Woody's defense of Shelby on the Letsrun podcast is extremely weak. I can't see how you can be clean and continue to say what he said. Really suspicious
Woody Kincaid is charting his own path in the running world for the first time as a professional. He opens up why he left Bowerman, his desire for American records, and a lot more including Shelby Houlihan.
What a special podcast we have for you. We sit down with both American record holders from the weekend Yared Nuguse of the On Athletics Club and Woody Kincaid of Nike. First up is Yared and he talks about his 7:28.24 American...
I actually think the opposite. I think there is a case that some defenders are just very naive which leads me to think that they are not doping themselves. They just assume that other athletes are like themselves. A cynic and someone who is on peds would be kind of moronic to actually defend a proven doper since it would just attract more heat to themselves.
This post was edited 17 seconds after it was posted.
I can imagine it being hard to admit someone you were close to was doping, especially when they maintain they're clean. Like if one of the Coffee Club guys got popped I'd probably jump off a bridge or something, and I've never even met them.
I actually think the opposite. I think there is a case that some defenders are just very naive which leads me to think that they are not doping themselves. They just assume that other athletes are like themselves. A cynic and someone who is on peds would be kind of moronic to actually defend a proven doper since it would just attract more heat to themselves.
There is no way that professional runners immersed in the sport themselves are that unaware or naive about doping. I get defending his friend, but Woody himself put up a suspicious performance over the weekend and his continued defense of a teammate is a red flag.
What a special podcast we have for you. We sit down with both American record holders from the weekend Yared Nuguse of the On Athletics Club and Woody Kincaid of Nike. First up is Yared and he talks about his 7:28.24 American...
Pathetic bunch of LR weenies still harping on about Shelby (and others). Good for Woody for standing up for Shelby and being a real friend. The rest of you judgemental creeps that think you know all the facts and yet continue to slander and libel Shelby and others, your destinations in life are not good.
--we don't know how she got nandrolone in her system, and the burrito was the best option she could think of, but no one can deny the nandrolone was there.
--Her actions and the way she acted, tells him that she did not know she had nandrolone in her system, because she didn't miss the test and it wasn't in her hair.
--the burrito thing that people latched onto was unfortunate because it doesn't show the actual story which was that she just doesn't know how it got into her system.
--He'd always defended Shelby is innocent and believes it still.
--In terms of how it affected his life: the situation shook Bowerman up, because people are assuming everyone is doping, and it shook Jerry to the core.
Essentially he just believes his friend, and because he (without evidence) believes unintentional he believes it should be two years.
Pathetic bunch of LR weenies still harping on about Shelby (and others). Good for Woody for standing up for Shelby and being a real friend. The rest of you judgemental creeps that think you know all the facts and yet continue to slander and libel Shelby and others, your destinations in life are not good.
can you expand on the facts that we are missing around Shelby?
By the way, I listened to Travis Tygart say that "he found that entire case very odd" and to be honest, he didn't sound convinced about Shelby either and he is the main guy trying to take down dopers... That was on podcast.
Show The Running Effect Podcast, Ep CEO Of USADA Travis Tygart Shares His Story, Taking Down Lance Armstrong, The Shelby Houlihan Case & Thoughts On Keeping Sport Clean - Dec 16, 2022
Pathetic bunch of LR weenies still harping on about Shelby (and others). Good for Woody for standing up for Shelby and being a real friend. The rest of you judgemental creeps that think you know all the facts and yet continue to slander and libel Shelby and others, your destinations in life are not good.
By the way, I listened to Travis Tygart say that "he found that entire case very odd" and to be honest, he didn't sound convinced about Shelby either and he is the main guy trying to take down dopers... That was on podcast.
I actually think the opposite. I think there is a case that some defenders are just very naive which leads me to think that they are not doping themselves. They just assume that other athletes are like themselves. A cynic and someone who is on peds would be kind of moronic to actually defend a proven doper since it would just attract more heat to themselves.
That doesn't make it opposite. If a reasonable human was in an elite track club and a member got popped for doping, I think most reasonable humans would distance themselves from that. Unless other reasons were compliciet in why they didn't.
Interesting. It's funny because Shelby said in the past that Travis supported her and he in fact made clear here that he does not.
yes indeed that was obvious. travis specifically said, like so many others, that the burrito story does not hold water.
sadly when woody repeated the lie that the dope could have been in the burrito, noone of the interviewers corrected him. although really by now we all know better. very poor journalism.
It's to be expected that someone close will earnestly look at situations in a supportive/positive light. That's why families of convicts often believe in their innocence. Sometimes they are even right (see innocence project).
I wouldn't cast support for a friend in that situation in a negative way. We are all subject to that bias, unless you are an unfeeling bot.
Interesting. It's funny because Shelby said in the past that Travis supported her and he in fact made clear here that he does not.
yes indeed that was obvious. travis specifically said, like so many others, that the burrito story does not hold water.
sadly when woody repeated the lie that the dope could have been in the burrito, noone of the interviewers corrected him. although really by now we all know better. very poor journalism.
Yes, Tygart said the burrito was not a viable pathway for the positive test. And for the record, Shelby has also said that. By the end of the case, she was clear that it wasn't the burrito.
But back to Tygart, you are right that he said it wasn't the burrito but that he also believed that ingesting tainted supplements was giving rise to a lot of the false positives we are seeing. In fact, they can now excuse an athlete for a micro-infraction if the supplements can be shown to be tainted.
I learned a lot from that podcast. He walked us through his thinking and the interviewer (a kid?) didn't interrupt much, which I thought was great podcasting. He let the star guest do the talking.
* She couldn't blame a big corporate box store or a corporate restaurant. They are run by m.b.a.s and IT guys. Her lie would have been proven quickly.
* She couldn't blame the large supplement/vitamin companies. They put m.l.b. & n.f.l. on notice.
S H had two choices: Tell the truth or blame the Mexican vendor. We know the options she chose. Since S H did the most awful choice, she is being properly punished.
True, Travis said that some supplements may be tainted, generally speaking. He never said that Shelburrito's vitamins could have contained nandrolone though, because that would be too embarrassing.
--we don't know how she got nandrolone in her system, and the burrito was the best option she could think of, but no one can deny the nandrolone was there.
--Her actions and the way she acted, tells him that she did not know she had nandrolone in her system, because she didn't miss the test and it wasn't in her hair.
--the burrito thing that people latched onto was unfortunate because it doesn't show the actual story which was that she just doesn't know how it got into her system.
--He'd always defended Shelby is innocent and believes it still.
--In terms of how it affected his life: the situation shook Bowerman up, because people are assuming everyone is doping, and it shook Jerry to the core.
Essentially he just believes his friend, and because he (without evidence) believes unintentional he believes it should be two years.
This! Thank you for clearly explaining a reasonable defense of Shelby, just because there was nandrolone in her system, doesn't mean she knows how it got there. The drug testing and suspensions though put that burden on the athletes. WADA, AIU, and USADA do not make any effort to determine intent. Shelby was caught and suspended, but we do not have any additional facts related to intent. They everything else is speculation.
It's to be expected that someone close will earnestly look at situations in a supportive/positive light. That's why families of convicts often believe in their innocence. Sometimes they are even right (see innocence project).
I wouldn't cast support for a friend in that situation in a negative way. We are all subject to that bias, unless you are an unfeeling bot.
Actually, I think it'd be expected that people would (at least publicly) distance themselves from someone whose positive test shines a negative light on them and their own careers. As a professional, Olympic runner, with years of training, sacrifice and investment in his craft, you'd think Woody would not do anything to have suspicion cast on him. Given the choice to keep your job without impediment or support a friend who lost her job breaking some important rules (and this situation threatening to disrupt your coaching and opportunities in your job), what would you choose?
