carmine9 wrote:
hofst wrote:
Like I originally said - one shouldn’t expect someone with your views to follow the NBA.
The poor guy claimed there were 4 black coaches currently in the NBA and I corrected him and noted there were 12.
He cannot admit he was wrong
And I provided the link to where I got the number... Can you not maintain focus long enough to read more than 1 sentence?
It still doesn't matter to anyone but racists what skin color anyone has.
I agree that the answer doesn't likely relate to a sinister conspiracy. I think a tough examination of skill development is required. And that isn't political or inclined towards woke - just simply a question of how to get people better.
TheAdultInTheRoom wrote:
carmine9 wrote:
Like I originally said - one shouldn’t expect someone with your views to follow the NBA.
The poor guy claimed there were 4 black coaches currently in the NBA and I corrected him and noted there were 12.
He cannot admit he was wrong
And I provided the link to where I got the number... Can you not maintain focus long enough to read more than 1 sentence?
You just found a link about the number of black head coaches in the NBA sometime in the past.
You claimed there were 4 now. Not last year.
There are 12.
You were wrong.
Can't admit it, can you?
rogermortimer wrote:
I agree that the answer doesn't likely relate to a sinister conspiracy. I think a tough examination of skill development is required. And that isn't political or inclined towards woke - just simply a question of how to get people better.
You can't have a tough examination of a privileged group. Any criticism is RACIST!
When honesty isn't acceptable you're sort of screwed.
TheAdultInTheRoom wrote:
Runner10287 wrote:
All or nothing is all simpletons understand.
Says the guy who believes in "systemic racism".... LOL!
Do I?
Runner10287 wrote:
TheAdultInTheRoom wrote:
Says the guy who believes in "systemic racism".... LOL!
Do I?
If you think like the guy you're agreeing with you do.
TheAdultInTheRoom wrote:
rogermortimer wrote:
Query why the pipeline of qualified black coaches is not far larger than it is. 70 percent of the players are black? And that figure has been the case for some time? There needs to be tough questions as to why the pipeline is not bigger. Football is a sport where for the most part to coach you have to have played at a reasonably high level (there are exceptions). Note Mike Tomlin played for William and Mary - hardly a football power. Yet he is a very competent (and some could argue more than that) coach. I don't discount the prospect of racism but at the same time there are some difficult questions to ask. Why aren't black coaches moving beyond assistant coaching gigs to head coaching? Being a head coach is difficult, and takes far more than X's and O's skills - although those are important, too. I find the situation perplexing. The pro game is unlike the college game in that the leader must command respect and cannot get away with the command and control behaviors of college coaches. Witness the Urban Meyer situation. Just perplexing, because there has to be any number of former black players and coaches who can relate to players (and just like any population, some cannot) and lead.
This is the same nonsense they do with gender.
Engineers are 90% male because engineering is SEXIST! No... engineers are 90% male because women tend not to be interested in engineering.
The answer doesn't always have to be some sinister conspiracy.
Do you know that for a fact? Many women are turned away because it is a male dominated industry where they are not given a fair chance. Or they are hired to fill a quota. Most relics in the engineering field still view women as belonging at home. This has been an industry issue for decades, but go ahead with the bored/not interested rationale.
I thought a lot of this interview with Darius Butler was really good and insightful, especially on the point about why there aren't more Black coaches in the league. At about the 7:30 mark, he talks about why he would not want to go through the pains of being on the bottom rung again of being a coach, and how most of the problem is that years of playing experience is not usually taken into account when deciding if you will be a coach. You have to go back to grinding and putting in your dues, which generally means you have to start out putting in 10x the number of work hours than you did as a player. Many former athletes don't want have to go back and start that kind of grind all over again. And as been pointed out, most of the former players are black. And frankly, regardless of race, many players that are the best at what they do sometimes make poor coaches.
Many coaches in the NFL, head and assistant, were unathletic white guys that were never good enough see the field ever, or never beyond college. They go immediately into coaching because that is all they can do to stay with the game they love. They start the grind of coaching at grad positions at 20 years old, eventually working into higher positions by their 30s. Exceptions are the football savants like McVay. White guys couldn't play, so instead they coach! Stetson Bennett is not going to be good enough to play in the NFL, so he is probably going to head into coaching. So there's another white guy for the mix!
carmine9 wrote:
TheAdultInTheRoom wrote:
The poor guy claimed there were 4 black coaches currently in the NBA and I corrected him and noted there were 12.
He cannot admit he was wrong
And I provided the link to where I got the number... Can you not maintain focus long enough to read more than 1 sentence?
You just found a link about the number of black head coaches in the NBA sometime in the past.
You claimed there were 4 now. Not last year.
There are 12.
You were wrong.
Can't admit it, can you?
The article that said 4 was from September of 2021... This is the 2021-2022 season.
I was wrong.
It still doesn't matter what color the coach is.
rogermortimer wrote:
Query why the pipeline of qualified black coaches is not far larger than it is. 70 percent of the players are black? And that figure has been the case for some time? There needs to be tough questions as to why the pipeline is not bigger. Football is a sport where for the most part to coach you have to have played at a reasonably high level (there are exceptions). Note Mike Tomlin played for William and Mary - hardly a football power. Yet he is a very competent (and some could argue more than that) coach. I don't discount the prospect of racism but at the same time there are some difficult questions to ask. Why aren't black coaches moving beyond assistant coaching gigs to head coaching? Being a head coach is difficult, and takes far more than X's and O's skills - although those are important, too. I find the situation perplexing. The pro game is unlike the college game in that the leader must command respect and cannot get away with the command and control behaviors of college coaches. Witness the Urban Meyer situation. Just perplexing, because there has to be any number of former black players and coaches who can relate to players (and just like any population, some cannot) and lead.
We already have gone over this. Being a current or former NFL player does not mean that you would be a good NFL coach. None of the 4 most recent SB coaches played in the NFL. Is it surprising that having exceptional speed/size/power/etc is not highly correlated to being a successful coach, which requires an entirely different set of skills? The best coach of them all, BB, never played in the NFL. Thinking that because 70% of the players are black should mean that 70% of the coaches should be black or that there should be a lot of potential head coaches in that 70% pool is pure nonsense.
Also, there have been plenty of black head coaches in the NFL in recent years and most have been disasters and fired. Wilks took an 8-8 Arizona team and turned it into a 3-13 dumpster fire and people are shocked he was fired. Someone like Romeo Crennel might be a good coordinator but his 4-12 season with the Browns got him fired. KC then hired him (where is all of the complaining about teams rehiring the same retreads?) and he was 4-15 with them before being fired. If you are a head coach and you are do a horrible job, like Judge or Gase did (twice), then you get fired and your skin color doesn't matter.
hiring or firing wrote:
TheAdultInTheRoom wrote:
This is the same nonsense they do with gender.
Engineers are 90% male because engineering is SEXIST! No... engineers are 90% male because women tend not to be interested in engineering.
The answer doesn't always have to be some sinister conspiracy.
Do you know that for a fact? Many women are turned away because it is a male dominated industry where they are not given a fair chance. Or they are hired to fill a quota. Most relics in the engineering field still view women as belonging at home. This has been an industry issue for decades, but go ahead with the bored/not interested rationale.
The Nordic countries tried this experiment over the last 40 years... No countries have put more effort into being egalitarian and no where is the disparity between the interests of the sexes more pronounced than in the Nordic countries.
It's only an "issue" because people make it an issue. Men would rather be engineers than nurses. Women would rather be teachers than cops. Human nature is not a sinister plot.
Ignoring 200,000 years of human evolution doesn't make you clever it makes you lazy/ignorant.
fish man wrote:
I thought a lot of this interview with Darius Butler was really good and insightful, especially on the point about why there aren't more Black coaches in the league. At about the 7:30 mark, he talks about why he would not want to go through the pains of being on the bottom rung again of being a coach, and how most of the problem is that years of playing experience is not usually taken into account when deciding if you will be a coach. You have to go back to grinding and putting in your dues, which generally means you have to start out putting in 10x the number of work hours than you did as a player. Many former athletes don't want have to go back and start that kind of grind all over again. And as been pointed out, most of the former players are black. And frankly, regardless of race, many players that are the best at what they do sometimes make poor coaches.
Many coaches in the NFL, head and assistant, were unathletic white guys that were never good enough see the field ever, or never beyond college. They go immediately into coaching because that is all they can do to stay with the game they love. They start the grind of coaching at grad positions at 20 years old, eventually working into higher positions by their 30s. Exceptions are the football savants like McVay. White guys couldn't play, so instead they coach! Stetson Bennett is not going to be good enough to play in the NFL, so he is probably going to head into coaching. So there's another white guy for the mix!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tpOX2SOH2j4
+1000
TheAdultInTheRoom wrote:
carmine9 wrote:
And I provided the link to where I got the number... Can you not maintain focus long enough to read more than 1 sentence?
You just found a link about the number of black head coaches in the NBA sometime in the past.
You claimed there were 4 now. Not last year.
There are 12.
You were wrong.
Can't admit it, can you?
The article that said 4 was from September of 2021... This is the 2021-2022 season.
I was wrong.
It still doesn't matter what color the coach is.
This is Feb 2022. Not Sept 2021. You di get that?
Meanwhile, 1 black head coach in the NFL. 32 jobs. In 2022. Not 1952.
Steve The Addict OFFICIAL -----^^^^^ wrote:
How many white cornerbacks are there in the nfl? Any? Racism!!!!!
Racism or simply the fact whites don't possess the needed speed to play cornerback at the NFL level?
We have never seen a 9.8 white sprinter, that isn't racism that is simply a fact of life.
Racism is saying.....only blacks can run a sub 9,9.
carmine9 wrote:
TheAdultInTheRoom wrote:
The article that said 4 was from September of 2021... This is the 2021-2022 season.
I was wrong.
It still doesn't matter what color the coach is.
This is Feb 2022. Not Sept 2021. You di get that?
Meanwhile, 1 black head coach in the NFL. 32 jobs. In 2022. Not 1952.
You're aware that the NBA pre-season starts in early October right? If I hear there's 12 coaches in late September I'm going to assume no one got hired or fired 3 days before the season starts. That's not how franchises operate.
0 white cornerbacks in the NFL. That's RACIST!
If the NFL was entirely black with a single white guy on 1 team you'd be complaining that he took some poor brother's job.
You're a racist. Get over it it isn't 1952.
Ben Shiller wrote:
rogermortimer wrote:
Query why the pipeline of qualified black coaches is not far larger than it is. 70 percent of the players are black? And that figure has been the case for some time? There needs to be tough questions as to why the pipeline is not bigger. Football is a sport where for the most part to coach you have to have played at a reasonably high level (there are exceptions). Note Mike Tomlin played for William and Mary - hardly a football power. Yet he is a very competent (and some could argue more than that) coach. I don't discount the prospect of racism but at the same time there are some difficult questions to ask. Why aren't black coaches moving beyond assistant coaching gigs to head coaching? Being a head coach is difficult, and takes far more than X's and O's skills - although those are important, too. I find the situation perplexing. The pro game is unlike the college game in that the leader must command respect and cannot get away with the command and control behaviors of college coaches. Witness the Urban Meyer situation. Just perplexing, because there has to be any number of former black players and coaches who can relate to players (and just like any population, some cannot) and lead.
We already have gone over this. Being a current or former NFL player does not mean that you would be a good NFL coach. None of the 4 most recent SB coaches played in the NFL. Is it surprising that having exceptional speed/size/power/etc is not highly correlated to being a successful coach, which requires an entirely different set of skills? The best coach of them all, BB, never played in the NFL. Thinking that because 70% of the players are black should mean that 70% of the coaches should be black or that there should be a lot of potential head coaches in that 70% pool is pure nonsense.
Also, there have been plenty of black head coaches in the NFL in recent years and most have been disasters and fired. Wilks took an 8-8 Arizona team and turned it into a 3-13 dumpster fire and people are shocked he was fired. Someone like Romeo Crennel might be a good coordinator but his 4-12 season with the Browns got him fired. KC then hired him (where is all of the complaining about teams rehiring the same retreads?) and he was 4-15 with them before being fired. If you are a head coach and you are do a horrible job, like Judge or Gase did (twice), then you get fired and your skin color doesn't matter.
So your argument is that there is only one qualified black man for 32 jobs in the NFL.
You should have an adult in the room to explain all the posts to you. You have to be the dumbest poster in the history of Letsrun by a long ways. Does it hurt to be you?
TheAdultInTheRoom wrote:
carmine9 wrote:
The article that said 4 was from September of 2021... This is the 2021-2022 season.
I was wrong.
It still doesn't matter what color the coach is.
This is Feb 2022. Not Sept 2021. You di get that?
Meanwhile, 1 black head coach in the NFL. 32 jobs. In 2022. Not 1952.
You're aware that the NBA pre-season starts in early October right? If I hear there's 12 coaches in late September I'm going to assume no one got hired or fired 3 days before the season starts. That's not how franchises operate.
Do you fail to understand the concept of the present? The now. You said there are 4 black head coaches in the NBA now. When you made that claim, there were in fact 12. Still trying to justify your lie.
carmine9 wrote:
Ben Shiller wrote:
We already have gone over this. Being a current or former NFL player does not mean that you would be a good NFL coach. None of the 4 most recent SB coaches played in the NFL. Is it surprising that having exceptional speed/size/power/etc is not highly correlated to being a successful coach, which requires an entirely different set of skills? The best coach of them all, BB, never played in the NFL. Thinking that because 70% of the players are black should mean that 70% of the coaches should be black or that there should be a lot of potential head coaches in that 70% pool is pure nonsense.
Also, there have been plenty of black head coaches in the NFL in recent years and most have been disasters and fired. Wilks took an 8-8 Arizona team and turned it into a 3-13 dumpster fire and people are shocked he was fired. Someone like Romeo Crennel might be a good coordinator but his 4-12 season with the Browns got him fired. KC then hired him (where is all of the complaining about teams rehiring the same retreads?) and he was 4-15 with them before being fired. If you are a head coach and you are do a horrible job, like Judge or Gase did (twice), then you get fired and your skin color doesn't matter.
So your argument is that there is only one qualified black man for 32 jobs in the NFL.
I don't understand this post. Is it a question or statement? If you had read my post, which it appears you did not or did not closely, you would have understood that what I stated is that there isn't this massive pool of qualified black coaches out there because 70% of the league is black. Of course there is more than 1 qualified black guy out there to be a head coach. But you know what, there also is more than zero qualified Asian guys, there is more than zero qualified women, more than zero qualified Pacific Islander guys, more than zero qualified LBGT people, etc. If you are an owner, you should be able to hire whoever you want to (assuming you don't break any laws doing so) and don't need the woke mob demanding that you hire people who fit its agenda. The owners, in general, do a horrible job identifying potentially good coaches and continually are in a state of having to fire and hire new ones but that's their issue.
carmine9 wrote:
Ben Shiller wrote:
We already have gone over this. Being a current or former NFL player does not mean that you would be a good NFL coach. None of the 4 most recent SB coaches played in the NFL. Is it surprising that having exceptional speed/size/power/etc is not highly correlated to being a successful coach, which requires an entirely different set of skills? The best coach of them all, BB, never played in the NFL. Thinking that because 70% of the players are black should mean that 70% of the coaches should be black or that there should be a lot of potential head coaches in that 70% pool is pure nonsense.
Also, there have been plenty of black head coaches in the NFL in recent years and most have been disasters and fired. Wilks took an 8-8 Arizona team and turned it into a 3-13 dumpster fire and people are shocked he was fired. Someone like Romeo Crennel might be a good coordinator but his 4-12 season with the Browns got him fired. KC then hired him (where is all of the complaining about teams rehiring the same retreads?) and he was 4-15 with them before being fired. If you are a head coach and you are do a horrible job, like Judge or Gase did (twice), then you get fired and your skin color doesn't matter.
So your argument is that there is only one qualified black man for 32 jobs in the NFL.
Just because you're qualified doesn't mean you get the job...
Just because you're qualified doesn't mean there aren't other people more qualified.
Watching guys like Hugh Jackson and Flores play the race card ain't helping your case either.
Imagine how the poor Steelers must feel. They've got one of the most overrated coaches in NFL history who's squandered more talent than any coach in history and they can't get rid of him because of his skin color.