A treadmill isn't real running, right?

It's real running but there is certainly a difference. Some people may hold on to the handles to reduce their weight, which you cannot do while running outside. Some may have difficulty mentally keeping a pace but the treadmill does this for you and you only need to "hold on". I personally find treadmill running to be far more mentally taxing than running outside and my times show that.

I can set WR time on a treadmill if I can hold on to the handles.

I can't comment if it's "real" running. On a well calibrated machine though, running on a treadmill is only very slightly easier than running on another smooth surface. That's why you might see a lot of people set them to 1% incline. Anyone running a 2:00 5k PB during a workout on a treadmill isn't on a calibrated machine or is ready for a real PB.

It's as close as you can get to real running. But it's still different and IMO easier physically speaking.

I switched to the treadmill for 3.5 weeks because of cold temps and icy sidewalks. Went for a 10-mile run yesterday and it felt tough. And I'm definitely feeling it today in my legs.

In my opinion it isn't real running, unless there is a very good explanation for the huge variation in times. We have some races coming up and I guarantee these people will not run 18 and 20 minutes respectively in the 5k.

Treadmill running is running but the difference is that the treadmill assists in leg turnover and is easier on the joints. I do agree that treadmill times do not convert equally to outdoor running times. I always figured my outdoor pace would be 15-30 seconds slower per mile compared to a mill due to the above plus variations in terrain and wind.

On a treadmill the ground moves for you.

Usually that does not happen will you run on real ground.

I think that's the main difference.

I've been training on treadmills for 30+ years and they are all different. If it's not calibrated correctly, the conversion to outside effort will be way off.

Treadmill running is easier, but only slightly. I PRed by 3 min(from 1:17-1:14) in the HM by running 80% of my mileage on the treadmill during the 4 month training cycle. It's really good for intensity control and it's easier on the joints.

GrapeSon, Very impressive to improve as you did using the treadmill so extensively. How did you determine which workouts would be treadmill runs and which not when you were doing 80% treadmill? Was it weather related, or workout driven? What were your regular long treasmill runs? Do you have a recommendation on treadmill brand or features? Thank you.

Treadmills are the only time I use heart rate training - I try to keep the HR around 140. This way at least my effort is "easy" across wildly different machines. I've been on some treadmills which showed 0% incline but there was a clear incline. The deck stiffness could also make a difference as well.

From another angle treading is alternative running. For folks who for various reasons are limited to it.

I never would consider treadmills in my salad years. Running happens outdoors on roads trails and tracks not in some sweaty hotbox room. Then age happened. Things started falling apart and the center fid not hold.

Now I refer to my "run" when my partner asks how my 40 mins. on the NordicTrac went. And holding on to the handle bars is stylish poise not a crutch. Treadmills are de riguer and only the best runners use them.

Right?

So am I on my own in finding treadmills to feel very fast instead of slow?

I typically run at 7:00-7:30 milling outside but on a treadmill the same perceived effort is much much slower. More like 830-9:00

heart Rate shows the same effect

There's no wind resistance, surging, or variation in terrain.

It's still running but with somewhat of a super track advantage.

I wouldn't consider a PB run on a treadmill a real PB, but if the treadmill is close to calibrated I'd imagine someone who ran 18 min 5K on a treadmill should be able to run at least a sub 19 minute 5K on the road.

One thing to keep in mind with Strava treadmill posts... when I run on the treadmill with my Garmin watch the watch measurement does not match what the treadmill says. The Garmin pretty much measures off cadence and my treadmill pace varies between 9.8 mph (6:07 pace) and 6.8 mph (8:49 pace) depending on what I'm doing on a given day... meanwhile my cadence barely changes so my Garmin can be way off. On the Garmin you can recalibrate based on what you actually ran on the treadmill but the Strava post won't reflect this...

...the long story but my point is that with treadmill posts on Strava, who knows what's going on... I know for me personally my distances can be +/- 1 mile off... I don't make any effort to note this in my workouts or change anything because I don't care that my strava treadmill run is inaccurate. Maybe you shouldn't care either.

To answer the question I'd say that treadmill running is real running. I build a ton of aerobic fitness on the treadmill over the winter and it beats the crap out of suffering on the dark, cold, windly, icy, roads. Once spring comes, instead of being burnt out by forcing myself out in miserable conditions, I'm instead super motivated to dominate some training on the roads with a strong foundation to build on.

Has any of you tried one of these non motorised manual curved treadmills? I really wanna get one and do serious training on treadmill. Wonder if the effort is similar as on the road

I find treadmill running to be quite tough. I recently planned a 4 mile tempo on the treadmill due to awful weather (6:35 pace) and could only muster 2 x 1.5mi with 2" rest. 3 days later outside I planned a similar LT workout (mile repeats) on a hilly loop and ran 6:27 - 6:19 - 6:14 with 1 min rest. I always find running outside easier than the mill at my apartment's gym. It could be calibrated too fast, but I think it's the mental aspect of constantly having a clock in your field of vision ticking away second by second. Even when i cover the screen with a towel, I can't resist checking to see how much longer I have left

My cadence on treadmill is considerably higher than outside. I'm sure there is a stride/posture/physio explanation for this, but as a result treadmill is way harder for me and I feel like I"m sprinting at a 10:00/mile pace. It is definitely not the same as outside and I agree with a previous poster it's better to go off of effort (or HR if available) rather than taking the treadmill's "speed" at face value.

Ahahahaha

Bang on cue the guy did a 5k tt this evening - 20:17, around 6:30 pace i.e no where near 18 minutes i.e 6 flat. Once again I am right and the old curmudgeons on here are wrong.

The only explanation is the treadmill is calibrated way wrong.