Amateur taking water bottles from spectator at marathon

My experience is that if you are just trying to qualify for boston only petty people care about enforcement of this rule. If you are winning your age group and the person you beat complains, you could might get dq'ed but it probably depends on the race director. If you get fast enough that you expect to place in the overall at a small marathon, email the race director, and they might let you put a bottle of drink of your choice at the bottle stations.

It is against the rules. Seems fine though, so long as race staff aren't around.

PS, I didn't mean to diminish your accomplishment of qualifying for Boston, just to say people care more about rules when the stakes get higher. Congratulations, recover well, and good luck!

Somebody page doublr. This screams marathoninvestigation front page.

The rule you quote says 'where' but not 'what'. I would argue that you broke no rule. Bring on the pina coladas!

Yes, you broke a rule and you are liable for disqualification (if a referee decides to disqualify you). Since nobody saw you breaking the rules, you get to decide for yourself how you feel about it. What was your time?

The only time I have seen someone get DQed for this is when she won the Baton Rouge marathon and was going for the OTQ.

You jest, but this is something that Derek would definitely put on his front page to endlessly shame the guy like he did for the runner friends running side by side.

It is kind of frustrating that not everyone in the race gets the same treatment. Especially since the pros typically have comped entries whereas the average Joe trying to break 2:30 or qualify for Boston has to pay $100+ just to compete. The pros don't have to carry fuel from the start line so why do we? I understand why the rule exists, and it does make sense for the comped entries that get personalized fueling bottles, but makes little sense for everyone else IMO.

It doesn't matter at all unless you plan on placing in a race or it's a USATF championship race (and you are a USATF athlete). If you're not USATF, or placing, who gives a sheet if you get DQ'd by some overzealous referee? Hobbyjoggers like us race for a time, not a place.

I'm curious about the exact wording of the rule and the way it is enforced.

If it is just part of the general ban on "outside assistance" which is a part of all USATF/WA competitions then there's some leeway on the interpretation. Technically, the elites are still subject to this so I would guess it matters if they pull the bottles off a table vs being handed them by some guy riding a bike next to them. If they grab it from a static object, nobody is helping them. But, then how do we account for "Bottle Klaus" from Berlin?

For example, can I just drop a bunch of bottles on the course and pick them up when I run past? Nobody is helping me there.

posting the rule I found:

RULE 241
MEDICAL AND REFRESHMENT SERVICES FOR ROAD EVENTS
1. The organizers of road races should provide appropriate medical and refreshment
services for all competitors.
(a) Medical examinations - A hands-on medical examination during the progress of
an event by designated medical personnel clearly identified by the organizers
shall not be considered assistance.
(b) Adequate first aid facilities should be available.
(c) A competitor must retire from a race immediately if directed to do so by a duly
authorized member of the race medical staff. See Rule 144.4(c).
2. Drinking / Sponging and Refreshment Stations
(a) Water and other suitable refreshments shall be available at the start and finish of
all races.
2019 USATF Competition Rules - 135
(b) For all events, water shall be available at suitable intervals of approximately 5km.
For events longer than 10km, refreshments other than water may be made
available at these points.
NOTE 1: Where conditions warrant, taking into account the nature of the event, the
weather conditions and the state of fitness of the majority of the competitors, water
and/or refreshments may be placed at more regular intervals along the route.
NOTE 2: Mist stations may also be arranged, when considered appropriate under
certain organizational and/or climatic conditions.
(c) Refreshments may include drinks, energy supplements and/or foodstuffs. The
Organizing Committee will determine which refreshments it will provide based
on prevailing conditions.
(d) The Organizing Committee may permit athletes to provide their own
refreshments, in which case the athlete shall nominate at which stations they shall
be made available to the athlete. Refreshments provided by the athletes shall be
kept under the supervision of officials designated by the Organizing Committee
from the time that the refreshments are lodged by the athletes or their
representatives. Those officials shall ensure that the refreshments are not altered
or tampered with in any way. In National Championships of 20k and longer, the
Organizing Committee shall make provisions for the collection and distribution
of personal refreshments for those competing for the championship, as
determined by the Games Committee.
(e) The Organizing Committee shall delineate, by barriers, tables or markings on the
ground, the area from which refreshments can be received or collected. It should
not be directly in the line of the measured route. Refreshments shall be placed so
that they are easily accessible to, or may be put by authorized persons into the
hands of, the athletes. Such persons shall remain inside the designated area and
not enter the course nor obstruct any athlete. No official shall, under any
circumstances, move beside an athlete while he is taking refreshment or water.
(f) An athlete may at any time carry water or refreshment by hand or attached to his
body provided it was carried from the start or collected or received at an official
station.
(g) A competitor who collects refreshment from a place other than a refreshment
station is liable to disqualification by the Referee.
NOTE: A competitor may receive from or pass to another competitor refreshment,
water or sponges provided it was carried from the start or collected or received at an
official station. However any continuous support from a competitor to one or more
others in such a way may be regarded as unfair assistance and warnings and/or
disqualifications as outlined above may be applied.
(h) For Mountain, Ultra-Marathon, and Trail Races, athletes may receive
physiotherapy (massage, etc.) at official stations. This may be done by personal
representative

So per (f) I would say it is legal if you have someone hand you a bottle at an aid station

only if they were authorized to do so by the race. also, nobody generally cares unless there's prize money, and another athlete files a complaint. there are probably 50 unauthorized 'aid' stations in most big marathons. Take an orange slice from a kid, that's a DQ, drink a beer from a frat, that's a DQ... fortunately, this is one of the cases where people don't ruin the fun for the majority to protect rules that may only be important for a few.

It would be fine to do that if the race staffs are not stand near you.

I see USATF is focused on the real important things: keeping people from hydration. I mean I get wanting to discourage it because it could create course congestion issues, but let's be real, a 26 mile course is a long course and the cups at aid stations get you maybe two sips of water or electrolytes. If somebody wants to stay hydrated by constantly sipping a bottle, that seems fine. USATF even allows athletes to carry a bottle by hand in the rules. But a 32 oz bottle of water or electrolytes isn't going to last 26 miles. Given the number of people who end up in medical tents for dehydration after marathons, one would think USATF would want to encourage non-elites to hydrate. Giving non-elites opportunity to pick up one bottle from a spectator at designated sections of the course probably would cut down the number of dehydration incidents. And it might bring people out to the marathons, and make them feel part of the race, if they get to be the "pit crew" for their friends/family. Enterprising race directors might even give the crew the opportunity to buy a t-shirt.

The rule is only meaningful for those competing for awards. Not everyone would have the same pit crew.

I agree. But you could keep the rule by saying, "Any USATF Member competing in the elite field of a USATF sanctioned marathon, current rule; for non-USATF members and USATF members not competing in the elite field." Dehydration events are real, see NYC last year. USATF shouldn't be doing things that actively discourage hobby joggers from taking water if they need water. The rule is ridiculous.

If the person puts the bottles on the ground and you "happen to find" them during the course of your race, I think this is technically legal since nobody is handing them to you?