20 Japanese men just broke 2:10 at the 2022 Tokyo Marathon

We have way faster track runners

Outside of Rupp and to his credit, Stinson, there is not one American willing to ‘race’ a marathon. All opt for a controlled paced time trial. Hence…we suck.

If you think 20 is a lot, realize 21 Japanese men broke 2:10 in Tokyo in 2020.

What are we doing wrong? Genetically, they are made for the marathon and aren't good at the track so everyone does it. I would think most NCAA All-Americans in xc if they were well-suited for the marathon would be able to break 2:10 if they trained for it full time until they were 30 and raced in the bongo shoes.

Only 20??

They've had twice as many break 2:10 in a race before.

And despite it all (including their insane Olympic Trials standards) and five years to prepare they didn't produce much in the Olympic marathon in their home country (outside of Osaka who trained in the US).

2021

Japan

6th

62nd

73rd

USA

8th

29th

41st

I guess it was better than Ethiopia who produced three DNF's.

Huh. Might people from the Great Rift Valley have genetic predispositions toward distance running too? That 2% of the global population sure wins more than their share of marathons. Men and women.

We are not doing anything wrong. We just do not care to try..... We really just don't care. Rather do other activities.

U.S. focuses too much emphasis and resources on our worst events: 3000m, 5000m 10000m and Marathon. U.S. is a 100m to 800m nation plus hurdles, jumps and throws. With proper emphasis and resources, U.S. could earn medals in javelin and hammer.

The US has more runners with podium finishes at World Marathon Majors in the last 12 years than Japan:

Japan, 9 (4 men + 5 women): Yuki Kawauchi, Yuta Shi*ara, Arata Fujiwara, Suguru Osako, Tomo Morimoto, Yukiko Akaba, Noriko Highchi, Yoko Shibui, and Kayoko Fukushi

USA, 12 (4 men + 8 women): Galen Rupp, Meb Keflezighi, Shadrack Biwott, Abdi Abdirahman, Shalane Flanagan, Desiree Linden, Sara Hall, Jordan Hasay, Sarah Sellers, Amy Cragg, Emma Bates, and Molly Huddle

And if you look at medals won at the last two Olympics, it’s USA 2, Japan 0.

In Japan, running is life for many, and it's culturally praised. It's well supported financially. In the US it's an afterthought and even the US's best runners (Rupp) are mocked relentlessly.

Rojo’s largely right, you know. The Japanese are obviously genetically suited to the Marathon, probably because they are significantly shorter and lighter than Americans on average.

In spite of the fanciful lie that “you can do anything you put your mind to,” genetic factors still rule most competitive sports.

Japan, as a nation are not much wiser than U.S., banging their heads against brick wall attempting to be great Marathoners. Not one Japanese in top 60 all-time, Marathon. You notice Rojo didn't say: Japan has xx Japanese Marathoners sub-2:05. What does a bunch of 2:07:30 to 2:09.59 Marathoners get a nation? Japan has already proven they are capable of working as a team and doing well at 4 x 100m. Maybe they should focus on 100m? I know the Japanese Marathoners are not going to sprint sub-9.95 100m, but resources are limited. Every dollar Japan wastes on 2:07:30 Marathoners is a dollar Japan is not spending on a potential sub-9.95 100m sprinter. Every dollar U.S. wastes on 2:12:30 Marathoners is a dollar U.S. is not spending on our U.S. athletes whom are likely to possibly medal.

Who mocks Rupp?

Open image

+1. This has come up many times on LR. Esp. years ago when for decades, despite obsession with it and relatively huge pool, all the best were stuck at 2:08-9. Now it's 2:06-7 but same diff. If the US wanted to, we could easily have crowds of sub 2:05's. Japanese are not physically(more mentally) suited to the marathon - complete myth.

Americans are too insecure about their masculinity. They're terrified of being called a "scrawny runner," a phrase you often hear even on this forum. You never hear that in Japan.

And this is a fairly recent problem. Shorter and Rodgers didn't give a flying F about whether they were perceived as masculine. Then came a couple of generations of American kids that considered short running shorts to be "gay" and felt uncomfortable showering with other males after workouts.

American males have body image problems.

Number of sub-2:08 marathoners by country:

U.S. - 5 (3 American-born)
Japan - 43
Kenya - 228

Maybe, just maybe, this indicates that the Japanese are more genetically suited to the Marathon than Americans, but less so than Kenyans.

Serious question: why is Japan very decent in the short sprints (in terms of relay and individual performances, probably top 5-10 over the past decade) and quite good in the marathon (top 5 status is pretty much undisputed) but is completely irrelevant in anything between?

I was thinking it’s perhaps related to average physiology, if you look at Europeans they tend to be taller and best in long sprints to mid distance which isn’t generally ideal for super short sprints nor for marathons (Karsten and Jakob for instance, and I realize Usain is an exception to the height rule for short sprinters), which is the opposite of Japanese..but the top performances are determined by outliers not individuals and you’d think a country with the genetic components to produce world-class sprinters and distance runners could have at least one person of relevance in the mid distances.

Perhaps, but there are probably 15-20 million Americans of East Asian descent. Koreans and Chinese have also had some marathon success, and have very similar physiologies to Japanese. Asian Americans do not relatively (population-adjusted) achieve comparable marathon performances as the Japanese, by a long shot.