Have you ever found yourself running around a park in your home town and realized you're on the home stretch of your 7th grade race course? Ever been having make-up s** with someone and had your playlist inadvertently skip to your 50 Cent/Lloyd Banks playlist? Remember what it felt like when you were accepted to the college of your first choice or received that bonus that brought your total comp to $250k?
Adderall is all of those feelings, all day. It removes the barrier between what you innately want to do and what you're capable of doing. Adderall makes washing the f***ing dishes feel good. Adderall makes listening to the songs they use to torture prisoners of war feel good. It's probably best suited for mid-d or skilled events, but I can't believe we're having this conversation about its use in competition.
Nearly everyone I know who has been taking it since childhood is *really* screwy when not on the medication. It seems to exacerbate personality defects. Sometimes it's felt like I'm living in a low budget version of the movie Limitless having to interact with these people when they forgot to take their pill.
Adderall is a hard drug. Anyone who does not believe that--"tolerance" be damned--is a goon. I take a hard no to hard drugs stance.
Seems odd they wouldn't, as my understanding is Simon Biles has competed in the olympics and world championships with a TUE for adderall. Is it really more advantageous in distance running than gynmnastics?
OK I was wrong. She was on ritalin instead, which is another stimulant that is chemically similar but not the same. Still she was on TUE for use of a stimulant.
I disagree with the fact that amphetamines are performance enhancing for long distance running especially the marathon. They may make running FEEL easier and help the mental side to some extent but by and large the biggest limiting factor of the marathon is physiological. These drugs increase the heart rate and other objective measures of exertion causing a given pace to be at a higher effort level. Eventually you will burn through your glycogen faster and this would actually hurt a lot more than help in the marathon considering how important fuel utilization and pacing is, especially in the early stages. I could definitely see adderall helping in shorter events such as the 10k and below because you are already close to max HR and glycogen storage is not a limiting factor.
In addition to all this, I would imagine the appetite suppression and diuretic effects could significantly hamper recovery. Molly has already spoken in interviews about how it is hard to get in enough calories when she runs 130 mpw. Most people I know even who legitimately need it for ADHD experience appetite loss.
Ok so stimulants are illegal in competition UNLESS you admit you are taking stimulants and get permission to take said stimulants.
in this particular case, you are being admirable because of your transparency. It doesn’t matter anymore that you are gaining an advantage through pharmaceuticals. That’s ok now.
do I have this right?
One more reason I can’t be a real track fan anymore. This is just too stupid. Doesn’t pass the giggle test.
Exactly. This is classic Letsrun hypocrisy all in one thread.
And imagine if instead of Molly Seidel the athlete was Galen Rupp or an NOP athlete or an East African…the same people who are applauding her would be calling them cheaters.
The older I get, the more amazed I am at most peoples inability to objectively assess things. Like, I absolutely love sports, I love running - I love it in my life. BUT there is literally no professional athlete/team alive who would break my heart if they cheated or got caught cheating or left the sport today. None. Disappointed maybe, but just for a few minutes. Another great one will just come along soon and the show goes on and they aren’t my friend or loved one.
So, people’s flimsy emotional attachment to liking certain athletes or teams and assuming they are good or bad people with no supporting evidence or experience is insane to me.
So you can take it to be better at your job taking commissions, promotions, etc. away from other sales reps but you look down on Molly? Okay!
ADHD and other neurological issues can be dealt with naturally with proper diet and environment. Long distance runners would struggle because they'd probably need to gain a few pounds...more calories, correcting mineral/vitamin deficiencies, more rest time, and consuming A LOT of simple sugars are a big step. But we've been brainwashed to believe that sugar is bad for us. Sara Hall talks about consuming lots of simple sugars and says most people don't realize how beneficial they are for recovery and stress reduction. She's absolutely right.
So much misinformation on this thread, can yall stop calling adderall meth. It is not, adderall is an amphetamine and dextroamphetamine, not methamphetamine. You are not taking meth by using adderall.
I could post literally hundreds more links. This is also true for autism.
And there actually is a biological difference in how it manifests:
“There is a concrete difference between the prevalence of ADHD in boys versus girls. In one study of 2,332 twins and siblings, Anne Arnett, a clinical child psychologist at the University of Washington, found that a sex difference in diagnosis could be explained by differences in symptom severity: boys tended to have more extreme symptoms, and a broader distribution of symptoms, than girls. “It's an actual neurobiological difference that we're seeing,” says Arnett. It’s not clear why that’s the case, but it could be that girls have a protective effect at the genetic level, she says.
But the true size of the difference is unclear.
When it comes to real-world diagnoses, boys far outweigh girls. In studies that look at who meets ADHD criteria in the population as a whole, however, the ratio still favours boys, but less so. Depending on which research you look at, the ratio of boys to girls with ADHD could be anywhere between 2:1 and 10:1.”
So, you are disagreeing with me and the papers you cite? You do not believe there are different sub-types and that males and females each can have all of the different sub-types? The symptoms that you ascribe to females are simply NOT symptoms limited only to females. There are as many (actually more) males whose ADHD manifests itself with the less overt symptoms that you ascribe to females. There is just, unfortunately for males, many males who have more severe symptoms. But, there are also females with severe symptoms. There are both males and females who do not have the obvious severe signs that most people associate with ADHD. From our sources:
“The inattentive presentation is actually more common [among both boys and girls], but it tends to be under-recognised or under-diagnosed, because the kids aren't typically causing problems in the classroom,” she adds.
My point is your original post really should have said: "Less severe forms of ADHD are often not diagnosed in children because it manifests differently than the severe forms. While the more severe forms has symptoms that can cause children to be hyper and disruptive leading to diagnosis, less severe forms cause children to be quiet and dreamy and therefore are seen as not causing a problem. It is very common for children with the less severe forms to go well into adulthood without a diagnosis because of this."
Plenty of both men and women aren't diagnosed until adult hood. You want to make it a gender issue (why?), but that does a disservice to all the male children and adults (and there are more males than females affected) who are also not seen to "really have ADHD" because they have the less severe type.
if you have ADHD, that is unfortunate. but using adderall does not simply "balance" everything out. it WILL give you an advantage that non-adderall users will not have. the ban list should be binary. no TUE gray area.
Have you ever found yourself running around a park in your home town and realized you're on the home stretch of your 7th grade race course? Ever been having make-up s** with someone and had your playlist inadvertently skip to your 50 Cent/Lloyd Banks playlist? Remember what it felt like when you were accepted to the college of your first choice or received that bonus that brought your total comp to $250k?
Adderall is all of those feelings, all day. It removes the barrier between what you innately want to do and what you're capable of doing. Adderall makes washing the f***ing dishes feel good. Adderall makes listening to the songs they use to torture prisoners of war feel good. It's probably best suited for mid-d or skilled events, but I can't believe we're having this conversation about its use in competition.
Nearly everyone I know who has been taking it since childhood is *really* screwy when not on the medication. It seems to exacerbate personality defects. Sometimes it's felt like I'm living in a low budget version of the movie Limitless having to interact with these people when they forgot to take their pill.
Adderall is a hard drug. Anyone who does not believe that--"tolerance" be damned--is a goon. I take a hard no to hard drugs stance.
I really can't tell if this thread is full of hateful trolls or just people with regressive opinions on mental health or both, but it's letsrun, so it's both.
I'm seeing lots of generalized ignorance and misguided descriptions, bluedot's especially, of what adderall 'does'- if your brain chemistry doesn't actually need the sort of correction that can be provided by adderall, an SSRI, an SRNI, or etc., of course slamming prescription drugs you don't need will get you wildin out.
If you are someone who was born with balanced brain chemistry, congrats! You won the mental equivalent of being born with the right combo of fast twitch muscles, skeletal durability, and low body fat % needed to get you to the start line of a national championship. Great job picking your parents. Otherwise, you should hop off people who have finally found relief from therapy and / or prescription medication.
This forum peaked with the 'can you run the 800 on pure hate?' thread and all you pre-incel hobby joggers should quick jacking off so much and get your own asses to therapy. Everyone that is a part of your life, including your unhappy spouse or avoidant roommates, will thank you.
Letsrun sadly got and gets traffic because they're the only running / track news aggregator. This has unfortunately convinced the Brojos that people want to hear them in podcast format. This message board is pure trash and everyone would be better off if it didn't exist.
Have you ever found yourself running around a park in your home town and realized you're on the home stretch of your 7th grade race course? Ever been having make-up s** with someone and had your playlist inadvertently skip to your 50 Cent/Lloyd Banks playlist? Remember what it felt like when you were accepted to the college of your first choice or received that bonus that brought your total comp to $250k?
Adderall is all of those feelings, all day. It removes the barrier between what you innately want to do and what you're capable of doing. Adderall makes washing the f***ing dishes feel good. Adderall makes listening to the songs they use to torture prisoners of war feel good. It's probably best suited for mid-d or skilled events, but I can't believe we're having this conversation about its use in competition.
Nearly everyone I know who has been taking it since childhood is *really* screwy when not on the medication. It seems to exacerbate personality defects. Sometimes it's felt like I'm living in a low budget version of the movie Limitless having to interact with these people when they forgot to take their pill.
Adderall is a hard drug. Anyone who does not believe that--"tolerance" be damned--is a goon. I take a hard no to hard drugs stance.
What I tell my athlete patients is to say this to the media " I know that some prescriptions can be used/abused , but I have a legitimate health reason for my TUE " . Everyone uses this blanket statement . The American caucasian women will back each other up on Instagram .
And there actually is a biological difference in how it manifests:
“There is a concrete difference between the prevalence of ADHD in boys versus girls. In one study of 2,332 twins and siblings, Anne Arnett, a clinical child psychologist at the University of Washington, found that a sex difference in diagnosis could be explained by differences in symptom severity: boys tended to have more extreme symptoms, and a broader distribution of symptoms, than girls. “It's an actual neurobiological difference that we're seeing,” says Arnett. It’s not clear why that’s the case, but it could be that girls have a protective effect at the genetic level, she says.
But the true size of the difference is unclear.
When it comes to real-world diagnoses, boys far outweigh girls. In studies that look at who meets ADHD criteria in the population as a whole, however, the ratio still favours boys, but less so. Depending on which research you look at, the ratio of boys to girls with ADHD could be anywhere between 2:1 and 10:1.”
So, you are disagreeing with me and the papers you cite? You do not believe there are different sub-types and that males and females each can have all of the different sub-types? The symptoms that you ascribe to females are simply NOT symptoms limited only to females. There are as many (actually more) males whose ADHD manifests itself with the less overt symptoms that you ascribe to females. There is just, unfortunately for males, many males who have more severe symptoms. But, there are also females with severe symptoms. There are both males and females who do not have the obvious severe signs that most people associate with ADHD. From our sources:
“The inattentive presentation is actually more common [among both boys and girls], but it tends to be under-recognised or under-diagnosed, because the kids aren't typically causing problems in the classroom,” she adds.
My point is your original post really should have said: "Less severe forms of ADHD are often not diagnosed in children because it manifests differently than the severe forms. While the more severe forms has symptoms that can cause children to be hyper and disruptive leading to diagnosis, less severe forms cause children to be quiet and dreamy and therefore are seen as not causing a problem. It is very common for children with the less severe forms to go well into adulthood without a diagnosis because of this."
Plenty of both men and women aren't diagnosed until adult hood. You want to make it a gender issue (why?), but that does a disservice to all the male children and adults (and there are more males than females affected) who are also not seen to "really have ADHD" because they have the less severe type.
The only person triggered and “making it into a gender issue” is you. People on the thread were skeptical about why Molly would “suddenly” be claiming to have ADHD in adulthood. I pointed out this is really not uncommon, especially for women, who are often underdiagnosed. It is not strange, suspicious or a scam that she could have gone through school, college, etc. and never been diagnosed particularly if she presented, as many undiagnosed women do, with fewer symptoms of hyperactivity.
You are so focused on making everything some kind of culture war that you see the word “woman” and assume it must be some man hating gender war thing when it fact I was simply explaining why it was plausible Molly would only be seeking medication later in life and that it was nothing unusual. It is only you that has to find offence and start trying to “debunk” something well-established and not controversial that has nothing to do with demeaning or ignoring men.
In short, get a life. Facts don’t care about your feelings, as your type loves to say.
I applaud the transparent but agree that in competition TUEs should not be a thing. If you are on medication that can be performance enhancing you just can't race. No different than being on prescription opioids and not being alowed to operate heavy machinery.
I agree that health should be prioritized but that means you sit it out.
1. That’s a stupid comparison
2. Adderall would not have the same stimulant effect on her that it would have on someone without ADHD. It would have a calming effect on her. No unfair advantage there.
No it's not. In both cases the medication you have to take necessitates a career change. You have to choose between the two and in neither case should exceptions be made.
Have you ever found yourself running around a park in your home town and realized you're on the home stretch of your 7th grade race course? Ever been having make-up s** with someone and had your playlist inadvertently skip to your 50 Cent/Lloyd Banks playlist? Remember what it felt like when you were accepted to the college of your first choice or received that bonus that brought your total comp to $250k?
Adderall is all of those feelings, all day. It removes the barrier between what you innately want to do and what you're capable of doing. Adderall makes washing the f***ing dishes feel good. Adderall makes listening to the songs they use to torture prisoners of war feel good. It's probably best suited for mid-d or skilled events, but I can't believe we're having this conversation about its use in competition.
Nearly everyone I know who has been taking it since childhood is *really* screwy when not on the medication. It seems to exacerbate personality defects. Sometimes it's felt like I'm living in a low budget version of the movie Limitless having to interact with these people when they forgot to take their pill.
Adderall is a hard drug. Anyone who does not believe that--"tolerance" be damned--is a goon. I take a hard no to hard drugs stance.
dude you absolutely nailed it except for one thing. Once it starts messing with your sleep and you start taking more of it because your tolerance is built up (which will happen to absolutely everyone) -- That euphoric feeling goes away and it's replaced with paranoia, anxiety and drug dependency.
Having taken it for maybe 10 years I finally got off it but it was absurdly difficult. Adderall is a dangerous drug and prone to abuse that can amplify anxiety and depression. Most people don't take it with any real cohesive plan to ever come off it, which is really dangerous. I wish I knew this when I was younger before I ever took it.
I'd also put Adderall in the same class as benzos in terms of being able to completely alter your state very quickly. You probably won't die from an adderall withdrawal like you could on xanex but the feeling will be pretty similar when you come off them . I've abused both in the past and wish more people knew about the long-term risks of taking it even a few times.
She has been taking Adderall since shortly after Boston.
"Adderall is a combination of amphetamine and dextroamphetamine, two central nervous stimulants that improve focus and reduce impulsivity by increasing dopamine and norepinephrine levels in the brain. The Food and Drug Administration (FDA) approved Adderall in 1996"
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