Big Gap on lactate(mmol) and aerobic zones

hard to say based on the info you’ve provided. You’ve said your easy pace has too high of a HR, but then tempo has too high a lactate. Have you done a full curve to get an idea of how you respond to different paces? 3.4 mmol is about right for tempo.

Also:

1. Is your HR measured with a chest strap, or a watch? Wrist HR measurements are notoriously inaccurate.
2. are you sure you’re measuring your lactate correctly? This isn’t as easy as some think - you need to clean the site (alcohol wipe), dry it, and take the second droplet of blood (wipe the first away). It’s also important you avoid skin contact - sweat contains lactate and can easily contaminate your sample giving a high reading.

Beyond that - most people run there easy days too hard. Think less about the pace and run by feel. If you run with people, can you have a conversation? If so that’s a good sign you’re in the right zone.

Based on lacate zones 3 to 4 mmol correspond to lactate threshold, tempo is like 2 to 3 mmol..

1. Yes i measure with coros heart rate armband which is accurate

2. yes i clean the finger and clean the first blood drop.. all the measures on training are in the same zone if i mantain the pace so its being correctly measured.

Well, i can have a conversation but im like 150bpm and the other person is like 135

15:30 for 5k with what shoes? Those training paces with what shoes?

I agree with the points above. A couple other thoughts:

What is your resting and maxHR? For some people 150 might not actually be that high.

3km and 5km, especially at your level, are fairly short “aerobic” races. Your ability to work above your threshold and tolerate lactate might be way above average. Do you have similar times for longer races, or are your times for 10km / HM etc. significantly weaker?

It’s not a bad idea just to accept your easy pace being what it is! Seems like you need to find out what happens if you really focus on aerobic development for a while.

Think about it this way;

Guys who run their 5k at 25 secs/km faster than you are generally running their easy days at 25 secs/km faster than you, so you aren't going too slowly - in fact, you're proportionally fairly spot on.

The question is, do you tend to be really bad at 10k compared to 5k? If so, then perhaps your second threshold is quite weak.

If not, then I'd assume there's some miscalculation. It's not unheard of for people to have a second lactate turning point above 4mmol. It's unlikely to be much higher than that, but 4.5mmol is possible.

Also, those calculators tend to be based on elite conversions in ideal conditions. I doubt you're tapering for these workouts or that you have the same conditions as you would on 5k race day. So, back off 5-10 secs/km and you should get a better training effect.

Takumi Sen 10 for the 5k, on the easy runs i wear adizero sl

Resting last time i measured after wake up it was 44, max hr by calculators is 196, i ran 2km on the track one time and hit 191 so i think its not so far from the truth..

My 10k time is 32:15

32:15 for the 10k, yes maybe im going to do a lab test to know exactly my zones on the lactate meter.

32:15 would suggest somewhere around 3:25/km for LT2.

However, as previously mentioned, you're likely not doing them in race conditions.

Maybe back off a little or break your threshold workouts into intervals. This should lower the lactate levels.

Yes, 3:25/km is the suggested but at 3:25 my bpm is a little higher than 180(which is my threshold heart rate),and on that pace i think my mmol is 5 to 6, i know that in 3:10/km my mmol is 7.4

Which meter did you purchase?

Makes a difference as well

also have you tried doing a step test protocol of any kind?

LactatePro2

I haven't tried that yet

HR is very individual, and there are huge variations in size, shape and wall thickness of cardios. You may have a smaller, strong walled cardio, that is like a higher-revving engine.

My own tends to max out about 172, and I'm generally operating at a much slower HR than most. Your max might well be 200+

That's a good way of thinking about it, i run threshold session at that bpm, when i race i can hit 195

Alright, so first off -

"Lactate Threshold Pace" is subjective based on multiple factors. The text book definition of "lactate threshold pace" is what you could hold for an hour. Now I'm assuming you put your 15:35 5k as your gauge for what your "Lactate threshold pace" is. However, this is assuming you are currently in 15:35 shape.

2.) Your mmol's will vary depending on multiple factors. Examples include training stimulus throughout the week, the duration of the repetition, the intensity of the repetition, and volume of the session. This also doesn't include factors such as stress from work, family, home life, sleep quality, school etc.

3.) Are you executing the workout correctly? Now for consistency sake we'll use the generic Norwegian workouts. Each workout has a different pace following the Lydiard Multi-Pace Training System. You are not running your "3:25/km" pace for each workout as you'll go flat and not improve. This is where the blood lactate comes into play. You use the blood to establish baselines of where your intensity needs to be whether you're aiming for a 1.5mmol, 2.5mmol, or 3.5mmol session (assuming you're going with the lab generic values of 2.0 - 4.0m. These floors and ceilings differ athlete to athlete). From here you learn the correct intensity for each workout and adjust as the readings come in. Example Workouts:

5 x 6 mins @ Aerobic Threshold effort -> Marathon effort (usually around 2.0mmol)

10 x 1k @ Marathon Effort -> Half Marathon Effort (Usually around 2.5 - 3mmol)

24 x 400 @ Half Marathon effort-> 10k effort (Usually 3 - 3.5 mmol)

16 x 400 @ 10k effort -> 5k effort (As you improve fitness, 3.5mmol - 4mmol)

My suggestion is ditch the monitor and run off efforts. As a 25y/o running 15:35, I wouldn't guess that your issue is proper threshold training. I would consider finding a coach, consistent mileage, sleep, diet, and recovery. Once those are locked in, you can start hitting the lactate meter to get those minor marginal gains that a lactate meter has to offer. Hope this helps.

EFFORT:

*is not a metabolite measurement

*Is not a HR

Nerds need to put your tools away (Strava included) and train by effort and feel & perceived intensity.

Underrated (and likely under appreciated) post.

Since my earlier reply, the OP has mentioned using several calculators, predictors, external HR monitor and a lactate monitor. Is there anything inherently wrong with using these? No. Are they required? Absolutely not (even for pros).

If you're determined the treat training as a science project (which believe me, I understand!), the post from Str8 Facts highlights some good zones for lactate. At a world class level, a 5000m race is run at 90-99% VO2max (before even considering the kick finish), with lactates often between 5-8 mmol. This is not indicative of what tempo/threshold pace is.