Seeing her dispatch a world class women's field annoys me to no end. When will they limit these races to XX only? This is ridiculous.
Seeing her dispatch a world class women's field annoys me to no end. When will they limit these races to XX only? This is ridiculous.
She is one of the best things to ever happen to the sport. Enjoy her while you can.
I have a lot of sympathy for Niyonsaba, whereas I have zero sympathy for trans women trying to compete in elite sport.
If you were born without male genitalia, it would be natural to assume you were female. In reality, she is intersex, but 100 years ago, no one likely would know that as we wouldn't know her chromosones, her testoerone levels or her lack of a uterus.
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SAME
The topic of intersex women competing against XX women is an interesting one.
I consider myself very left liberal, yet I think their inclusion into the women’s category should be monitored/held to the same guidelines as XX women.
Brought this discussion up with conservative family members once and they disagreed. They felt that even though they XY chromosomes/internal testes, they should be allowed to compete unencumbered in the womens category. Was very surprised to learn this.
I guess just goes to show how nuanced this topic is.
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THIS ^
The world is full of complications that didn't exist decades ago, because we just didn't know.
It's not that complicated. No female can beat Nyonsaba in a kick because the testosterone makes a huge difference. XX deserves their own category. Simple solution.
Not that simple, Big Tex. There are people who are chromosomally XX, but have the SRY gene and develop a full male phenotype, including external genitalia, testes, the whole 9. Could they sign up for your XX category?
100 years ago, women wer'nt even "permitted" to run in this distance of race so the likes of Niyonsaba et al would have had no-one to run against except men.
"Intersex" isn't really a scientific term. Factually, Niyonsaba is a XY male with poor or limited development of primary but not secondary sexual characteristics. Niyonsaba isn't part woman, part man but an XY male with developmental differences.
Ultimately, this situation arose because they lacked the data to extend the 400m-1500m prohibition on a common sense basis to the other events. Yet, Niyonsaba to this date has not run faster than 14:25 or 8:19, so it may be that we'll have a different world champion in the 5000m and 10000m among the several athletes with sub-14:10/29 flat ability. For the 100m/200m, Mboma is injured right now but showing every chance of running world record caliber in the latter, if not yet medal quality in the 100m.
Agree. This is farking outrageous and nothing less than an assault on women’s sport.
There is a women’s and men’s section for a reason.
It’s damn common sense. No data required. Just like there is probably no data comparing thr head-to-head speed of a racehorse vs a frog. It’s dumb. There is no elite women’s sport if XY men are allowed to compete.
Wrong. They were doing Barr body tests (cheek swabs) to check for male chromosomes in female athletes back in the 1960s.
The Stache wrote:
Not that simple, Big Tex. There are people who are chromosomally XX, but have the SRY gene and develop a full male phenotype, including external genitalia, testes, the whole 9. Could they sign up for your XX category?
Straw man argument. Anyway, We’re not worried about the extremely rare 0.001% of Xx females who present as males at birth dominating female sports. Agreeable, they present as Males, they‘ll be in male sports and assume they’re male. So, not really a worry for female sports.
Even in 3rd world countries, these kids of disorders becomes very obvious around puberty. These Xx present with under formed tested and low testosterone.
the Niyonsabas and Semenyas are fully functioning males (just with no overt penis). At puberty they’ll know full well (no breasts, no periods) that they are not female. It’s embarrassing for them. However they KNOW full well that they have a huge advantage over natural females. To continue into adulthood and pretend that they don’t is absolutely disgraceful and immoral.
=70[hionlk/ wrote:
Factually, Niyonsaba is a XY male with poor or limited development of primary but not secondary sexual characteristics. Niyonsaba isn't part woman, part man but an XY male with developmental differences.
To be blunt (since too many people beat around the bush about this topic) Niyonsaba is a male who had a birth defect that caused the penis not to grow. Does male without a penis equal female? No.
rojo wrote:
I have a lot of sympathy for Niyonsaba
Having a front page headline, this thread, and a comment in the meet thread outing her as XY doesn’t strike me as being very sympathetic.
BigTimeRetiredCoach wrote:
outing her as XY doesn’t strike me as being very sympathetic.
Niyonsaba was known to be XY several years ago. That's nothing new. That's the whole reason that Niyonsaba can't compete in events from 400 - mile.
rojo wrote:
I have a lot of sympathy for Niyonsaba, whereas I have zero sympathy for trans women trying to compete in elite sport.
If you were born without male genitalia, it would be natural to assume you were female. In reality, she is intersex, but 100 years ago, no one likely would know that as we wouldn't know her chromosones, her testoerone levels or her lack of a uterus.
Well even sans balls she would have given you all you could handle in your prime so maybe save that sympathy for someone who needs it.
Am I living in the twilight zone? The Boston Marathon weather was terrible!
Is there a rule against attaching a helium balloon to yourself while running a road race?
How rare is it to run a sub 5 minute mile AND bench press 225?
Move over Mark Coogan, Rojo and John Kellogg share their 3 favorite mile workouts
Matt Choi was drinking beer halfway through the Boston Marathon
Mark Coogan says that if you could only do 3 workouts as a 1500m runner you should do these