TINMAN BASHES WEJO's COACH

E wrote:

If you don't know this, it is Much Ado about Nothing. Not quite sure what you meant by it though.

just proving the absurdity of the whole thread

nit picking . much to do about nothing

Kevin Beck is 3rd person panache and he does write as a profession.

Bullshit. Kevin Beck is most certainly not 3rd Person Panache. I know because I was watching Beck get the worst of a knife fight outside a taqueria in Kingman, Arizona at the same time one of the above posts went up. Trust me on this.

DB Irregular wrote:

Bullshit. Kevin Beck is most certainly not 3rd Person Panache. I know because I was watching Beck get the worst of a knife fight outside a taqueria in Kingman, Arizona at the same time one of the above posts went up. Trust me on this.

Did this taqueria have internet access, or were you just following along with your blackberry?

That's Elmira, Oregon, right? If so, I'll be sure to tell Todd and Evan's sisters here in Colorado just how much their coach thinks of their talent.

CSI Guy wrote:

Did this taqueria have internet access, or were you just following along with your blackberry?

Every post has a time stamp. You're slipping, Gil

You make a terrible Hunter S. Thompson impression. Don't try. You are not good. Thank you. The Staff.

I'm speaking of my team as a whole in general by the average of our times of all runners #1-#7 when we first started our season. I didn't single out any kids in my program saying they were of minimal talent. I said my team. Your definition of minimal may be different than mine. I wasn't putting them down. I'm referring to what we started out with in the beginning of our season. We did have minimal talent to start with. Most teams usually have a top dog who is an exceptional runner, some have more. Todd was our top runner and Evan was close behind him. Even those two improved tremendously! You can even ask Todd or Evan yourself. Todd personally wrote in a card he gave me at our xc banquet that he was impressed with what I did as a coach with the team based on the overall talent we lacked in some of our guys. I can't exactly recall what word he used, but it was very complimentary to me and to his teammates as well. As he basically felt our team came along way with what we started out with. Todd and all the guys were stoked at placing 2nd with what we had in the beginning to what we did in the end. It was the best in school history for State XC. I was so proud of all of them for improving so much! You can twist things around all you want and interpret it anyway you want. I'm a positive coach and the kids believed in the training we were doing because their performances and end of the season results showed that what we did in our training did work and produce them eventually into a great team. I'm glad you responded and I hope you take in the explanation before you start spreading false rumors based on your interpretation of minimal talent. Take care!

Does it matter than it was Tinman and not some unknown poster who "BASHED" wejo's coach?

halfpint10 wrote:

I didn't single out any kids in my program saying they were of minimal talent. I said my team.

Let's dig this hole a little deeper . . . .

"We kick some ass and the kids had minimal talent-----but my team did so well because they were trained correctly."

Nope, that sounds like you're just messaging your own ego, regardless of the defensiveness of your explanation. The entire Carman family is so talented you'd have to take a sledgehammer to their legs to have them not improve.

There are a few more things I should point out, but I'll stop there. The KIDS did a great job this year. Have a nice day!

halfpint10 wrote:

Todd personally wrote in a card he gave me at our xc banquet that he was impressed with what I did as a coach with the team based on the overall talent we lacked in some of our guys. I can't exactly recall what word he used, but it was very complimentary to me and to his teammates as well.

You mean you thought that "self-aggrandizing" was complimentary?

I me my me I me my me. Ego ego ego. Get over yourself Mrs. Tinman. Before you both rust in the Oregon rain.

HERE,

http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=688037&page=5

Cabral say:

"JK he misunderstood lots the Rui Silva training. But that i will discuss publicaly only with him, because that´s not fair to made some comments or discussing about what someone wrotes (me about Rui) with that the other one knows (i just knew that later on because a friend told me). I would do that unpolite act that he did to me. Since i have my e-mail adress in that article, if he is a polite man he would send me an email made me know that he did comment my article."

AND HERE

http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=688037&page=6

Cabral say:

"...if I was JK and among colleagues I will let know the authour that i´ve done comments about his article... he could be the kindness to let me know, just that."

BUT HERE:

http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?board=1&id=553971&thread=458338

Cabral say:

"About JK ideas. I don´t want to discuss with you or with no one JK ideas. Or I discuss directly side-by-side or undirectly I don´t want to discuss. But since he did post in the net PUBLIC articles and turn his traing ideas PUBLIC I have the right to comment. Thus I keep on with my comment."

AND HERE:

http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=458338&page=6

Cabral say:

"By commenting that´s like a critic - a movie critic or an art critic. he goes to see the movie and then he do the COMMENT. In the concrete case i did read public JK ideas in the net - i can leggaly comment !"

So Cabral, here's a simple question. Not, did JK understand or did not understand your article on Rui Silva, but did you email JK as a "polite man" when you commented on his articles (above)?

Not listening

No, in my opinion by the comments JK made he don´t understand most of the article and their training target. That´s not because he doesn´t know what´s training of course that because i see Rui training as to serve their training concepts.

I will tell just one example, but i will put one condition.

I don´t want to be pressure or make the mistake that after one example you will come saying that my example that´s irrelevant, or that is just a detail. In our modern society some tends not to admire the others by the positive side or their knowledge pr their achievements. People tends to act like a bunch of followers that simple immaculate and divinise their heroes. Here in this site - or another - we can´t comment and/or disagree or doubt about the ones that some consider their training masters. The most common appreciation is or the absolution or the condemn. That´s a quite middle age barbarian atitude. Some they are the new barbarians.

Well i go to send you one example, but i would love that you include in your my quotes, what ive said about JK - that i consider him a great coach, one of the worlds best.

Here goes:

<<....Notice in the article itself that Silva did some of his long repeats on grass without as much regard for TIMES; instead, the training was effort-based. Also notice that the speeds on the reps were almost always INCREASED as the workout progressed. In fact, the first reps were under control enough on some sessions that the last rep was run WAY faster. This means that Silva was NOT TESTING himself on each rep. Instead, he was TRAINING....>>

That´s wrong in the conclusions because that´s wrong in the facts. All Rui workouts were dated. The fact that he did that on grass that´s just because the track that the coach wants to to that is close, and they have no track access. Otherwise Rui will have done that as usual. As a consequence of this miss of information about the true reasons because he did that on grass, mr. JK keeps on going with comments that are useful to his own training principles. That´s wrong. Rui always try his best in that reps a kind of Control tests, not in his all out effort, but not also as JK pretends "...was not testing himself on each rep... ". Wrong. He is testing himself in each rep in the case of the one that i mention the set chrono result. Of course that in the seasons that the data of my article he wans´t yet the runner he is now, but he uses often rabbits that able him to run intense paces.

Thus in that case the training philosophy in that specific workouts is the opposite that JK comment. I end with the same idea that I start. This doesn´t get out all JKcredits as a great coach, but that he made some wrong comments he did.

Antonio,

In a way it is good that you answered as you did, because it allows you and I to see that you too are answering the question that suits you, but you are not answering the question I asked. Everyone on here is extremely impressed with your command of the English language, but your command is letting you down sometimes (not always, but sometimes).

Here (and you can check) is the question I asked you: "did you email JK as a "polite man" when you commented on his articles (above)?"

That is not the question you answered.

Sometimes we are all guilty of hearing what we want to hear when we read a post by someone else. As you just said, JK (because he did not know all the details) took the wrong impression from your article on Rui Silva, maybe because that suited what he wanted to hear, or it suited the point he wanted to make in his article.

But YOU know that he was basing that on a wrong impression, that Rui Silva was training the way he did for another reason, and not the one that JK thought. So (with no intent to misguide anyone) JK was mistaken in his analysis of your article, and you are right. I'm confident JK would be the first to acknowledge the point you make.

But now look again at the question I asked you. I think almost all English language readers on here would have understood perfectly the question I asked you. You did not.

This is partly because your command of English (although excellent) is not 100% perfect, and partly because that was not the question you wanted to hear. A part of you wanted to explain why JK was mistaken in his analysis of Rui Silva's training. Fine. So that is the question you heard, and that is the question you answered.

So when JK read your article maybe he "heard" something that (he believed) suited the paticular point he wanted to make...

Even the best of us can "hear" the wrong thing, or misunderstand the point, when we read or hear something the first time. None of us mean to do it, but it does happen. And it will happen again. There is no need to get upset when it does so. We're hear to talk about the passion we have for running, no?

So chill out, Antonio, and relax. No-one on here is against you.

Not listening

I confess that you are right, but the problem in this case that´s not the english, is that I read the e-mails and posts in the “diagonal” do you know what´s that, is to pass the eyes in a text, whe i´m working iin another project in my PC and a few times I don´t read all the e-mail or post.

To be direct to your early question – Yes. I did e-mail him. The same e-mail several times, but he never send me a reply. But i´m not upset by the fact. That´s quite irrelevant in the process.

Then I did the same to hadd when he post that he knows me and that I lived in the coasts of spain, and he never reply.

And that in that e-mail I also said that I consider him one of the world best coaches and that I admire a lot is marginal/outsider attitude face to the American running status, with a great incidence in the poor school and high school training – really bad – the coach wins 5 times more than me and simply don´t want to work and care for their runners (well there are good professionals, I still mention the main stream) and the competitive system and all calendar that´s a complete absurd, they pit the kids to compete in 2-3-4-5 runs in a weekend and on and on.

Don´t doubt. JK is years of light in advance from the main stream of american coaches. Unhappily that kind of genius they hardly are considered by the time they live.

Recently when Wejo (right?) said that he just runs for a “shirt and a house” which means that he is not a materialist man, i´ve got more respect for him. Also I see some similarities with me in that attitude. But i´m still looking for a good job as a coach (LOL).

Regarding the article, I see that i´m like a turtle, a slow runner, it takes time and effort (and aggressively) to made you understand my opinion but sometimes I finally reach the finish line.

When you say “…As you just said, JK (because he did not know all the details) took the wrong impression from your article on Rui Silva, maybe because that suited what he wanted to hear, or it suited the point he wanted to make in his article…”

Ther´s no need to say more, you got that ! Now, simply imagine (or believe me) that in the same texts/posts that JK did about Rui article - JK do lots of that mistakes.

One more detail to made you understand . The reason I have a poor english, is the same reason that even in Portuguese i´ve not a very fluent (easy) speech. My sentences are very complex and with a complex construction- a few they think that´s aggressively. Then when that to put that idea in english…But as far as I understand JK he was a surprise for me – that´s not a main stream american coach to write about training, that’s a elite expression of their ideas.

“…So chill out, Antonio, and relax. No-one on here is against you….” I will stay here as long as you reply me and i´m happy to be here.

What's the score, are the Patriots back in it?

richard brautigan wrote:

Nope, that sounds like you're just messaging your own ego, regardless of the defensiveness of your explanation.

How do you "message" your own ego? I know I can instant message someone or send a message to another... but message my own ego? I don't understand, someone help me!

Trying to get back to the original topic:

I have a couple of questions for the Letsrun forum. Do you think anyone would have ever even known who Tinman is if not for reading about his advice online? The guy is not original and calls JK a thief for stealing his and others ideas. He is the one taking credit for a lot that is Jack Daniels. If anything Jack Daniels should sue this guy. Anyone can read "Daniels Running Formula" and make up a program for someone. Why are people paying Tinman for this crap?