Daniels' Easy Pace?

What time of year is it? What's the goal? If it's aerobic development such as with Lydiard's conditioning phase? Then you should probably keep the easy days pretty quick because you won't be doing anything else. If you're inseason and running workouts then a hard easy run will only make you tired. Remember, you don't improve through the hard workouts you improve through the rest and recovery between workouts. A nice easy run does two things: 1. It allows your body to recover from the previous workout because you are running at an easy intensity 2. It allows you to circulate blood and stretch the running muscles out and the act of running itself can increase mechanical effeciency (one reason why you run easy instead of taking the day completely off).

So....it all depends on what you are trying to do....increase aerobic conditioning = run faster....rest between workouts = run slower. Don't be a fool and push push push everyday. You'll end up hurt or slow.

Alan

Thanks for contributing Alan, but I'm really hoping for direct insight through Daniels' eyes, since our debate revolves around the importance of his E pace range, and the scientific (and/or experiential) basis for it.

(That was also a gratuitous bump for Jack, btw...)

If you're not going to listen to other people, at least use the search function. This topic has been brought up countless times and jtupper has contributed in the past.

For what it's worth, I think Alan is dead on.

voice of reason wrote: If you're not going to listen to other people, at least use the search function. This topic has been brought up countless times and jtupper has contributed in the past.

Yeah, you're right, the search function does suck. Glad you found what you were looking for though.

I could argue that going at any pace, no matter how slow it may be, can be of some benefit (certainly beats sitting in front of the computer or TV), unless moving your body over ground is done with such poor mechanics that it leads to injury. I have often said that you should be able to say what the purpose is of every run that you go on, and if the purpose is to recover and relax, then pace is not so important (as long as the poor mechanics thing is kept at bay). Maybe the purpose of a particular run is to spend some time with a friend who is passing through town, and running together is cool -- that's a good purpose. There are days when running a little faster just feels better and if you feel better going a little faster than some pre-determined pace, then so be it. I originally set about 60% of VO2max as the easy pace, because you reach about maximum stroke volume with your heart at that intensity, so that muscle is benefitting greatly while not really working your body too hard. As a few have commented, you should take the training paces more as "guidelines," than laws(I gotta quit watching Pirates of the Caribbean).

Thanks a lot Jack. Appreciate your willingness to answer questions on here, in spite of the crap you sometimes have to put up with.

Yes,guidelines not laws. Stroke volume might be one consideration -- lots of variation there too of course-- but there is much more to consider, and sometimes that means thinking less rather than more, or throwing that formula right out the window. It all reminds me of the movie Life of Brian:

Brian: Look, you've got it all wrong! You don't NEED to follow ME, You don't NEED to follow ANYBODY! You've got to think for your selves! You're ALL individuals!

As my cat likes to say...

Fleas Navidad.

Alan, Jack:

So if I am going dirt slow on easy/recovery days am I missing out potentially gaining aerobic fitness/improvement?

No, you're not missing out on gaining aerobic fitnees/improvement if you run very slow. The purpose is to run at a pace that allows recovery, however slow.

The extra running trains the nervous system to recover better than no running.

It is foolish to believe that you need to run at a certain pace on the easy days, obsessive compulsive silliness.

J.O. wrote:

No, you're not missing out on gaining aerobic fitnees/improvement if you run very slow. The purpose is to run at a pace that allows recovery, however slow.

The extra running trains the nervous system to recover better than no running.

It is foolish to believe that you need to run at a certain pace on the easy days, obsessive compulsive silliness.

In your opinion. In my opinion, if I'm spending more than 75%+ of my total running time & miles on these easy runs, I would be a FOOL to not ask whether there is an optimal pace at which to run.

This isn't saying that I will spontaneously combust and the world will end at a less-than optimal pace. However, if I can go out and recover just as well for tomorrow's workout by running at 8:30 pace, 7:45 pace, and 7:00 pace, it stands to reason that one of those paces is "better" than the others. Not foolish at all, imo.

Alan has it right. I ignored this when younger, stopped improving and got injured

Plud you are over thinking it. Easy is what feels right for you nowbody else

One bit of science they did a study on horses over a set distance to measure the total calories burned at different speeds

There was an optimum pace where the horse moved using the least energy for this distance. It was slowish but not the horses slowest pace. That is your easy run pace.

I went on warm downs from the track with Ethiopian. They walked or did the slowest jog even though their house was 2 miles away. Nothing to prove so they could afford to go slow as they wanted

from the source wrote:

This isn't saying that I will spontaneously combust and the world will end at a less-than optimal pace. However, if I can go out and recover just as well for tomorrow's workout by running at 8:30 pace, 7:45 pace, and 7:00 pace, it stands to reason that one of those paces is "better" than the others. Not foolish at all, imo.

No it's not foolish but I think it's giving the subject a pretty brief consideration.

A pace that is easy one day is not be so easy another day. Anyone who has ever run with any regularity has experienced this. There is no optimal pace for every easy run is to ignore this completely. It might stand to reason that there is an optimal EFFORT to put forth each easy day but the pace that results from such effort could vary widely.

Heck, it might even stand to reason that the body responds best to different levels of effort on easy days and at different times of the season. Some incredibly easy, some just moderately easy, some even not so easy. Our bodies are not such fixed and deterministic machines that operate within the same parameters day in and day out. Our physiologies move in cycles. Perhaps effort should as well.