All this talk is hyping up Kerr vs. Ingebrigtsen when Cheruiyot ran a 3:28 two weeks ago. Assuming Ingebrigtsen will take out the race fast, I think he has a real shot at gold.
So Jakob runs almost two full seconds faster in that race and this somehow makes you think "yep, Cheruiyot has him"?
That's not what they're saying. They're pointing out that among all those being discussed as potentially upsetting Jakob, that it's surprising Tim isn't in the convo.
Whether anyone has much of a realistic chance of beating jakob outside of Kerr is a separate conversation.
But given how much conversation there has been around Nuguse or Hocker on this board, it's interesting how little conversation there has been around Tim.
All this talk is hyping up Kerr vs. Ingebrigtsen when Cheruiyot ran a 3:28 two weeks ago. Assuming Ingebrigtsen will take out the race fast, I think he has a real shot at gold.
Thoughts?
I think Tim is underrated as a potential silver or bronze medalist for sure. It still seems a bit unlikely that he'd beat both Jakob and Kerr with their fitness advantage (Jakob's advantage was obvious in Monaco, Kerr's expected based on Indoors/Pre). Everyone else is kind of our Westerner bias, as we rate Hocker, Nuguse, even Laros, Gourley, Nordas, Habz or Hoare higher at times. Before Tim got injured in the Budapest heats last year, he had run a fast (if untidy race) in Oslo as well as good 800/3000m races. Only Jakob, Yared or Kipsang would probably be rated higher. This year, he's been really good in all 3 Diamond Leagues and I'd say should be 3rd favorite with Yared/Cole right there behind with Komen, Reynold, and Laros (as a wild card). When considering whether Tim will win, a potential advantage for him will be he's probably learned somewhat from his 2022 experience. If Jakob wants to lead and make it fast, he won't challenge as much. If not, he'll be happy to lead a pace he can handle until Jakob wants to drop the pace. In 2022, clearly he tried to take the lead too often and burned out his finish (with Katir using an iffy inside pass/elbow that wrecked his momentum). I don't see a repeat of that now, and Monaco showed he's really strong.
This post was edited 1 minute after it was posted.
All this talk is hyping up Kerr vs. Ingebrigtsen when Cheruiyot ran a 3:28 two weeks ago. Assuming Ingebrigtsen will take out the race fast, I think he has a real shot at gold.
Thoughts?
i have cheruiyot as the top pick for bronze in my bracket. i have it going kerr-jakob-tim
that said, i wouldn't be surrpised at all if it goes jakob-tim-josh or jakob-josh-tim.
That's not what they're saying. They're pointing out that among all those being discussed as potentially upsetting Jakob, that it's surprising Tim isn't in the convo.
Whether anyone has much of a realistic chance of beating jakob outside of Kerr is a separate conversation.
But given how much conversation there has been around Nuguse or Hocker on this board, it's interesting how little conversation there has been around Tim.
Jonathan Gault mentioned that he picks Josh Kerr ahead of Timothy and Jakob to be Olympic Champion in the 1500m final!!!!!
It makes sense and Jonathan is right on the money!!!!!Josh is just as capable of 3:26:73 as Jakob. Jonathan said Danny Mackey watched how Josh nailed a 400x8 in 54 seconds each with 90 seconds rest in carbon plated supershoes and that was worth a 3:26 itself. Danny thinks Josh runs 3:26 in Monaco with Jakob but wasn't sure if it beat him.
I agree with all these points including the fact that Jonathan confirms Josh Kerr to be the superior kicker than Jakob a point which I have painstakingly reiterated endlessly since a few weeks ago and Jonathan can see it too!!!!
Jonathan didn't mention, however, that Josh Kerr is able to spread his legs hence his stride wider and larger in the final 100m sprint while maintaining the same cadence frequency as the rest of the competitors and this would be the determining factor for who reaches the finish line first. It's not the one who will turnover his legs faster, it's the one who can STRIDE HIS WAY to the finish line with the largest stride!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Remember how El G outkicked Bekele in Athens 2004?????? Jos Hermans commented that El G was just 'opening up his legs' like striding when he overtook Bekele and it looked so easy and effortless while Bekele was struggling to turnover his legs at a higher frequency as he had maxxed out his stride length but still failed to match El G and lost the race!!!!!
Same thing when El G overtook Lagat down the homestretch in the 1500m at Athens. He merely strode larger and opened up his legs wider and further to inch ahead of Lagat while Lagat had maxxed out his stride length and also resorting to turning over his legs at a higher frequency to catch El G but it didn't work!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
So in everything whether trying to get a WR in the mile/1500m or trying to win its major championships the defining factor for stardom and success, unlike in the marathon, is really about how wide you can open those legs of yours and how much real estate you can cover in 1 stride because the stride frequency is fixed at its natural frequency for the attendant stride length. Stride frequency is not something you shall force upon yourself, it's stride length that you force because you need to drive your legs into the ground and push off as far as you can in the finishing kick!!!!!!!
A good sprinter don't go into the finishing straight and think 'oh let's turnover my legs faster at a higher cadence' IF he can rather just open up his legs and allow them to determine and decide the elastic coefficient of natural frequency of its cadence with no conscious thought control going into it. Only athletes who don't have the ability to spread their legs, hence don't have the talent to run or sprint who resorts to trying to turnover their legs faster using conscious thought hence wasting precious energy thinking they will still beat those who spread their legs wider and spank them in the finishing straight!!!!
This post was edited 1 minute after it was posted.
That's not what they're saying. They're pointing out that among all those being discussed as potentially upsetting Jakob, that it's surprising Tim isn't in the convo.
Whether anyone has much of a realistic chance of beating jakob outside of Kerr is a separate conversation.
But given how much conversation there has been around Nuguse or Hocker on this board, it's interesting how little conversation there has been around Tim.
Hopefully that helps clarify the topic
What country do Hocker and Nuguse represent?
I'm aware there is a strong US bias on the board.
I'm not the one who posted the topic, just clarifying OPs question so we're all on the same page.
All this talk is hyping up Kerr vs. Ingebrigtsen when Cheruiyot ran a 3:28 two weeks ago. Assuming Ingebrigtsen will take out the race fast, I think he has a real shot at gold.
Thoughts?
I think Tim is underrated as a potential silver or bronze medalist for sure. It still seems a bit unlikely that he'd beat both Jakob and Kerr with their fitness advantage (Jakob's advantage was obvious in Monaco, Kerr's expected based on Indoors/Pre). Everyone else is kind of our Westerner bias, as we rate Hocker, Nuguse, even Laros, Gourley, Nordas, Habz or Hoare higher at times. Before Tim got injured in the Budapest heats last year, he had run a fast (if untidy race) in Oslo as well as good 800/3000m races. Only Jakob, Yared or Kipsang would probably be rated higher. This year, he's been really good in all 3 Diamond Leagues and I'd say should be 3rd favorite with Yared/Cole right there behind with Komen, Reynold, and Laros (as a wild card). When considering whether Tim will win, a potential advantage for him will be he's probably learned somewhat from his 2022 experience. If Jakob wants to lead and make it fast, he won't challenge as much. If not, he'll be happy to lead a pace he can handle until Jakob wants to drop the pace. In 2022, clearly he tried to take the lead too often and burned out his finish (with Katir using an iffy inside pass/elbow that wrecked his momentum). I don't see a repeat of that now, and Monaco showed he's really strong.
Didn't you read Noah???????
Jonathan spoke to Danny Mackey and took him at his word that Josh KERR is in 3:26 shape right now!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I mean NOW!!!!!!!! So there would be no difference in strength ability levels between Josh and Jakob. Both are equally strong in speed endurance but Josh has the upper hand in sprinting power which Jonathan observes and confirms as well and I agree!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Josh can kick better than Jakob, and if both are currently at 3:26 for their 1500m PBs hence also 3:43 for their mile PBs then it's quite obvious Josh stands more likely to beat Jakob in literally any type of race sit and kick or gun to tape!!!!! You feeling me Noah?????
Look through all the race videos again, Josh assumes a better sprinting technique and posture and is more poised to accelerate and change direction/momentum compared to Jakob.
Correct, the US folks keep brandishing the Hockers and Fishers so blatantly in all their titles and post content that you would know they are US folks LOL!!!!!!!!!!
It's so lame because obviously the 2 athletes they brandish the most turned out the most deceptive dopers I had ever discovered in my life, in all honesty.
Word of advice to US folks: if you folks wanna show subjectivity towards your athletes, please do so with discernment and ingenuity and not have an outsider from outside USA, like me Khamis, unceremoniously point out before US persons did that some of your athletes are so clear-cut dopers!!!! I don't mind the Nuguse rhetoric since he is clean as a whistle and his performances and behaviors make sense in space and time, but for the rest of the athletes like the Hockers and Fishers I think it's time you yourselves censure them actively and report them to USADA or something.
Not sure if he is just past his peak, or that his training partner and close friend got busted.
He's still inconsistant, and hasn't won a race this season. He pushed Jakob in Oslo when Jakob was coming back from injury and had run a 3:45 mile in the USA just five days previously.
He came 3rd in the Kenyan trials. When he won in Doha he had ran a 1:43.11 800m. Running 3:28.7 two seconds behind Jakob in Monaco makes you only an outside bet for a medal. Kerr would have ran 3:26 and Laros 3:27.
Of course, he is Kenyan, so there's always the possibility he could get boosted before the Games.
But he doesn't seem to have the fitness to handle rounds anymore. His best showing in a Championship since Tokyo is 2nd at the Commonwealth Games in 2022. He struggles to come in the top 3 even in Kenyan Championships these days.
Not sure if he is just past his peak, or that his training partner and close friend got busted.
He's still inconsistant, and hasn't won a race this season. He pushed Jakob in Oslo when Jakob was coming back from injury and had run a 3:45 mile in the USA just five days previously.
He came 3rd in the Kenyan trials. When he won in Doha he had ran a 1:43.11 800m. Running 3:28.7 two seconds behind Jakob in Monaco makes you only an outside bet for a medal. Kerr would have ran 3:26 and Laros 3:27.
Of course, he is Kenyan, so there's always the possibility he could get boosted before the Games.
But he doesn't seem to have the fitness to handle rounds anymore. His best showing in a Championship since Tokyo is 2nd at the Commonwealth Games in 2022. He struggles to come in the top 3 even in Kenyan Championships these days.
Mhmmm spot on darling!!!! You said it perfectly right, Kerr IS IN 3:26 SHAPE RIGHT NOW because he HAS TO BE just as good as Jakob right now, and especially if Danny Mackey his coach allays any fear that he isn't yet a 3:26 runner yet.
So as you can see right here, all we have done is subjectively impute the true value of Josh's 1500m PB using a variety of precursors without actually objectively presenting an actual 3:26 race before our eyes, you feeling me Coevett?????
That's the value and beauty of the subjective method when used astutely and properly!!!!!
And with Josh Kerr being the better kicker than Jakob and this one having more objective evidence from video evidence of his races and kicks, this gives Josh the greater probability of striking gold in Paris.
This post was edited 1 minute after it was posted.
Not sure if he is just past his peak, or that his training partner and close friend got busted.
He's still inconsistant, and hasn't won a race this season. He pushed Jakob in Oslo when Jakob was coming back from injury and had run a 3:45 mile in the USA just five days previously.
He came 3rd in the Kenyan trials. When he won in Doha he had ran a 1:43.11 800m. Running 3:28.7 two seconds behind Jakob in Monaco makes you only an outside bet for a medal. Kerr would have ran 3:26 and Laros 3:27.
Of course, he is Kenyan, so there's always the possibility he could get boosted before the Games.
But he doesn't seem to have the fitness to handle rounds anymore. His best showing in a Championship since Tokyo is 2nd at the Commonwealth Games in 2022. He struggles to come in the top 3 even in Kenyan Championships these days.
Watch their head to head from a couple weeks ago. Jakob crushed him the last lap, Tim is not beating that.
Jakob is on the upswing still. Kerr might have hung with him in Monaco, but Kerr is firing on all cylinders while Jakob is still improving ever day. Jakob will be in WR shape at the Olympics.
Not sure if he is just past his peak, or that his training partner and close friend got busted.
He's still inconsistant, and hasn't won a race this season. He pushed Jakob in Oslo when Jakob was coming back from injury and had run a 3:45 mile in the USA just five days previously.
He came 3rd in the Kenyan trials. When he won in Doha he had ran a 1:43.11 800m. Running 3:28.7 two seconds behind Jakob in Monaco makes you only an outside bet for a medal. Kerr would have ran 3:26 and Laros 3:27.
Of course, he is Kenyan, so there's always the possibility he could get boosted before the Games.
But he doesn't seem to have the fitness to handle rounds anymore. His best showing in a Championship since Tokyo is 2nd at the Commonwealth Games in 2022. He struggles to come in the top 3 even in Kenyan Championships these days.
Lol the mythical sub 3:29 Kerr
It's not mythical, it's SUBJECTIVE!!!!!!!! And subjectivity is sufficient or efficient enough for the purposes of this discussion. It's not like if Kerr doesn't right now prove to you he runs 3:26 that he will be hanged from the neck right????
Objectivity is NOT REQUIRED enough, nor SUSCEPTIBLE enough sir!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Efficiency is!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
This post was edited 1 minute after it was posted.
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