50+ Masters Training and Racing Open Forum

Enough rest. OK, now mop the floor. :-)

Ghost of Igloi wrote:

Enough rest. OK, now mop the floor. :-)

It's about to hit 90 F. here, "feels like 93." I actually beat the heat by getting out there in the late morning.

I'm on the Atlantic coast, so I'm sure it's a lot hotter where other people are, maybe including you.

I’m posting a day early because I’m taking off tomorrow for a backpacking trip, a second attempt at the one we truncated four weeks ago because of voracious mosquitoes. I’m sure there will still be mosquitoes but hopefully they’ll be less intense by now.

The gyms were shut down again last week so I no longer have to agonize over whether I should go. I’m doing some very light dumbbell and body-weight exercises on most days, but mostly just running. I ran Monday through Saturday for a total of 66 miles. This morning was my best run since the PMR started in March, 11.4 miles at 9:23 pace. That level of effort would have been good for more like 8:45 pace in February, but I’ll take the local improvement. Everything I read about PMR says that while it produces severe (if untreated) pain and stiffness, it doesn’t cause loss of muscle strength. I suppose that refers to "clinical" rather than "athletic" muscle strength—I just can’t push off with the power I used to. Maybe I don’t mind that there are no races in sight in my area.

Brittle, I just can’t believe that it’s good for you to regularly run so hard that you’re that trashed. Be careful and try to get out early before it’s so hot!

I’ll catch up with everyone next week, mosquitoes willing.

amkelley wrote:

Brittle, I just can’t believe that it’s good for you to regularly run so hard that you’re that trashed.

Unfortunately, at my level of fitness, I don't have to run very hard to get trashed. No strength these days. Part of the reason may be all the weight loss, from 184 on Jan. 1 down to 158 this morning (18.7 BMI). They say you lose muscle along with fat. I tried to be good about doing strength work while I was losing, but I could have been a lot more diligent. When you are losing weight you're tired a lot, so you don't always feel like working out. Then the gyms shut down in March and I had to improvise. Which I am doing now, fairly successfully I believe.

Your training continues to impress: 66 miles, wow! Have a great hike!

Again a week of simple base work.

Mo. 10x100m with walk back

Tu. 13.5 km easy

We. Off, tired

Th. 1 h jumps, drills, sprints uphill

Fr. 13.5 km easy

Sa. 10x330m uphill with jog down

Su. 1:25 h LR hilly, first 50 min easy, then steady

Saturday and Sunday were good for a nap afterwards.

The Offdays keep me going. Otherwise, I would struggle to finish the week and will need a downweek afterwards.

A friend invited me to join a HM in early October.

Dear coaches out there, what would you change in my schedule?

For sure, I do not want to neglect speed&strength work.

Idea is to increase the easy runs to 15 km and focus on 1 h "fast" on Saturday followed by a LR on Sunday (1:45). This combo is tough and effective for me. I would need the entire August to master it and could work with it in September. High aerobic fartleks such as minutes do work, too. All these American mile intervals are not very effective for me and bear a high risk of injury. What is your advice?

Someone misunderstood my handle that I am a newbie to running. I do run longer than 35 years. Will be M50 next winter.

Have a good week, stay healthy!

Btw: never did such a long race like HM. Longest was a single 17 km XC about 20 years ago...

Happy Sunday, fellow masters! My only complaint this week again is in regard to the weather. HHH weather has returned after a bit of a midweek break. As such, I have proactively reduced the volume of my runs for health reasons. Heat is nothing to challenge, especially at our ages. Please ignore anyone who ignorantly belittles you for being cautious with dangerous heat conditions. Listen to the medical experts instead.

On the bright side, the calf has responded well. There is still some occasional mild tightness, but it has not negatively affected my runs. The calf sleeve has been sidelined. With the better midweek weather, I was able to get in a 50+’ run for the first time in awhile. I also did a shorter run, but at a higher intensity than usual lately. Everything responded well! Put me down for a happy and healthy 17 actual running miles for the week.

Sun: 44’ CR; body wt ex

Mon: off

Tues: 55’ CR; swim; body wt ex + med ball routine

Wed: off

Thu: 39’ CR’; 12 oz. curls

Fri: off

Sat: 44’ CR; swim; body wt ex + med ball routine

Best to most!

Sending this early as we head to the Petri Dish AKA, North Myrtle Beach. We are approaching this like it’s a safari with dangerous animals on the prowl.

BM58: I know that feeling. I’m sitting at the computer after my Sat run and I look down and the floor is full of some sort or water…. what the heck did I spill…. oh…. it’s me….

Amk: Hope the skeeters leave you alone. Nice week!

Tue = 4 miles with 8 X (1 min “on” 2 min “off”) acceleration bursts, peaking at 5:19 pace

Thr = 4 miles cemetery, easy

Sat = 4 miles with 3@8:09 pace (7:54, 8:25, 8:08) 85 degrees with 85% humidity

Sun = 4 miles easy, early before heading to the beach

M/W/F = 3 X (9 exercises X 15 reps) with 15-pound dumbbells

Here in Hillbilly-Land, today will mark 19 days in a row over 90. By Thr we will break a 100-year record with consecutive 90+ days. The only positive is the grass is all dead and I don’t have to mow! Winning!

SAT was another one of those runs I can only categorize as good heat conditioning. The air temp was 5 degrees cooler than last Sat but the humidity was ridiculous. If measured by effort rather than time then I hurt pretty bad and thus it was a darned good workout.

I’m motivated by the 5K I signed up for on Aug 15th. I actually paid my money for fear of it filling up and as a sign of faith that it will go on. That one will be very hot and humid with zero shade. They are doing it in physically distanced waves, so, since I am slow, I will get to go later…. when it is even more hot. I don’t care, I’ll take it!

Stay cool and, like Nancy said, “Just say NO to drugs!”

*Week 476*

A Sweltering Greetings from the Bluegrass, 50+ers! Loved all the stories from back-in-the-day.; reminds me of having to purchase running shoes out of the back of someone's car at races, since there weren't any shoe stores carrying running shoes at the time. That first purchase I made was from a guy who would eventually start a running shoe store in Madison, WI, called Movin' Shoes; the independent running shoe store is still going strong all these years later. I've been following the Castille story, too, with a real sadness. If it has been going on so long, and he has competed in so many sanctioned events, I'm befuddled that he would have been able to elude detection. When he came to Lexington about a decade ago, he did so that his daughter could attend a school for the deaf in Danville. John's Run/Walk Shop gave him a part-time job and paid his entry fees, but by all accounts he was living a pretty meager existence, mostly training solo on the hilly trails of Raven Run, a nature preserve along the Kentucky River. I can't imagine that he would have had a network of trainers to help mask what he was doing, so it should have been easy....hence the befuddlement. He's always been extremely gracious to me and any of the other runners in our community here in the bluegrass. That's all I have on the topic; just shaking my head.

OK, so how was my week? With the sweltering heat and humidity, I kind of struggled this week. I did get out every day, as our club is having a "dog days of summer streaker challenge"...not that kind of streaker ;-) . Managed about 25 miles on 5 days of walking and 2 days of Run/Walk, but only one of those Run/Walks was notable. Friday, after it rained, it cooled off enough that I tried to make a concerted running effort. Ran 1.7, 0.6, 3x0.2 mile efforts with 0.3, 0.2, 0.1 mile walks in between. the 1.7 was in the low to mid 8's/mi, while the 0.6 was just under 8, and the three 0.2's were in the mid-7's. This was progress for me, though yesterday, my knee did feel a little wonky (but not painful, just some clicking...probably a tight tendon.)

Hope everyone has a great week. Good to read all your stories. If you have a chance, grab a nice pair of binoculars and take a look at comet Neowise. It'll be getting fainter each day as it moves away from the Sun, even as it moves closer to Earth, Stay safe out there (Rtype, a trip to Myrtle Beach sounds a bit dicey)!

All the Best!

Anybody here ever been drug tested? I was...once.

I had just finished the Edmund Fitzgerald 100K...a 62 mile race from Little Marais to Duluth along the banks of Lake Superior...it served as the USA National Championships and a qualifier for the Worlds.

At any rate, they drug tested top plus 3 at random...that was me, 7th place and a random selection. They usher each of us into the school gym nearby the finish line along with a personal escort. The guys that had finished 10 and 15 minutes ahead of me were milling about aimlessly with empty cups in their hand.

Have you ever tried to pee after running as hard as you could for 7 hours?

I sent my girlfriend out for a suitcase of beer while we all stagered about wishing we could 'go'...Audrey returns with the diuretic beverages which we pass about to all takers...5 or 10 minutes later, there's a line for the single stall urinal.

Scratched out 36 mostly butt slow miles this week...highlight was seeing the biggest fox of my life...thought it was a coyote initially...and it was just leaving the area where my neighbor keeps goats...and chickens...had something sizable in its mouth...not sure what it was...not a goat.

Wishing everybody a productive week of fitness.

your pla,

MF

“A friend invited me to join a HM in early October.

Dear coaches out there, what would you change in my schedule?“

Newbi,

I would add some Tempo-Long-Tempo runs (Daniels’ Term). Something like this: 3 x mile tempo pace / 1:00 rest + 7 miles easy + 3 x mile tempo pace / 1:00 rest.

Igy

“Anybody here ever been drug tested? I was...once.”

MikeF,

Following 1972 Olympic Trials Marathon. I believe it was more a research project than a PED test. Anyway, early days. I was extremely dehydrated, having had a cold, and warm/hot conditions. I waited and waited without an urge. One of my friends came by to hurry me up. He said” I need to take a piss.” We both looked at one another, and he supplied my sample.

Igy

“reminds me of having to purchase running shoes out of the back of someone's car at races, since there weren't any shoe stores carrying running shoes at the time. That first purchase I made was from a guy who would eventually start a running shoe store in Madison, WI, called Movin' Shoes; the independent running shoe store is still going strong all these years later.”

lucKY2b,

My first foray into organized running was cross country in the fall of 1965. My parents purchase my first pair of spikes which was manufactured by the popular football and baseball cleat manufacturer Hyde. They were very stiff and inflexible. Out team qualified for the Los Angeles City Championships for a 10th Grade Team. My dad took me over to the San Fernando Valley to the one place in the area to buy some Adidas Melborne spikes. They featured a white kangaroo upper, three green stripes, and four non-removable stainless steel spikes. The spikes were about 3/4 inches in length and were typically sharpened with a file before races.

Igy

Good morning from Covid 19 infested Boise, Idaho. Masks are now mandatory, but they numbers and deaths continue to climb. My week started well, but slowed with an ankle niggle by Thursday. Hopefully get back on track in a few days.

Monday: AM- 2 miles E; 2 x ( 6 x 200m good speed / 100m easy; 400m easy; 4 x 350m good swing / 150m easy ) 400m between sets; mile easy

Tuesday: 1,000 yards swimming

Wednesday: 2 miles easy; 4 x 1,200m tempo @ 5:57, 5:52, 5:45, 5:23 / 2:00 rest; mile E

Thursday: 1,000 yards swimming

Friday: 3 mile walk

Saturday: 2 mile walk

Sunday: Off

Have a good week.

Igy

In 30 years of masters running and about a dozen Nationals races ( 1 track and the rest XC) I've never been tested, although, before last year my best Nationals finishes were a couple of 5ths in my age groups. I don't remember testing being done on anyone in the hundreds of road races I have done.

I had an up and down week due to a mental lapse rather than any physical issues. Mid-week I just skipped my Wednesday and Thursday runs because I didn't feel motivated to get out the door. Friday I realized what I already knew, that I always have been a very goal-oriented runner and I don't have any races on the horizon for probably at least another 6 months. I now need to set some specific dates and distances to at least time trial in order to stick to a consistent training process.

I got some added inspiration yesterday from my son and his family in NZ where they now are back to racing and gave me some fun race reports. My son and his wife raced 4k XC and my 8 year old grandson raced 2k XC on Saturday. My daughter-in-law won the women's race overall. My son, who was the oldest runner in the men's race at 40, got 10th overall and 1st master. He also got thoroughly heckled by his wife and son for his performance. As he recounted, there were two 19yr olds in the race who were headed to the US on college scholarships that he had no expectation of beating. Then there was the next oldest guy in the race in his late 20s and six high school runners who all were pretty close. My son and the other guy sat on the high schoolers to 3k and then pushed on ahead of them. The other older guy kept pushing and got a gap of 30-40 meters on the high school group while my son just moved about 10 meters ahead of them and figured he'd hold them off and make a move with about 200 meters to go. Bad tactical decision. My son has not done any speed work for about a year and all six of the high schoolers kicked by him and missed catching the other older guy by about a meter at the finish. My grandson won the 8 and under division of the kids race and was 3rd overall in the 2k race.

Also, I've been re-motivated since my grandson now is following me on Strava. I ran what I thought was a pretty solid workout yesterday morning with my other son, running 8:08/mi for 6 miles on a rolling trail. In the afternoon I saw that my grandson had averaged 7:14/mi for his XC. I'm sure I could beat that, but not for too much longer. When I was talking to my son yesterday afternoon he told me that he saw my grandson looking at my recent runs on Strava and asked if my grandson was going to give me kudos for the runs. My grandson replied, "I'm not going to give Grandpa kudos unless he does a good effort." So, don't expect a pat on the back unless you put in the effort to earn it.

Enjoy your running and stay healthy!

I was supposed to be hauling a backpack up the side of a mountain right now, but I’m not. The weather forecast changed to a significant chance of thunderstorms, and in the Sierras that can mean three inches of hail out of nowhere. We decided it was a bad idea to risk getting stuck in a severe T-storm with two young dogs who have never seen a major storm, and postponed the trip to Thursday through Saturday of the coming week. Call us wimps. So I ran another 10.6 miles today to give me 76+ for the week.

The Kevin Castille story is another sad ending for someone who was really good and couldn’t resist crossing the line to try to be better. I was drug tested once, after my Trials qualifying race at the Twin Cities Marathon in 1991. I was so thrilled with my race, and so physically and mentally exhausted, that I remember very little about it, but I do vaguely recall being shadowed by a race official after the finish until I was able to produce a sample. No interesting story like MikeF’s or Igy’s (who now apparently admits to falsifying his drug test, 48 years after the fact!).

My heart goes out to all of you sweltering in the heat and humidity. Here it's darned hot but at least it's dry. Rtype, best of luck on having your race go. All races in California appear to be cancelled at least until November. However, my husband, a bike racer, still holds out hope of competing in the district time trial championship the first week of September. Clearly a bike time trial, where a small number of riders go off individually at intervals of 30-120 sec, is about as safe as you can get. I still don’t think they’ll get approval to go but my husband is training for it until he knows it’s cancelled.

Stay cool, everyone!

sorry your trip didn't work out, but sounds like a good decision for sure.

Like Rtype we [DC area] had a 90+ streak going at 19 days in a row, but thursday broke the spell [high 80's, sunny, and humid not actually that much more comfortable]. so the weather gods got mad and started another streak with 96, 98, and today's supposed to hit 98 as well. ouch.

nothing much to add to the insightful comments on this and other threads about the doping situation, but I've been motivated over past few days to think of the opposite -- not just not-cheating, but actively good sportspersonship among masters.

small example: 2007 i won M45-49 age group at cherry blossom 10-mile by a small margin ahead of Robert Marino. I'd heard of him but didn't know him, didn't know we were in an AG finishing kick duel, or anything. Just met him in the finish area. Initial online results showed him as the AG winner. Before I could even say anything about it, he'd emailed the race director requesting a correction and tossing in praise for my race.

Maybe I'm naive, but I think there are 50 Robert Marino's in masters running for every doper/course cutter/cheater.

.....as to this week, thanks everyone for kind feedback on time trial last weekend. Good recovery week for me:

M 10 miles

Tu 8

W 11 w/ 2 X 10:00 (2:00 recovery) at half-marathon pace (passed 1.5 miles in 9:40/9:35)

Th 9

F 8 with drills and strides

Sa 9

Su 11

have a great week,

Dave

Newbi, Igy is giving you good advice on HM training. I'm a big proponent of the Tempo run. Maybe too big, and that is how I got injured this time, so not too often!

Brittle, Lucky, everyone -- good luck with heat and be careful. I'm lucky, even on hot days in Sonoma County, the mornings are crisp enough. And amk, I hope the mosquitos stay away! Nasty little vampires...

I ran 3x for a big 4 miles this week at about 10-minute pace. Testing my left Achilles. Little f*%$#er is still pretty sore, so I'll keep laying off for a few more weeks.

The local marathon (fast, pretty course, includes my much-loved creek trail) is still listed for late November. I'm dreaming, yes, but it pulls me forward.

When I lived in Oaxaca, where there was prize money in local races, you'd get course cutters and age cheaters looking for a few bucks. Well, it is a poor economy overall. I did wonder whether people were getting into the EPO too.

Most people were honest of course and it was a very competitive scene, the town has a great running tradition.

Once in a 10K in the city center, I dropped a very competitive opponent at about 3 miles plus. Then I threw it down. With less than a mile to go, I caught him again! He was going strong, but I was pissed. With about 80m to go, I thought "What would Mo Farah do?" and nipped the cheater. I had to laugh at myself for getting so angry, but it helped my race.