Do you think the Crumbley parents are legally innocent?

And their only crime was not appearing for the arraignment.

well this wrote:

And their only crime was not appearing for the arraignment.

Their crime was not securing a gun they own. That’s why they sell safes folks, and the parents are going down…unless they can prove fault with the safe manufacturer. Extremely unlikely.

Terrible parents, and in part responsible. Note that I'm not an anti-gun liberal. They were called into the school in response to some very disturbing drawings and writings, refused to take the kid home and neglected to check where his gun was. I also think the school should have pressed harder for him to leave.

If the kid is being charged as an adult, which he is, then how can you also blame his parents.

The Prison State expands its power over the regular people.

Meanwhile the drug addicted kid of billionaire racist Donald Sterling murdered his friend and did not even get charged with it, never mind his father being indicted.

Draconian laws for us.

No laws for the elites.

https://www.insideedition.com/8212-donald-sterlings-son-shot-best-friend-escaped-charges

Yes, they are innocent.

Tone deaf, but innocent.

Just like handing the car keys and the kid plows through a sidewalk, can't control someone else's actions.

Plenty of blame: from the 2nd Amendment to politicians, to the school administration to the parents to society.

nike shill wrote:

Terrible parents, and in part responsible. Note that I'm not an anti-gun liberal. They were called into the school in response to some very disturbing drawings and writings, refused to take the kid home and neglected to check where his gun was. I also think the school should have pressed harder for him to leave.

Actually the more and more I read, the more I believe the school administration should have prevented this. The parents still have a hand in this, but all the signs were there that a school should have picked up on.

Yes, they should be charged with a crime. It will be up to the legal system to prove guilt or innocence.

They bought a gun FOR the kid. Then, one of two situations occurred. Either they didn't secure the gun properly so he couldn't access it. Or they knew he had unrestricted access to it and didn't think that was a problem.

If your kid is drawing about killing people, you should be alarmed, or at least concerned. There is a report that when they heard about the shooting at school, the mom texted the kid saying, "please don't do it." This is after the shooting had already started.

They knew. They knew and did nothing about it. They knew and bought the murder weapon and allowed access to it.

[quote]reckless parenting wrote:

Yes, they should be charged with a crime. It will be up to the legal system to prove guilt or innocence.

They bought a gun FOR the kid.

He is being charged as an adult. Not a kid.

reckless parenting wrote:

Yes, they should be charged with a crime. It will be up to the legal system to prove guilt or innocence.

They bought a gun FOR the kid. Then, one of two situations occurred. Either they didn't secure the gun properly so he couldn't access it. Or they knew he had unrestricted access to it and didn't think that was a problem.

If your kid is drawing about killing people, you should be alarmed, or at least concerned. There is a report that when they heard about the shooting at school, the mom texted the kid saying, "please don't do it." This is after the shooting had already started.

They knew. They knew and did nothing about it. They knew and bought the murder weapon and allowed access to it.

I think you’re being too nice. The parents bought the gun because they don’t care. They didn’t check him because they don’t care. They are terrible parents. I continually remind people that guns are bought for the simple purpose to say you have a gun. People get CC just so they can say they have a CC. The kids looks disturbed. The parents didn’t care. He looks and acts exactly like someone that would cause trouble. His parents nurtured that behavior. You guys need to remember that kids and adults can be a$$hles. They do sh!t for the banality of it.

nike shill wrote:

nike shill wrote:

Terrible parents, and in part responsible. Note that I'm not an anti-gun liberal. They were called into the school in response to some very disturbing drawings and writings, refused to take the kid home and neglected to check where his gun was. I also think the school should have pressed harder for him to leave.

Actually the more and more I read, the more I believe the school administration should have prevented this. The parents still have a hand in this, but all the signs were there that a school should have picked up on.

Can't blame the school. They did everything they legally could do. The kid didn't break any rules..They could be sued if they suspended him for drawings against parent wishes.

The parents are guilty of something, but manslaughter is tough to prove.

Charles Manson didn't actually kill anyone either.

I honestly have no idea, legally, what will happen here. The law is complicated. The parents did a lot wrong but we'll see.

In general supporters of the 2nd Amendment will state that most gun owners are responsible gun owners. They also tend to support the principal that individuals are responsible for their actions and should face the consequences for those actions cause harm to others.

So the question is: Are these parents responsible gun owners? If irresponsible, should they face consequences for their actions?

Now this presents a dilemma for supporters of the 2nd Amendment. If irresponsible gun owners do face consequences then is this an infringement of 2nd Amendment rights? If it is considered an infringement then the logical conclusion is no matter how irresponsible you are you can own a gun and not be held accountable for the consequences of your irresponsibility.

nike shill wrote:

nike shill wrote:

Terrible parents, and in part responsible. Note that I'm not an anti-gun liberal. They were called into the school in response to some very disturbing drawings and writings, refused to take the kid home and neglected to check where his gun was. I also think the school should have pressed harder for him to leave.

Actually the more and more I read, the more I believe the school administration should have prevented this. The parents still have a hand in this, but all the signs were there that a school should have picked up on.

Parents get a pass? The created him, raised him , had 24/7 access to him.

School gets blame? Minimal access and legal obligations? Was the school allowed to 'force' the parents to take the kid home on the day of the shooting.

Hope the parents get drilled and if school violated any direct policies they are held responsible as well.

I have no problem holding his parents responsible since he is a minor, and let's apply it to all parents of children who shoot someone or stab someone or kill/injure someone while driving drunk. This is regardless of gender, perceived gender, or race. Not sure what the xtent of charges should be but it may help stop the inner city shootings as well as school shootings if we did. Parents may start to pay more attention to what their kids are doing and taking behavioral problems seriously.

Even charge an absent father (dna test may be required, right?)

As I understand it, the prosecution needs to prove the parents had reason to believe their son might do what he did. I expect the prosecutor will lean heavily on the meeting at the school as evidence to this case. It seems a pretty high bar for the prosecution, but seems a reasonable enough charge.

I understand also that there is no penalty in Michigan for failure to reasonably secure a firearm, so there is no potential legal culpability strictly for leaving a gun laying around.

As in most of these incidents the end result stems from a sequence of spectacularly bad decisions with the consequences amplified by the presence of a firearm.

If the school had known that the parents just bought the kid a gun a couple days ago, they probably would have been more forceful and/or at least would have asked/demanded to search him. If the parents went home from the meeting and looked for his gun without notifying the school he might have it on him and the prosecutors can show specific actions that were negligent on the parents part, then it feels like they might have a case.

Obviously, I like everyone else on here has no idea what actually happened or what evidence they have, but I'm guessing there is at least something significant because of how quickly the prosecutors charged the case and how anxious the parents were to flee.

Also, this is why we have trials, so 12 non internet based people can see the actual evidence and make a decision vs a bunch of sociopaths pretending to know what happened based on their political bias.

They're innocent of what they have been charged with (manslaughter).

I will be blunt...

I think these parents are guilty of being incredibly stupid and gun advocates at the same time.

If I talked in deoth with either, I would conclude the same. If I walked by either on the sidewalk and heard them speak, I would conclude the same.

Smoking cigarettes. Not having fully developed adult minds (i.e. not punishing their son for serious gun related issues at school). Yeah, they are indeed negligent because theyre stupid. ******last sentence was deleted as it was racist****