When do Kipchoge’s performances become too incredible and suspicious?

...and to add just as I posted, to number 2), imo from a physics point of view, the shoes 'benefit' (or limit loss) better for runners with better style, i.e. footstrike under COG, body carried over that while the foot then propels back to the buttock. This is important. For runners who already have that energy return, I think its a massive factor

Plus, go back to Isaac Newton, the less energy returned from footstrike, the more is dissipated elsewhere, mostly to damage in foot/tendons/calf etc. So this again is where even running faster, they actually feel better physically at end.

Don't compare to yourself if you don't fit that, the average plodder can forget about it.

Given that Kip won WC in 2003 and bronze in 04 and we are having this conversation in 2022 probably makes him an historically talented runner, like Pujols is an historically talented hitter. If they have been doped up that long, they certainly did it better than Flo Jo or that Vandenbroucke cyclist

MOTS-c.......... MOTS-C................ MOTS-C

mitochondrial derived peptide .

Retards still discussing epo ,

when things have clearly moved on.

Regardless if still par for course.

Ever wonder why the whole sub 2 project

And

it's similarity to race designed to break

10000m in 2000 with pace light .

similarities don't stop at this ,

same Peds involved ,

why both events were concocked,

to avail of it .

And the confidence in it to break record

Afew years prior not happening and zero confidence in happening..

It's the shoes , such misdirection

Sorry race was of October 2020 if remember

when alot of everything else was postponed

but still wanted that race , to happen badly .

Only means one thing ,

top agents as usual and

very good ,new dope has hit scene .

MOTS-C ...,....... MOTS-c.

Just stop please. There’s nothing that’s a remotely close comparison. Are you so addled as to blithely accept someone running 69s quarters for a marathon? Someone just plops down 4 back to back 28:30 10ks and you just take it all in stride like it’s billy jo bob’s 35:12 10k at the age of 38 after he ran 17:40 in hs. Well ya know he just hung in there that’s all. Bound to happen eventually.

Are you really so invested in the sport as to be morally corrupted enough not to care? Or do you just enjoy the spectacle and you wanna watch the purdy lights from your Barca lounger and not be bothered to think about it?

There are good people who do this for a living who will represent this country in international competition and they can’t come close to running a 57 min 20K, let alone double that up and then some. Do you really think that there’s this one guy there who just gets it and he’s the only one who trains? Or maybe his coach stumbled on the way and the truth and he’s also able to dunk and do gymnastics cause of his crazy flexibility and plyometrics.

Just like Lance off working on his high cadence, shift the balance to aerobic engine stuff while Jan pounds wiener schnitzel and gets fat. That’s the ticket.

You’ve been here a lot of years man. Get your head out of your a$$ and wake up.

Apparently you know very little. Blood doping was certainly a hot topic at Montreal. And if there was very little suspicion about doping with distance athletes, why did they make a big point of beginning testing there?

The fact is, the soviets and soviet-bloc countries began doping in the 50s and a lot was known by the 70s. I thought you were naive, now I’m starting to wonder if you are an apologist or worse.

Of course he’s an historically talented runner. He is the WR holder. The drugs are much better now and there is much more data to guide doping.

Where have I said anything that says I blithely accept someone running 69 second quarters for the marathon? Where? If you're going to call someone morally corrupt for something they said you ought to make damn sure they actually said that thing. I said that there are people who will look at others who've run fast marathons at advanced ages to counter the argument that Kipchoge is too old to be running PBs. I did not say whether I believe that or not. And how does saying that when blood doping came along there was immediate speculation about who was or wasn't doing it translate to not knowing anything about it, to being naive? I actually know that if Viren was doing it in Montreal, and I don't know if he was, he was not alone. But again, it was not illegal then. If you want to argue with or insult me for something I've actually written, that's fine. But if you're going to do that because you've decided I said something I didn't you need to explain your thinking.

You should be questioning Tigist Assefa‘a performance considering she went from a 2:34 in March… Kipchoge is consistent. How tf does a 2:34 marathoner run a 19 min PR and the 3 fastest time in history in a mere 6 months….

Yeah, that’s next.

She ran a 68:30 in 2019. That's sub 224. She was a much better runner than 2:34. She ran a mid 67 like 2 months after that marathon. That's 2:20ish shape. Probably justed needed one to be used to it.Of course it isn't like dropping 5mins off is something we see ever day.

It is easy to go drugs. But she just starts using them in like July? Seems odd...

Wow dmb!!! This the the lets run I want! Some great poster here!!! It's a matter of loving the sport and not put the head under the sand! Of course till somebody is positive we will never know! But there s one great BUT..... Considering the fact that Doping is a tragedy and we ve seen from many many years athletes from different sports be banned for competitions , their career destroyed , their achievments in sports throwed in the dustbins , like Lance 7 tour de france, Countries like Russia be out of competitions, and also athletes that die for doping, sometimes ex doper talk that he was an addiction like to be a Junk. Well if I m able to run a marathon in 2 :01:09 and already do 1:59.40 in Ineos (my sponsor ) project really and absolutely without Peds ...Me now I will not care again to break another world record or better my main goal from now will be and should be not " No man is limited" but " I ve done all this only eating Ugali". I will shout to the whole world , that i ve done ALL THIS without peds. I MEAN PEOPLE IT'S NOT INCREDIBLE THAT i CAN RUN FAST LIKE THIS FOR SO MANY YEARS AND THE ONLY THINGS THAT I PUT INSIDE MY BODY IS PURE WATER AND HEALTHY KENYAN FOOD???? SO 50 YEARS OF DOPING SCIENCE (THE BIG PROBLEM THAT KILLS THE SPORT) ALL IN A ONCE ARE THROWED AWAY INTO THE GARBAGE , I MEAN THIS WOULD BE REALLY A SMALL STEP FOR EK BUT A GIANT LEAP FOR A CLEAN SPORT . MORE IMPORTANT THAN ANY WORLD RECORD. THE GOAT IN MARATHON AND I MUST ADD ONE OF THE ALL TIME GREATS IN EVERY SPORT DONT USE PEDS. ALL IN ONCE YEARS OF DOPING SCIENTISTS , ATHLETES BANNED FOR LIFE , PRISONS , SUSPENSIONS, SCANDAL ETC. ARE BLOWED AWAY

Obviously if he was American and 38 he would be a clean athlete?

We have seen this similar trend in early marathon adopters and especially those that don’t races many times a year.

PED could be involved but equally they could not be involved. You have to say how good is the testing over how many years.

There is a lot of money in American so they have the ability to cheat the testing system to develop new drugs so athletes won’t be caught, whereas poor countries it’s down to testing only.

with being a Nike athlete you have to decide which is statement is for

# all Nike (insert training group) athletes duping

# no Nike (insert training group) athletes are duping

# athlete is self duping

Self duping is more likely accidental, so now it’s the group, how many drug bust have we seen for USA groups…. The whole setup is corrupt not just the one or two busted athletes

All doping threads should have registered usernames only to cut down on the paid shills.

Kipchoge is worth 3 million dollars. That's a lot of money in Kenya, the equivalent of a quater of a billion in the USA. But he doesn't have the money to bribe a couple of doctors and such, unlike the average elite American marathoner? Not to mention that Kipchoge is essentially the face of Nike as far as running is concerned.

Not as much as you think. It begins at the same point, which means athletes highly-trained in their twenties, as he was, do not become faster a decade later. Unless they dope. Of course he does. Running is his life - like many top athletes.

The pain of a marathon is legendary. Remember Jim Peters in Vancouver? The point I am making is that Elliott experienced fatigue, as any athlete should at some point. But not apparently Kipchoge - despite running faster than most people can cycle. For 26 miles. It is almost comical. A circus act.

And despite training twice a day, what were Kidd's times? I think he might have been just faster than a Kenyan woman today. Must be the shoes ..

How would that work?

The accepted medical knowledge is that we peak in absolute terms in our late twenties. From there our decline begins - however imperceptibly for some. This is taught in medical schools. There is no way an athlete who is trained to their peak at their peak age - as Kipchoge was - will get faster or stronger a decade later unless they dope ( or they weren't training at a younger age. He was.) This is what dedicated athletes will do today. That is what success requires.