Had a huge running breakthrough today. Thanks to taking LRC's advice.

Here is my strava:

https://www.strava.com/activities/7681412403

Happy for you, man. It's amazing how giving yourself permission to back off on pace allows building that base. Then once the body is tolerant of the higher mileage, adding in faster pace work for 5, 10 or 20% of the mileage, pays off even more.

The coach I'm current working with has me running so slow on easy and recovery days, it drives me nuts. But come speed-work day, I'm really able to go for it, and hit paces ranges I never could before.

Good job, man.

You are welcome!

There is a LOT of knowledge in this forum if you get passed the Brojo crap, mods deleting stuff and the average Russian troll post.

Thank you again! EZ days EZ is a THING. Being able to run 50-60 mpw without soleus/gastroc and/or tallus flare-ups is amazing. Running at 8:50-9:15 pace EZ at low HR is awesome, you feel like you could go forever at that pace.

The weird thing is I because I wasn't looking at my watch, if I could have guesstimated effort, it would have been 8:50-9:00 by feel...I was so surprised to see 7:xx on this, and I almost stopped because I thought the watch was broken.

Yep! Or Jan. 6 insurrection crap.

Yes; this is easy pace.

Look at, say Scott Fauble. Marathon PR is 2:08:52. According to his book, the bulk of his easy runs are around 7:00 pace. According to the usual tables, this would be his race pace for some distance between 100k and 100 miles. So in fact he could run all day at that pace.

What else is useful in his book? I may pick it up and add it to my library next to Pfitz/Douglas's Advanced Marathoning book and Hanson's MM.

I'm also realizing that what works for me might not work for others (duh, it's obvious, but not until you are older and have more experience do you realize what that truly means).

I am a volume monster and realize, after looking back at my personal diary and training log, that intervals, too much speedwork and Hanson's-like fast work got me hurt in late 2021. That was on me but I know that now.

When I ran my 2019 3:24 I did a few weeks of 3x1600 and some Yasso 800s but by and large most of my training was base, progression ending/fast-finish runs and the traditional long run (4-5 20-21s, 4-5 16-18s).

Even dating back to HS XC and post-college jogging my best times (and the 2008 5k training attempt) came on sheer volume, a few tempos and progressions, and a modest taper for a given race.

Why don't you focus on 8k or 10k? Why this unoriginal obsession with the 'thon?

Changing up/slowing down your training pace isn't revolutionary at all.

Change up your running form (for the better) - that is revolutionary.

Adding an insole insert to your right shoe to balance out your leg inbalance - that is revolutionary

Running with a Bic lighter in one hand - that is revolutionary.

Get back with us when your revolutionary methods produce long-term, consistent results.....AKA in 2 years.

I love the challenge and blend of everything required in the Marathon. They don't have 8k races where I live.

I do think at some point I'll step back and focus on 5k/10k efforts next year and take a break from the marathon.

Congrats man. Love to see LRC homies crushin their runs.

Wow. In another thread you're so modest and humble about your ability- you're quite good. How many runners can do a 20 miler at any pace?

This is another inspirational thread!

The book is "Inside A Marathon", and everything in this book is useful. It is essentially an annotated log of Fauble's training for NYC 2018. A book on what someone actually did, why he did it, and where he got it right and wrong is invaluable.

Dude, I think you've gotta stop extrapolating from MP-ish/slightly faster pace runs. You ran 5 miles easy, then you ran a bit faster than MP for five miles. This indicates very little. You cannot really read too much from an effort that was slow enough for you to run 2-3 times as far. I'm not trying to knock down a good workout, I'm trying to get you to stop trying to read the tea leaves after every single run. Think about something else!

It's a great read. Just note, however, that Faubs was running these paces in Flag at altitude. Matt Fitzgerald noted how slow NAZ runs during WU/CD and easy runs, but also consider altitude adjustment.

Dr J, I think your GPS may have been going haywire. Check out the wack route that was recorded on an out-n-back:

Open image

Other indicators of GPS malfunction: did you run a 1:07 400 at some point in the run, as your data suggests?

My rule of thumb: when I pop off a really good performance at an unbelievably low effort, I check the data first.

Yeahhh more indications of GPS glitches:

ibb.co

j

Image j hosted in ImgBB

Open link

Either that, or you ran mad hard

I saw that too. When I saw the low 7:00 split I almost stopped and thought my watch was broken. I ran an even/steady effort throughout, but sped up the last 20 seconds just to see if I could break 80 minutes. HR didn't spike or go up radically even at the faster paces.

I do think the mapping was screwy when I looked at the Strava. That said before each run I make sure GLONASS is on and it sets properly for HR and mapping (green circle around the watch) before starting my run each day.