CDC: Herd immunity never gonna happen

Lead Foil Hat wrote:

RyecorDone wrote:

What is BS about "putting others in danger"?

The longer the virus spreads, the more variants arise, the more that people get sick or die from something they don't have immunity to, right?

You could say that regarding just about any virus. If everyone that needs to be is vaccinated then who is being put in danger?

Well, time for a little learnin'...

You fools who don't get vaccinated give the virus life, and with that the ability to mutate, which it will do. This mutating potentially puts all of us in danger, including those of us who have been vaccinated.

I am deeply saddened by the stupidity of the general public and by your moronic post.

Lead Foil Hat wrote:

a door open wrote:

Lack of herd immunity makes it even more important for you to get vaccinated. It increases your vulnerability.

Where is the evidence for lack of herd immunity? Politicians in the CDC say so, Biden says so, CNN says so? If the CDC wants us to be worried forever then Fauci should admit that he knows the virus is a bioweapon that he funded the development of and explain to the people the long term disaster we are facing and how to deal with it. If it is not a Fauci bioweapon then what are we doing talking about permanent changes for a nasty variant of a cold virus that will likely not get more lethal if we just let it run its course and stop putting selective pressures on it.

Oh, so you are stupid AND insane. Got it.

Flagpole wrote:

clown news network wrote:

What a pathetic excuse for a human you have become

INCORRECT!

Before Trump, I didn't realize just how stupid half the country is. He went right down the dictator's playbook list, and you Trump supporters cheered his every moronic move. Insanity. He suggested we inject disinfectants (and NO, he was not joking). We have never had anyone close to as big a buffoon as Trump in the White House. A serial lying, incompetent, amoral, criminal, dictator wannabe. Now, you Trump idiots refuse to wear a mask or get vaccinated. WTF? Can't be even slightly inconvenienced for the good of the country. Good thing you POS Trumpers weren't the mindset of Americans during our World Wars.

Wow. Amazes me how some lost people have these types of low-IQ, confused, irrational processes tumbling around their brains. It's like reading a passage written by someone lobotomized. So sad for you, and scary that a certain segment of our population is such a lost cause.

RyecorDone wrote:

The Unkle wrote:

Well the vaccines supposedly make people safe.

So let those of us who want nothing to do with the vaccines alone.

Don't give us we are putting others in danger BS. We are only putting those of us who will not take the vaccine in danger per the official story and that's our choice.

What is BS about "putting others in danger"?

The longer the virus spreads, the more variants arise, the more that people get sick or die from something they don't have immunity to, right?

The BS is claiming to know how long any so called "protection" lasts. The CDC admits they don't even know.

Enjoy your multiple boosters. The CEOs of Pfizer and Moderna have made it clear that you will need them.

"How long does protection from a COVID-19 vaccine last ?"

"We don’t know how long protection lasts for those who are vaccinated."

Well, I think we will see you soon. Will the United States as a whole I’ve heard immunity? Probably not.

I suspect that the level required to return immunity is somewhere between the level that will be reached by high vaccine participation states and low vaccine participation states.. I have said I suspect the number is 50-60% of the total population. Given that children will not be getting the vaccine in the next few months, a much higher percentage of the qualifying participants Would need to get the vaccine.

It will be interesting to see what happens when the low vaccine participation States move into indoor weather. If places like Alabama and Arkansas have low levels through the summer, then that is good news for everyone going forward. If the levels there do go up, that may spur more people to get the vaccine. I certainly hope so.

Sorry about the typos above. Please read this instead of the post above

I suspect that we will see soon. Will the United States as a whole reach herd immunity soon? Probably not

I suspect that the level required to reach herd immunity is between the level that will be reached by high vaccine participation states and low vaccine participation states.. I have said I suspect the number is 50-60% of the total population. Given that children will not be getting the vaccine in the next few months, a much higher percentage of the qualifying participants would need to get the vaccine to reach that number.

It will be interesting to see what happens when the low vaccine participation States move into indoor weather. If places like Alabama and Arkansas have low levels through the summer, then that is good news for everyone going forward. If the levels there do go up, that may spur more people to get the vaccine. I certainly hope so.

You were not clear there, but surely your amazement is with Trumpers and anti-vaxxers and anti-maskers, for they are the stupid ones. My post is from an intelligent and educated viewpoint...oh, and it's the correct viewpoint.

covidious wrote:

Harambe wrote:

I've done nothing but spread Facts and Reason to counter the incessant whining by denier-fearmongers as 500k+ Americans died. Frame it how you want, but be sure to Stay Mad :)

Facts and reason are good things. What I wonder about is your insistence on using demonizing language to describe those who disagree with you.

Posting fabricated claims about the vaccine or spouting intentional misinterpretations of biology to fearmonger them are not "disagreements."

It's often the same people who have been denying COVID and then fearmongering vaccines (with a brief hiatus to scream about election fraud) for months. They know what they are doing. The cry for civility is always a cute misdirection.

Lead Foil Hat wrote:

a door open wrote:

Lack of herd immunity makes it even more important for you to get vaccinated. It increases your vulnerability.

Where is the evidence for lack of herd immunity? Politicians in the CDC say so, Biden says so, CNN says so? If the CDC wants us to be worried forever then Fauci should admit that he knows the virus is a bioweapon that he funded the development of and explain to the people the long term disaster we are facing and how to deal with it. If it is not a Fauci bioweapon then what are we doing talking about permanent changes for a nasty variant of a cold virus that will likely not get more lethal if we just let it run its course and stop putting selective pressures on it.

The #1 diversity generating event for a virus is to allow mass replication in a host. I.e. in someone unvaccinated.

We will get enough people vaccinated in most states to keep virus levels very low.

It's a bad bit of mis-communication from the CDC to basically say "some areas are so dumb they will never reach herd immunity, therefore the whole country won't." Plenty of areas will knock the virus out.

Flagpole wrote:

Lead Foil Hat wrote:

You could say that regarding just about any virus. If everyone that needs to be is vaccinated then who is being put in danger?

Well, time for a little learnin'...

You fools who don't get vaccinated give the virus life, and with that the ability to mutate, which it will do. This mutating potentially puts all of us in danger, including those of us who have been vaccinated.

I am deeply saddened by the stupidity of the general public and by your moronic post.

Flag, you do realize that if we can’t vaccinate the entire world in an expedient manner, and we can’t, then there’s ultimately nothing we can do about “variants of concern.” They will arrive no matter what. Also, there is the possibility of an immune escape variant due to the vaccination and impossibility of 100% vaccination.

I posted and article yesterday. So far people who were naturally infected have antibody protection (and long-lived T cell memory). Also, we have monoclonal antibody therapy that can quell the variants better than these vaccines, which will be annual or semiannual. This therapy will be scalable eventually, especially if we went OWS on it.

If we get to 60% vaccination, along w naturally acquired immunity, we are then at herd immunity per the CDC and WHO’s initial guidelines. States like Texas might already be there as cases are dropping hugely. The biggest risk there is undocumented and infected aliens super spreading it at our southern border, which is the biggest mess it’s ever been, ever.

People who are elderly, obese, have high melanin skin content or have significant immune or cardiopulmonary morbidity or diabetes or high blood pressure would do well to get the vaccine. Everyone else who doesn’t want the vaccine would do well to exercise, intermittent fast, get plenty of vit D, zinc. &, perhaps, melatonin and to eat well.

This virus is like a mild flu for most, and we would already be through it if we would’ve let it burn. In fact, if Americans weren’t so friggin unhealthy, “on both sides,” we wouldn’t even be talking about this virus. Mortality and hospitalizations would’ve been far less. Nationalized healthcare would be a real possibility.

What I really want to know is if Biden has the balls to boycott the Chinese games and persuade other significant nations to do so as well. I’m guessing not.

I have generally found your ability to evaluate the scientific data to be solid, but I really don’t see how vaccination in the United States is going to do much to affect the diversity of variants in the short to medium term. Regardless of what we do in the United States, there will be a significant reservoir of unvaccinated people around the world for at least a couple of years.

I think that we have fairly similar views on vaccination rates at heard immunity, although I think you have a bit more confidence and where the numbers will lie than I do. We will learn soon enough

If we "let it burn" and say, doubled the number of infected Americans from 35 to 70% that would presumably cause a near doubling of deaths to near 1 million! You gloss over this...

Vaccines also induce robust and durable (so far) antibody and T-cell mediated immunity. Preventative measures (vaccines) are much better investment than treatments as people can spread the virus before they are sick enough to need treatment.

trashcan wrote:

I have generally found your ability to evaluate the scientific data to be solid, but I really don’t see how vaccination in the United States is going to do much to affect the diversity of variants in the short to medium term. Regardless of what we do in the United States, there will be a significant reservoir of unvaccinated people around the world for at least a couple of years.

I think that we have fairly similar views on vaccination rates at heard immunity, although I think you have a bit more confidence and where the numbers will lie than I do. We will learn soon enough

I agree. I am more trying to stop the "vaccination will cause deadly variants to arise!!!1" talking point. Infections in unvaccinated people are a larger risk of variant generation than in vaccinated people.

I don't think we are going to attain "zero-COVID" or whatever and stop any variants.

Just trying to push back on the vaccine fearmongering pseudoscience.

You know this thread title is a lie/misinformation/manipulating the truth just based on common sense. The CDC would never say herd immunity will never happen. All you need is everyone to be vaccinated or get Covid immunity naturally.

They would say herd immunity won’t happen if nobody gets the vaccine.

I can’t judge anyone because I have no plans to get the vaccine. I prefer to get Covid naturally. The two people (I know, huge sample size) I personally know who got the vaccine almost died in their sleep. I’d rather get Covid since I know I will be an asymptotic case than go through convulsions all night from the vaccine.

You continue to pretend that the only way to get immunity to the virus is the vaccine. A massive number of people got the virus and have immunity through infection. There is no evidence to suggest this immunity is inferior to immunity through the vaccine. Many of the vaccine-hesitant are likely to have had the virus already. Everybody needs to stop worrying about the vaccine hesitant spreading the virus to those who are vaccinated. You are far greater risk driving your car than from Covid once vaccinated. The number of people who were vacinated who got Covid mid April was about 5,800. You have less than a .001% chance of getting Covid if vaccinated and even then the reaction would likely be less severe.

The other truth is the left just does not understand how to handle these things. Stop telling people to get Vaccinated and screaming about vaccine passports, it is not working. People are much more willing to comply if you are honest and treat them like adults. Give them a choice and be honest about the benefits and risks to themselves and society if they get vaccinated. The majority of people will do the right thing if you are honest and respectful. The more the left makes this a right vs left thing a lot of the anti-vax crowd is going to not get vaccinated just to give them the middle finger.

sbeefyk2 wrote:

I’d rather get Covid since I know I will be an asymptotic case than go through convulsions all night from the vaccine.

Plenty of young people get symptomatic COVID and feel crappy for weeks.

Nothing like having chest pain for a month while training for a summer race.

test account wrote:

Again to wrote:

Who benefits from the $6 trillion in additional federal spending?

Everybody actually.

Take a look back in ten years and see if you still feel the same way. Hugo Chavez was extremely popular in Venezuela for his free spending and socialist ways. He set Venezuela up to become what it is today: a failed state. The only thing helping Venezuela now is Biden's environmental policies (that have intentionally inflated world oil prices by cutting into the supply of US and Canadian oil).

Agreed that fewer infections means fewer variants. Technically more like fewer total days infected means fewer variants.

Primo Numero Uno wrote:

The other truth is the left just does not understand how to handle these things. Stop telling people to get Vaccinated and screaming about vaccine passports, it is not working. People are much more willing to comply if you are honest and treat them like adults. Give them a choice and be honest about the benefits and risks to themselves and society if they get vaccinated. The majority of people will do the right thing if you are honest and respectful. The more the left makes this a right vs left thing a lot of the anti-vax crowd is going to not get vaccinated just to give them the middle finger.

There's no evidence that people are going to be reasonable when presented with the risks. All evidence suggests that the risk of a COVID infection far, far outweighs the risk of a vaccine across the age and health spectrum.

As seen on LRC, people continually overweight minimal, unproven, unsupported risks from the vaccines relative to COVID.

Good messaging should work to counteract humanity's apparently innate bias that downplays COVID infection and overestimates vaccination risk.