old and grouchy wrote:
and since you made such a point SHE has to qualify while the guys dont, I have to assume that you are concerned because Wie is female.
And of course I meant, "SHE DOESNT have to qualify while the guys DO".[/quote]
Dude, you should change yer name to old and senile. But since you caught the F-Up maybe it should just be old and forgetful.
old and grouchy wrote:
Your message seems to imply that "struggling men" deserve some kind of protection from women who may qualify over them. That to me, is the essence of affirmative action and related programs.
Um, sorry affirmative action has a little broader scope:
http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/affirmative-action/muni course hack wrote:
You still don't get it. See my original post - SHE IS GETTING A FREE PASS AND TAKING A QUALIFYING SPOT ON THE MEN'S TOUR FROM THE LAST POTENTIAL QUALIFYING GUY!
Is that concept difficult to grasp?[/quote]
I get it just fine, dipshit, I just don't care. What part of that was unclear to you?
Not that I follow this sport all that much, but it seems like there are other quite young (not as young as Wie, granted) women winning on the tour with something resembling star power, and, well..shouldn't Wie actually WIN something if we're gonna keep making a fuss over her?
The evidence on this thread suggests that runners are at leasy as whiney and self-important as Wie.
Muni Golfer and What's-His-Name ... No one but you cares how much you make, and it certainly doesn't prove your point. And no one but you cares how fast you used to be ... it's not doing much to advance your arguments either. We care about engaging posts, and both you guys come off as bores.
Dickshun aerie wrote:
old and grouchy wrote:Your message seems to imply that "struggling men" deserve some kind of protection from women who may qualify over them. That to me, is the essence of affirmative action and related programs.
Um, sorry affirmative action has a little broader scope:
http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/affirmative-action/
Good lord, of course it does. That is what I meant when I said "the essence". It didn't seem efficient or necessary to explain the term in precise and complete detail. I am not sure what is to be gained by it, but feel free to engage on this topic if it is somehow helpful to this discussion.
muni course hack wrote:
You still don't get it. See my original post - SHE IS GETTING A FREE PASS AND TAKING A QUALIFYING SPOT ON THE MEN'S TOUR FROM THE LAST POTENTIAL QUALIFYING GUY!
Why is it so hard of a concept to understand why she gets a free pass? It's strictly a business decision.
The sponsors want her because it gets them more visibility and publicity and higher attendance for the event. And they pay the bills which leads to larger tournament purses and more money for the PGA pros.
If they want to extend one of the "sponsor's" exemptions to Wie instead of some unknown, struggling golf pro then that's there perogative. That's why it's called a sponsor's exemption.
Here's a Wie story that, I belive happened last week at Kiawah, according to a friend of mine who works there. 2 guys pay $3k each to play a round with her on the Ocean course. She doesn't say a word to them for 9 holes. They are pissed, walk off the course, return to the clubhouse and demand their $$$ back!
the ladies... wrote:
She should never be allowed in LPGA events, nevermind PGA events, unless she decides to join the tour and act like an adult.
LPGA rules prevent Michelle Wie from joining the tour. There are very specific limits on the number of events for somebody under 18. I don't think Michelle is fighting that very hard, as continuing to play on the men's tour is generating tons of publicity for her (and her sponsors).
Wash Post Article wrote:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/06/04/AR2007060400812.html?nav=hcmodule
Disagree to a certain extent about the article. Comparing women's golf (Wie) and men's golf (Tiger) (like most sports where the two sexes compete) is apples and oranges. One has a dedicated following, including probably the hardest ticket in all of sports, while the other is a bit of a sideshow. If you don't win in men's golf, no one cares, even if you are a prodigy. If you win in women's golf, whether you are a prodigy or not, a little bit more than no one cares.
Team Wie is doing the right thing in taking the money and running while she still has the "teen prodigy" label. There is no guarantee that Wie will be in the spotlight later on, so why not cash in now? Since when is this a bad idea?
Mr. Obvious wrote:
LPGA rules prevent Michelle Wie from joining the tour. There are very specific limits on the number of events for somebody under 18.
Correct - a non-LPGA player who shoots 88 is barred for 2 years.
MWie is one of the most talented athletes in the world. She was driving +300yds @ 14. Made the cut in several mens events before she could drive a car. Tiger did not make a pro cut until he was *19*.
There are not a lot of 16yrs olds (she is 17 now) making $20/year. She plays golf, and that is all she knows. Behavior under these circumstances maybe unusual, but she is not acting like Bobby Fisher...
Off the Grid wrote:
Mr. Obvious wrote:LPGA rules prevent Michelle Wie from joining the tour. There are very specific limits on the number of events for somebody under 18.
Correct - a non-LPGA player who shoots 88 is barred for 2 years.
MWie is one of the most talented athletes in the world. She was driving +300yds @ 14. Made the cut in several mens events before she could drive a car. Tiger did not make a pro cut until he was *19*.
There are not a lot of 16yrs olds (she is 17 now) making $20/year. She plays golf, and that is all she knows. Behavior under these circumstances maybe unusual, but she is not acting like Bobby Fisher...
Where do you get your info? When did Wie make the cut in a men's event?
In every PGA tour event that she has entered, she has missed the cut badly.
I don't really care much either way about the OP, but she does seem to bail when the going gets rough.
Also, the comparison to Tiger is stupid. The PGA tour is much more competitive than the LPGA. Tiger won the amateur championship three times -what has she ever won?
Off the Grid wrote:
[quote]Mr. Obvious wrote:
There are not a lot of 16yrs olds (she is 17 now) making $20/year.
I should hope not. $20/year is slave wages.
Your message seems to imply that "struggling men" deserve some kind of protection from women who may qualify over them. That to me, is the essence of affirmative action and related programs.
No, his post implies the truth, that men who've earned their spot can have it yanked from them by someone who hasn't, based solely on the replacer's gender/race. But yeah, that sums up affirmative action quite nicely.
THAT YOU
WIE HAS WON NOTHING
She makes all of this money because she is an attraction. She hasn't done any on the LPGA or PGA tour except whine. I am glad Anika sold her out today
THANK YOU
WIE HAS WON NOTHING
She makes all of this money because she is an attraction. She hasn't done any on the LPGA or PGA tour except whine. I am glad Anika sold her out today
No, his post implies the truth, that men who've earned their spot can have it yanked from them by someone who hasn't, based solely on the replacer's gender/race. But yeah, that sums up affirmative action quite nicely.[/quote]
I have to concede that is a sound way of looking at it. Upon reflection I was hoping no one would take that tack.
However, the way I read it he is saying that even though the organisers have deemed Wie a "better" entrant (for whatever reason), that we should feel sorry for those that are displaced even though they are not as desirable (again in overall terms such as marketability, etc.). That sounds like protectionism to me, a protectionism that is not based on merit.
old and grouchy wrote:
I have to concede that is a sound way of looking at it. Upon reflection I was hoping no one would take that tack.
However, the way I read it he is saying that even though the organisers have deemed Wie a "better" entrant (for whatever reason), that we should feel sorry for those that are displaced even though they are not as desirable (again in overall terms such as marketability, etc.). That sounds like protectionism to me, a protectionism that is not based on merit.
Old and narrow-minded, how the feck do you come up with the above interpretation from this? - "......she is taking a qualifying spot from one of the struggling men?"
Once again, the number of entrants is limited and you have to qualify. She did not and was given a free pass and consequently a spot was taken from someone who did. Nice to see you are wising up. Again, don't put words in my mouth and automatically assume I am against affirmative action because your interpretation.
Way to make a snap judgement base on one sentence. Would you feel better if I had not used the word "struggling"? I guess you also know from a few posts that I am "a weird dude?" What runner isn't weird? Although Jennings is king.
One last question (so I don't make any assumptions) - How do you feel about Title IX being twisted to do away with select Men's collegiate sports?
Well, it looks like Annika Sorenstam agrees that she is acting . . . . well like a 17 year old girl with millions of dollars in endorsements would act.
Wie's wrist fuels spat with Sorenstam before LPGA Champs
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - A row between the world's two best known women golfers is raising the temperature for this week's LPGA Championship, with Annika Sorenstam saying Michelle Wie lacked class in dealing with a wrist injury.
Former world number one Sorenstam took issue with a decision by teenager Wie to withdraw from a tournament last week when she was 14 over par, citing a wrist injury, only to practice two days later.
"I just feel there's a little bit of a lack of respect and class just to leave a tournament like that and then come out and practice here," Sorenstam told a news conference.
Wie was 16 holes into the opening round of last week's tournament in North Carolina week when she pulled out, complaining of a wrist injury that had kept her from playing since January.
Two days later, the 17-year-old, who recently graduated from high school, was practicing at the Bulle Rock Golf Course in Maryland, the site of the LPGA Championship starting on Thursday.
Wie, who is not a member of the women's tour and has played courtesy of sponsors' exemptions, including in men's events, refused to back down.
"I don't think I need to apologize for anything," she said. "I just have to take care of my body and mover forward and only think of positive things."
Adding intrigue to her withdrawal was an LPGA rule that any non-member who shoots 88 or worse in a round is barred from the tour for the rest of the season. Wie was two bogeys away from that ignominious score.
"I don't think about 88," she said. "I mean, that's just ridiculous."
Wie's troubles were compounded when her playing partners in a pro-am event on Monday at Bulle Rock lodged a complaint, prompting LPGA Commissioner Carolyn Bivens to meet with Wie's father, B.J., and agent, Greg Nared.
Although the nature of the dispute was unclear, Wie was adamant she had been cooperative with her playing partners.
"I think it was very insulting because I tried my best," she said.
Wie, who earned close to $20 million in 2006 from endorsements, earnings and appearance money overseas, has struggled since tying for fifth place at last year's LPGA Championship.
(Writing by Simon Rabinovitch in London)
please, you're debating a contest that a 17 year old girl can compete with middle aged fat guys. It might as well be darts. It's not a sport.
In fact, it's not a sport if:
1. it has rain delays or cancellations: bbye baseball, golf, nascar, tennis.
2. judging determines the winner: bbye gymnastics, boxing, diving, figure skating, sych swimming (like you didn't know already).
3. you can eat a hot dog or smoke during the game: see golf, baseball, and introduce bowling.
4. 40 year old fat guys can still compete and win: see golf, baseball, nascar etc.
One other thing: I hate major league baseball. fat lazy slow competition for a fat lazy slow country that just wants to stuff their face nonstop.