Sure. If you're going so slowly that you're forced into a distinctly different motion from what you'd use at a racing speed, that's probably too slow. If you're just at that speed to gain general aerobic fitness, I think you'd be just as well off--probably better, actually--to cycle or walk uphill on a treadmill or do water running or swimming or Elliptical, etc.
I briefly ran with a guy whose "easy" pace was agonizingly slow--probably closer to 9min/mile than 8. But he ran that speed with full strides and a very slow turnover. When he sharpened up he was able to handle 5min pace with no trouble.
I think this was one of the main benefits of Igloi's workouts: You spent most of your time in a distinctly running motion.
Can someone train/run too slow? That's the question.
Yes, if you tried Maffetone and it breaks your form to the point where you realize it's mostly junk science, you can run *too* slow. But by going a little bit faster but still keeping your HR down, that is how you get EZ runs in without sloppy form and messed up mechanics.
Thank you guys, this is helpful and the answers are clearly. I also had the feeling that too slow is not optimal.
Sometimes I think we overthink this. For our intervals, we need to hit a certain pace, or at least within a certain range. Tempos and thresholds are similar, in that we're challenging our body and the goal is to hit a certain pace, or at least a certain intensity by effort or perceived exertion.
But on recovery days, the goal isn't to go "fast enough." The goal is to recover, but still get some aerobic training in while the body repairs and absorbs the workout. We should run these slower than the other days. But what's "too slow"? Well, if it feels too slow, it probably is. Recovery days should feel like a pace you can maintain all day with minimal effort. It shouldn't feel so slow that it's torture, hopping in slow motion one leg at a time. You can't do that all day.
If you ran your fast days fast enough, slow should feel good. It shouldn't feel too fast and it shouldn't feel too slow. Just run these at a pace that feels easy and good for you, and don't look at your watch until you're done. Finish the run feeling you could easily do it all over again. This is your day not to worry about pace numbers.
The thing is not so simple. Let's say we run 80% of our weekly endurance training time at an easy pace. The most people mean with that below VT1/LT1. That's a quite big range.
E.g. 10kph and 13kph can be both below 14kph (e.g VT1/LT1) and it is not the same training for all diferent physiological systems. You trigger more and possible a little other muscle fibers at 13 kph and there are other effects i do not mention. How can someone shift the pace at LT1/VT1 the same way as someone who trains close to it compared to someone how trains far away (too slow) from it?
This post was edited 3 minutes after it was posted.
Yes, if you tried Maffetone and it breaks your form to the point where you realize it's mostly junk science, you can run *too* slow. But by going a little bit faster but still keeping your HR down, that is how you get EZ runs in without sloppy form and messed up mechanics.
Weren't you using maffetone training recently? Did you have a change of heart, or am I misremembering?
How can someone shift the pace at LT1/VT1 the same way as someone who trains close to it compared to someone how trains far away (too slow) from it?
Lexel it sounds like you're trying to make an anti-scientific appeal to common sense like my HS coach would. "If you wanna get fast, you gotta run fast". Just throw out the book on the aerobic system. Forget that extremely slow miles still have an effect on MLSS, and an even more pronounced effect on LT1/VT1/OBLA/whatever you want to call it. You make it sound so simple.
How can someone shift the pace at LT1/VT1 the same way as someone who trains close to it compared to someone how trains far away (too slow) from it?
Lexel it sounds like you're trying to make an anti-scientific appeal to common sense like my HS coach would. "If you wanna get fast, you gotta run fast". Just throw out the book on the aerobic system. Forget that extremely slow miles still have an effect on MLSS, and an even more pronounced effect on LT1/VT1/OBLA/whatever you want to call it. You make it sound so simple.
Prove it! Show me that paper.
Of course you have some training effect, but the question of all questions is, is the more intense, and it has to be a manageable easy pace, not the better training especially for recreational runners.
Based on the fundamental principle, 'you get better a that what you train', too slow can be inefficient. Period :)
P.S: Your HS-Coach is on the right path.
This post was edited 2 minutes after it was posted.
Sure. If you're going so slowly that you're forced into a distinctly different motion from what you'd use at a racing speed, that's probably too slow. If you're just at that speed to gain general aerobic fitness, I think you'd be just as well off--probably better, actually--to cycle or walk uphill on a treadmill or do water running or swimming or Elliptical, etc.
I briefly ran with a guy whose "easy" pace was agonizingly slow--probably closer to 9min/mile than 8. But he ran that speed with full strides and a very slow turnover. When he sharpened up he was able to handle 5min pace with no trouble.
I think this was one of the main benefits of Igloi's workouts: You spent most of your time in a distinctly running motion.
That's the bit I struggle with (after 50 years of running). If I'm going to run slow I end up with my normal 190 stride/per minute turn over and a tiny stride.