The highlight at the Sept. 24 Kizuna Time Trials meet in Machida in western Tokyo was a solid 13:34.01 win in the fast heat by collegiate marathon record holder Asahi Kuroda (Aoyama Gakuin Univ.), not quite a PB but a good shakeout ahead of the Oct. 13 Izumo Ekiden.
Japanese marathoners are a different beast. Their endurance is so much better than their speed, in a way that's comical. IIRC, Yuki Kawauchi didn't even break 13:50, and he ran 2:08 in old shoes (2:07 with super shoes). There's some footage of him running the 800m, and he failed to crack 2.....
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For a marathoner 3:50 is actually very decent. I don't know what this thread is looking to accomplish. At the half and full, Japan is still levels above the west in terms of depth and when you look at median PRs of the top guys.
For a marathoner 3:50 is actually very decent. I don't know what this thread is looking to accomplish. At the half and full, Japan is still levels above the west in terms of depth and when you look at median PRs of the top guys.
Yes, Kipchoge ran 3:50 in his track prime... for the mile that is.
I mean - the junior guys can run however fast they want, they will all burn out slightly after reaching 20-22 and drop out, that's just a logical conclusion to the insane mileage they are doing.
Yuki Kawauchi did run 3:50 for 1500m though, so the dude was not without wheels altogether.
3:50 is terrible.
Kawauchi ran that 3:50 1500 something like 5 days after running a 2:11 marathon. Then the next day after running the 3:50 1500m he ran a sub 14 min 5000m. I don't think anyone can look at Kawauchi's PRs as being his ultimate potential given the crazy racing schedule he had over the years.
3:50 for a pro marathoner is amazing. The 1500 is a completely different wheelhouse from the marathon.
Nobody is suggesting that marathoners should run middle distance times equal to their marathon times, but you’re talking about a 1500 time that won’t score in a lot of conference meets. It’s a decent time for a marathoner trying to qualify for the trials, not a pro. 3:50 is only 40 seconds faster than the per-mile pace of a 2:08 marathoner. Every marathoner can run a single mile 40 seconds faster than MP.
For a marathoner 3:50 is actually very decent. I don't know what this thread is looking to accomplish. At the half and full, Japan is still levels above the west in terms of depth and when you look at median PRs of the top guys.
Yes, Kipchoge ran 3:50 in his track prime... for the mile that is.
true but kawauchi already ran a 2:10 marathon by the time he ran 3:50 1500, but his speed was definitely pretty bad for his marathon time
It blows my mind that the default conclusion isn't immediately, "Wow the Japanese are genetically suited for the marathon."
There are plenty of Kenyans doing Japanese training in Japan. They destroy the Japanese on the track. It's not the training - it's genetics.
Why would a nation with a lot more genetic diversity than the Kalenjin tribe somehow be less genetically versatile, uniquely suited to only the half marathon and marathon?
The Japanese are better at long road distances because that's what they care about. The most watched sporting event in the country is contested by college kids, over the half marathon distance, so their training emphasizes high volume at an early age.
More proof that the marathon is a competition of who can be more bored while training.
Takes like this are so bad.
It blows my mind that the default conclusion isn't immediately, "Wow the Japanese are genetically suited for the marathon."
There are plenty of Kenyans doing Japanese training in Japan. They destroy the Japanese on the track. It's not the training - it's genetics.
I've seen you post this a few times and I'm still surprised you think this. Do you honestly think genetics explains why they are so much better at the half marathon than the 10k? I mean sure, it might explain a difference between 1500m ability and marathon ability, but come on genetics is not the reason they're so good at the half marathon and marathon but not the 10k on the track.
On your Kenyans point, the top Kenyans also destroy the top Japanese in the marathon (and yes, that is largely due to genetics). I'd also point out the Japanese are quite good at the sprints compared to everyone except people of west African descent.
It seems clear to me all of the distance talent in Japan is focused on road racing, and that's the reason they're not more competitive in distance track races.
Letsrun consensus is that Japanese are bad at middle distance because they don't care about middle distance and are focused on half marathon and above. I feel like this consensus is wrong.
Look how much attention the Japanese 4x100 team gets. Look how much someone like Ryuji Miura gets attention in Japan for his 3000 steeplechase. Look how much attention someone like Rin Kubota gets. Look how much Olympic athletes in general in Japan get much more support and fame than they do in the U.S. There is a HUGE incentive for Japanese athletes to be successful in the middle distance events, they just struggle to do it. It's not just a training / focus thing.
