" If I were to put everything in my running, I think I could run sub 2:20 in the marathon. I think the majority of people on this board if they put everything into their running could run sub 2:20. Its not all that hard. "
It seems that you forget what you post as soon as the dribble comes out of your mouth, so I figured I would remind you. Are you still sticking to your story of never saying that it was easy?
LEARN the language ("your" = "you are"?) before you get on here and butcher it mercilessly and act like your shit doesn't stink. Or is the STUPIDITY a result of your asphyxiation from sucking so hard on Conto's raisinettes? Whatever, Conto's just another prime example of a shit-filled ivy blow-hard asshole. Few, if any, take him very seriously even when he does occasionally have a somewhat useful take. His PR's don't even translate to a 2:22. Go to
http://www.cs.uml.edu/~phoffman/ex1old.html
and plug in 1:56 800m, 4:01 1500m, 8:43 3000m and 15:12 5000m. What comes back is that not only is Conto noticably weaker as the race increases in distance, but that even if he did "drop everything" and threw his entire being into getting after it, he'd still be hard-pressed to even break 2:30. So, not only is his premise that he or any other joker could hit 2:20 if they only tried faulty, but his position of pissing on those who are attempting even the "modest" hurdle of 2:22 is unfounded. Even if Conto were a 2:15 type (as in: actually achieved that instead of making huge leaps to assume that he could), what possible use is there in crapping on those aiming at 2:22? Isn't this supposed to be the site "where your dreams become reality"? Then why be discouraging of even the least of dreams?
Is that the best you could come back with? Is that it? A grammer mistake on a message board wow-wee! Look at what I wrote not how I spelled the words. The fact is 2:22:00 is what it is, good for all that get there I will see you all in Feb 2004! That 15:12 is about what a 2:29:42, so what & who cares, the point is he said he was sorry & this guy goes off on him about what? Nobody got pissed on, let alone got crappped on. I never discouraged anyone & I don't believe conto did either. I love this site, but dreams become real with results. Just remember you are initialed to your dreams but it is said it may not end the way you want.
Flatiron... you really are a fool. Saying that people think 2:20 is harder than it is is not bagging on them. Its stating something that I feel is wrong with today's mentality. If you think 2:20 is so hard, you will never do it. Back when over 200 people did it in the early 80s do you think they were all whining about how hard it was and patting each other on the back at running the trials standard? NO! They were shooting for much greater things... or they realized that they were good local runners and were never going to be pros. Not bagging. I'm not as good as M and M and will never be. Despite how much or little talent I have. He is amzing to have accomplished so much with such a busy life. I give him props, even if he does hate me. I could care less. Someone could call me a dick all they want, but I'll give props when props are due. Considering his life, he ran an amazing time. If I remember correctly, he also made a point of posting his original post to show that running 2:20 can happen even if you have a very busy life... well, that to me is him saying anyone with modest talent can do it. Go bag him.
Keep thinking 2:20 is so fast... and we'll keep producing mediocre distance runners.
M
Sorry, I don't live in that world I'm only highlighting your own idiocy, which I'm sure we'll both agree was unnecessary. If you want a cut-down contest then try highschoolrunning.com or something like that, winner. It wasn't a mistake, you clearly didn't even know what you were writing. That's okay, though, just as not all of us were meant to run 2:20, not all of us were meant to master even a single language. Moving on, Siemers is significantly better than Conto ever was or might be, yet he doesn't come on here crowing about his own ability even half as much as Conto does. Conto has zero basis, as exhibited above, to believe that he could ever break 2:22 if he wanted to, aside from maybe a few drinking pals giving him an ego-stroke. Yet you don't seem to realize that your pal Conto was indeed a dick for senselessly slamming, as Female has also pointed out, Siemers like that: "Get over yourself... you're not a hot commodity buddy." If that isn't pissing, then what is? Conto has not apologized for that, not that any of us expect an ego of that size to ever readily admit fault. Since Siemers is quite a bit better than Conto, and Conto struts around here like he's God's gift to good runners everywhere, where does he get off slamming Siemers like that? That's what seemed to have set off BDG. And yeah, Conto routinely states that hitting 2:20 is indicative of "modest talent" and that it's basically wasted effort, that everyone else would be better off and more successful and fulfilled by taking the route he has. This guy makes Teddy Mitchell look like a meek and modest chap.
Look 2:22:00 & $1.50 will buy a cup of coffee, let conto buy it, he will be the only one with pockets big enough. Why are you still here, take a pill for what ails you, bug off. Read what Tasfaye Jifar wrote in this thread, get a clue.
Nice dodge. Nothing ails me, pill pusher, but Conto was indeed a dick and therefore earned BDG's ire so lay off BDG. Tesfaye Jifar made some good points, but his p.o.v. isn't entirely valid. Of course, he didn't come on this board slamming other people and their abilities or accomplishments, either, unlike Conto. That's what makes Conto a dick.
Why are YOU still here? Conto's pockets are a dime a dozen, but feel free to be awestruck before him on your knees, if you so desire. Maybe he'll toss you a buck much like a benevolent owner tosses a milk bone to a loyal pooch or maybe more like a big-spending john generously tips his regular hooker.
dude get a clue unless your running 2:14.. whatever...you'll never get it. I'll be at the feb trials in 2004, see you there as I have been since 1984. I'll be back gotta grab another cold one.
I never said I was good and I never said anyone who ran 2:20 was bad. I said I think someone of modest talent (15:00ish) if they devote themselves to it... that's the beauty of the marathon... isn't it? Its the working man's event. I don't think I'm saying anything ground breaking here... I'm just the guy everyone loves to hate. I don't mind all that much to be honest... someone has to say it the way it is. Stay in your delusional world. 2:20 is ridonculously good. You're as good as Geb, man. You're so much better than me, as a runner and a person. Rock on with your bad self baby. Happy running... if anyone ever gets the nerve to actually contact me... here's the e-mail again.
Come to NYC and we can grab a beer or something... debate a little more and you can call me a few more names... well... we'll see if you'll still want to after actually meeting me.
Laters,
M
BTW... Hector, Jozast, Joe etc... thanks for the support. hope you guys realize I can only imagine the effort and commitment it takes to run 2;20... its something I think would require so much effort it just isn't worth it FOR ME. I also know, based on things that you have said Joe, that you are not all that impressed with your own accomplishments... you should be... they're the product of hard work and perseverance and anyone who is willing to put in the work deserves to reap the rewards.
Happy running, holidays and thanks again.
Michael
Portland Runner wrote:
I make $6.50 / hr. + commission training fat ladies at the local Bally's Total Fitness. I read "Men's Health", "FLEX", "Self", and "People" religiously.
You poor guy. How is that working for you?
I am self employed, have been for at least the last 17 years, and don't work for anyone except myself, how, when, and in the manner that I wish to do so. I also greatly value and enjoy my privacy.
third choice wrote:
Were you being sarcastic or serious?
Serious. From your posts about Title IX I didn't get the impression you were all that environmentally conscious. But if you are then good for you.
Conto having run 1:56 and 4:20 surely shows the speed to run well below 2:20. Of course it would take a lot of consistent training to accomplish.
I agree with Conto that too many people seem to think it would be impossible. Which is why not so many in the u.s. are running the marathon as fast as they were 20 or 25 years ago.
dunes runner wrote:
third choice wrote:Were you being sarcastic or serious?
Serious. From your posts about Title IX I didn't get the impression you were all that environmentally conscious. But if you are then good for you.
I didn't say that I fit the liberal definition of "environmentally conscious." I meant that I actually do research in a field of science which relates to the environment. Unlike most environmentalists I actually have a solid science and math background and have done real research with high-powered men and women in the field. I'm not sure if all of the facts I've discovered in my work fit your idea of where the environment is, but I do have a lot of facts that relate to the field.
"If I were to put everything in my running, I think I could run sub 2:20 in the marathon. I think the majority of people on this board if they put everything into their running could run sub 2:20. Its not all that hard."
Directed at Siemers, a sub-2:20 runner, personally: "Get over yourself... you're not a hot commodity buddy."
That's what you said, yet you don't seem to be at all able to explain these statements. Then you proceed to pat yourself on the back for being a victim of blind and misguided hatred and in the very same post label me as delusional based upon things I've NEVER claimed. It's not so much that things that you say are harsh but true, it's that you feel the need to add your own condescending and self-righteous barbs, accompanied with a liberal dosing of fabrications and hyperbole, all of which are entirely beside the point. Saying that someone with PR's like yours (you have never been "15:00ish" and sub-2:20 is more like sub-14:45) would be able to rather easily run sub 2:20 is not "telling it like it is" in the least, especially since you've never been there. You've never walked the talk, so how can you possibly know how "it is"? You try to support your points by using yourself as an example. Turns out, there's no realistic reason to believe that you could, if you "wanted" to, ever get into the Olympic Trials. Since it takes only "modest talent" to get a qualifier for the OT, what does that say about what YOUR potential or ability?
Was I supposed to be impressed with the "bravado" of posting a hotmail address? Am I supposed to actually want to go somewhere and meet you based upon this little discussion? Tell you what, since you seem so opposed to having your feet held to the fire in this forum, why don't you just save your own smack for Siemers for when you can actually say it to his face, big brave guy?
2:22 is an impressive time that reflects years of dedication and hard work. It's also a level that most people don't even have the capacity to achieve. Of those that do have the potential, whether they do put forth the effort has to do with a lot of things, such as hours spent at work and with the family, social norms, but especially level of commitment. Let's face it--most males don't have the natural ability to run the OT "A" qualifying standard. Certainly more do than are striving for it, but anyone who is serious about getting there must have at least a "modest" level of talent to begin with. Just because running isn't your sole priority doesn't mean you're a "lesser" runner. I sincerely doubt anyone will ever run 2:05 while working 50 hours a week. M&M did something only a tiny percentage of people who will ever toe it up at a marathon will accomplish. It's an awesome time and I hope he's gotten satisfaction from what he's done. Whoever is saying that "decent LOCAL runners" were running 2:20 is full of crap. If 200 people did it in a country of 200 million, that's 1 in a million people who did it. I'd like to be in that top .0001% any day.
So, it takes talent, lots of work, it's an awesome time though not world class, and anyone who does it should be proud.
third choice wrote:
Unlike most environmentalists I actually have a solid science and math background and have done real research with high-powered men and women in the field. I'm not sure if all of the facts I've discovered in my work fit your idea of where the environment is, but I do have a lot of facts that relate to the field.
Why does that not surprise me.
Since my GE/monsanto question was right on, don't complain.
4:20 1600m yields 2:24:xx and couple that with the fact that his PRs get weaker as the distance increases (i.e. his 5000 PR of 15:12 yields 2:28:xx) and 2:20-2:22 just gets further and further from realistic consideration. Unless he was just pissing around at the time he set those PR's, that's EXACTLY how it is so just accept it.
And the belief that it's impossible certainly isn't the only reason that 2:20 is less common than it used to be, it isn't even the MAIN reason. The Conto Outlook has a lot to do with it, too. His beliefs ('I could do it, it just isn't worth the career sacrifice', 'it takes only modest talent', 'I have the ability', 'you shouldn't consider it a worthy achievement') appear to be nowhere as solid as he'd like us to think they are but his fear of failure seems very strong.
and thus we come to the end of our long tortuous thread, where lies the truth we sought at the start (anyone remember the original question?)...we even have a name for it now "the conto outlook" (not sure who gets patent rights on this, conto or flatiron (ianapl))...i'm halfway joking, but i truly believe the "i could if i wanted to, but it's not worth it" attitude is the real reason we have so many fewer 2:20 marathoners these days.
Flatiron Fool wrote:
And the belief that it's impossible certainly isn't the only reason that 2:20 is less common than it used to be, it isn't even the MAIN reason. The Conto Outlook has a lot to do with it, too. His beliefs ('I could do it, it just isn't worth the career sacrifice', 'it takes only modest talent', 'I have the ability', 'you shouldn't consider it a worthy achievement') appear to be nowhere as solid as he'd like us to think they are but his fear of failure seems very strong.