

Still, I'm interested in his career: what times did he run for shorter distances, how did he do in other marathons, when did he retire, does he have any comment himself on doping, etc etc.

Thanks

He is the owner of a sport shop in Halle (small town in Eastern Germany). His son Falk is also a Marathon runner (national calibre, which doesn't meen that much these days in Germany...). All what I have seen from Waldemar Cierpinski is that he seems to be a cautious, almost shy and extremely friendly character.

Waldemar still holds the World Record for the 42.595K run.

olimpic marathoner non america wrote:

did he take drugs? what about Frank Shoter? still now days not very many americans running at his time. let's be honest waldemar was a Phenomenon marathoner.

Guys he ADMITTED to doping. Plus the Stasi files. Why the question marks?! I didn't read his Wiki but remember he won KMStadt in 2:13 and that's it, other than his Oly wins. Phenomenal responder perhaps, but we'll never know if he was anything other than sub-elite.