Rojo - Do you support transgender athletes competing as long as they receive hormonal treatment? Or are you fully against?

The sad truth is that the women that will lose the most from this are talented black female athletes.

Democrats do everything they can to keep blacks down.

xxxx wrote:

The sad truth is that the women that will lose the most from this are talented black female athletes.

Talented black female athletes with testicles stand to do rather well.

The waa waas go waa waa all the way home like the little piggies they are.

Fully against.

It's not fair to biological women, and sport is theoretically at least supposed to be a fair competition. That's why we have weight classes, age classes, professional and amateur leagues, etc etc. Also it's boring - I'm not interested in watching women race when the outcome is certain.

logwithin wrote:

Honest question to others as well.

Is it good enough that there is hormonal treatment, testersone monitoring, and # of years regarding declariation of gender? Or is this still an unfair impact to women?

Transgender people simply deserve as much right as anyone to compete in sports without changing who they are (no person should be forced to take anything to conform to what is ultimately an arbitrary measure of man or femalehood).

However it can't be at the behest of inherent biology. There is a reason for the current status quo and order, and the world needs to be okay with this. If it means creating new categories of competition then so be it - I have zero issue with this. Where these categories (I assume there are maybe 3 or 4 - biological male identifying as female and vice versa as well as one or two DSD categories) sit in terms of competitions like the Olympic Games/World Championships is not up for me to decide (should these new categories be at the Olympic Games (as we currently know them) or their own Olympics like the Paralympics.

Bottom line, you have to preserve the sanctity of womens sport, and I hate to make that sound condescending but that's the reality (as in the likelihood a biological female can ethically transition and compete with biological males is simply non-existent).

The views of my fiancé are the issue. She doesn't know enough about sport to have an educated opinion yet has one based off simple adherence to the current movement of wokeness and ill-advised libertarianism. She had no problem with a transgender women competing against biologically assigned women because she had no idea of the inherent physical differences that impact sporting ability. I had to explain to her (as an example) that when I was only 15 years old, I was already physically better than the best biological woman that had ever lived over 800m (I ran 1.52 at age 15 which is obviously faster than the womens WR) - and I didn't even bother to get into the topic of drugs. She didn't realize that the reality is, the current womens WR holder in the 100m (FGJ) would at her absolute "best" - not even be good enough to win a national high school title here in the US. She simply had no idea. When I pointed out that even an average high school biologically assigned male had the ability to win the womens 100m at the Olympic Games and that opening the door of simply "whatever you choose to or feel you identify as" meant, she changed her mind on the matter.

Hormonal treatment - forcibly or voluntarily isn't the answer. We have to evolve with the times and create new categories for sporting equality. Any opposition to that is simply a lack of education that honestly wouldn't be anything new in our lives when it comes to any emotionally charged issue anyways.

xxxx wrote:

The sad truth is that the women that will lose the most from this are talented black female athletes.

The three women who won medals at the 2016 Olympic 800m were Semenya, Niyonsaba and Wambui - three black women from Africa. The three women who stood to benefit from their exclusion were two Europeans and a Canadian.

I can think of several black athletes in track and in other sports who have had their woman-ness questioned because of the way they look. I can't think of any comparable examples of white women.

It’s not about wokeness it’s about the rules as they stand. Don’t like the rules then go about changing them.

The limited scientific evidence so far does not indicate an inherent advantage for transgender runners after undergoing hormonal treatment. And we have only a handful of examples of transgender runners participating at a competitive level.

If we start getting 45 second 400 m/1:46 800 runners as males coming back to run as 48/1:52 in the women’s division a couple of years later then we would probably expect governing bodies and courts to re-examine the current rulings.

I have no problem with transgender athletes competing with the gender they Identify as, but when it comes to championship races, they need to compete in a transgender athletes category.

Let them run the same race if they must so their are enough people to compete against as it's easier for most to perform well when not solo, but they should be scored/accounted for in their own category.

Someone already posted an article about trans women still having an advantage.

Open up any anatomy text book. Open up any physics textbook. Apply both.

It mostly has to do with the application of muscular force to movement be it running or lifting etc. Not to mention that the trans woman has already had years of muscular development as a man before the transition.

Alan

Why should my daughter compete against a man and why do a few people deserve their own category? My daughter is a vegetarian and she really doesn't associate with carnivores. They should have a category for vegetarians.

Tatar wrote:

xxxx wrote:

The sad truth is that the women that will lose the most from this are talented black female athletes.

The three women who won medals at the 2016 Olympic 800m were Semenya, Niyonsaba and Wambui - three black women from Africa. The three women who stood to benefit from their exclusion were two Europeans and a Canadian.

I can think of several black athletes in track and in other sports who have had their woman-ness questioned because of the way they look. I can't think of any comparable examples of white women.

Who holds the women’s 800 record and the Press sisters etc etc

rojo, where have you been hiding this logic...credit where its due mate :-)

No, I don't support any kind of transgender athletes competing as women. In Genesis, the Bible states that the Lord made them Man and Woman. Other than that, it is not right to have men competing against women because they already have muscles developed without testosterone treatments . It cannot be fair to female athletes.

Running craze wrote:

Biden has saved the day for every average 18 year old male athlete.

Yes. I work in a school and dozens of 17/18 min 5k guys have jumped to the women’s team after Biden’s announcement.

Oh wait, that never happened and it never will.

How many high school or college athletes have been negatively impacted (taking their top 7 spot, snagging all state, etc) by a trans athlete? I’d imagine the number is so small that it’s irrelevant in the grand scheme.

So you have no evidence that hip structure matters among elite distance runners? I have yet to ever open an anatomy book and seen a picture of an elite female runners. I see tons of pictures of average people but they don't matter for this discussion.

All in all I wouldn't be shocked to learn that transwoman have some small advantage. It isn't going to be enough to make the 4:20 male miler competitive in the NCAA as a females. It might be enough for the 4:00 miler to go from being a nationals qualifer to a title contender though.

We plan to run an elite team of girls at NXR.

inthepdx wrote:

I have no problem with transgender athletes competing with the gender they Identify as, but when it comes to championship races, they need to compete in a transgender athletes category.

Let them run the same race if they must so their are enough people to compete against as it's easier for most to perform well when not solo, but they should be scored/accounted for in their own category.

They don’t need their own category. Just make an open division and a women‘a division and the problem will be solved.

Any can compete in the open division and only strict biological females can compete in the women’s division.

I already race as if I was part of an open division anyway. If I was coming down the homestretch of a local 5k and get out kicked by a girl, I don’t care if I was the first “man”, I was second.

Big Card wrote:

We plan to run an elite team of girls at NXR.

??? I won’t hold my breath.

Same for the next “Shaq” or “Bolt” switching competition categories. It’s all ifs/buts... it has never happened and I don’t foresee it happening.