My quest for sub 1:50 in the 800m

Thanks for the support everyone.

I don't have any real / serious race plans until late march, but I might hop into a race for fun here or there if I have time. At the current time, I have been having some problems with my foot. The arch is a little sore and I'm having some random pains in the top of my foot, but nothing sharp and I can't pinpoint it to one location. No pain to the touch no matter how much pressure I apply to any location on my foot. I'm adding in a lot of foot strengthening and ankle strengthening stuff and take a cut in volume to see if that helps.

I have a good base to start working on quality more but I don't want to do too much to my foot. I don't think it is a stress fracture, but who knows. If it doesn't get any better in a week or so I'll schedule a doctors appointment. It just kind of hurts mentally more than anything because my volume has already been low and this is just making things worse.

Make sure you’re rolling your plantar out with a golf ball before every run and workout. Do other toe exercises that could help strengthen your feet. Do all runs and workouts in trainers. Not flats or spikes. If you can hit the time with trainers it will be a confidence boost and will protect your feet

Just giving a quick update since I haven't posted in a few weeks.

I took about 7 days off in total over a 10 day span, did some cross training, and have been trying to really take care of my foot.

It is mostly better and I am 90% it's not bone related and have resumed running. It has not gotten any worse with the running and seems to be slowly improving.

I ran 40 miles last week with one workout which was:

2k tempo @ 5:28 pace

2x800m: 2:35, 2:29

2x600m: 1:45, 1:46

1x400m: 65

1x300m: 40

Breathing was labored as I got slightly out of shape but I felt really easy and smooth on that 300m. I will go back to regular posting at the end of this week assuming all goes well.

ThatAverageRunner wrote:

Just giving a quick update since I haven't posted in a few weeks.

I took about 7 days off in total over a 10 day span, did some cross training, and have been trying to really take care of my foot.

It is mostly better and I am 90% it's not bone related and have resumed running. It has not gotten any worse with the running and seems to be slowly improving.

I ran 40 miles last week with one workout which was:

2k tempo @ 5:28 pace

2x800m: 2:35, 2:29

2x600m: 1:45, 1:46

1x400m: 65

1x300m: 40

Breathing was labored as I got slightly out of shape but I felt really easy and smooth on that 300m. I will go back to regular posting at the end of this week assuming all goes well.

That's a decent session. Interested to see what you can do for an 800 right now. I guess we'll wait until march.

What have you managed since you started the thread?

I mean for races that is. ^

ngmiler05 wrote:

What have you managed since you started the thread?

I only started the thread the summer of 2017, but since I started it I have run:

5k PR 15:49 (road) in November 2017

3k PR 9:07 (200m flat track) in December 2017

Mile PR 4:20 (300m track) in January 2018

600m Debut 1:23.3 (300m track an hour after the mile).

All on 40-50mpw, long runs, tempos, and some 5k-10k pace workouts, with very occasional sprint sessions and lifting.

Shortly after the mile and 600m I began experiencing foot problems. After a week they worried me enough that I took about a week off and monitored the situation. I am less concerned overall about it but it still has been bugging me a bit. If I can't curtail the thing in a week or so I am going to go to a podiatrist. It seems pretty much fine after easy running for any distance, but speed workout on the track seems to kill it. I am trying to be more religious and aggressive with strengthening, rolling / massage and stuff like that. If there's no change, I'll have to head to the doctors.

I am kind of bummed because the spring I ran 1:52, I could only manage ~4:32 on 3 separate occasions indoor. On my first try out this year I run 4:20 and felt great doing it, then ran 1:23 off of basically no work under 5k pace, so I believe I was in a great place to run some fast times outdoor. Not all of my fitness is lost, but some of it is, and if my foot can't let me get in fast training then I may have to scrap the outdoor campaign. I will be playing it by ear and do whatever is best for me, though. I can't be all mad, I managed 4 solid PRs this past training cycle and if I do have to take a break, I will most certainly be back with a vengeance. I will continue to keep you guys updated. Thank you for following along.

Significant times / PRs for this training cycle:

5k PR 15:49 (road) in November 2017

3k PR 9:07 (200m flat track) in December 2017

Mile PR 4:20 (300m track) in January 2018

600m Debut 1:23.3 (300m track an hour after the mile).

Week ending in 2/25

Sunday Off.

** Haven't given the foot a break in 8 days, so I decided to today.

Monday 5x(1k, 200m). 1 min rest between reps, 2 min between sets.

3:22, 3:18, 3:17, 3:15, 3:15

30, 29, 28, 30, 28.

Lifted a few hours later.

** Not a bad workout. Goal was just to be smooth ~CV pace on the 1k reps and that was pretty easy to do. The 200m reps between were okay. Tried to just make sure they were sub 30 or so. The weather started off gloomy but manageable (light rain, 45 degrees), but after the 3rd 1k it started to down pour. The wind picked up, it was hard to see, and that made the reps, especially the 200s much more difficult.

Tuesday 9.9 miles @ 7:22 pace. Beautiful weather.

Wednesday Off. Had to work an extra shift and literally only had time to sleep between the shifts, so no running today, which is kind of why I went a little longer on Tuesday.

Thursday 5.1 miles on the treadmill @ 7:26 pace

** Crappy slushy rainy weather outside. Did a lot of core and foot / ankle stuff after.

Friday 8 miles progression run @ 6:05 pace + 2x150m in 20, 19.

** Splits: 7:12, 6:38, 6:25, 6:04, 5:43, 5:36, 5:38, 5:24. First few miles were a little uphill and that made the whole rest of the run tough. I am very happy with this run though considering my lack of miles and the difficulties I've had the past few weeks.

Saturday 5.1 miles @ 7:28 pace.

** Legs a little beat up feeling, nice recovery run.

Week total: 34 miles

Not many miles this week, but I was only able to run 5 times and I was able to get in 2 decent workouts which I am happy about. I'm starting to feel more like normal, fitness wise, after that short layoff. My foot was pretty darn sore after the track workout Monday but since then I've been doing a lot to take care of it and it has been feeling a lot better, so hopefully the worst of it all is way behind me. Like I said, I am happy with that progression run, and I should be getting in some sprint work and a true 800m pace workout this up coming week, so hopefully I can get ready to run some half decent 800m races.

That is a pretty good week considering the foot and the work schedule. When do you anticipate adding in some faster work? I don't mean long fast stuff, but rather 100-200@ 400 ish pace with fair amounts of rest.

I always feel like that type of work is a good intro to specific 800 training.

Or is it that type of stuff that bothers your foot?

CoachB wrote:

That is a pretty good week considering the foot and the work schedule. When do you anticipate adding in some faster work? I don't mean long fast stuff, but rather 100-200@ 400 ish pace with fair amounts of rest.

I always feel like that type of work is a good intro to specific 800 training.

Or is it that type of stuff that bothers your foot?

I agree completely. That is kind of why I would follow up tempos / CV workouts with ~4x150 or so, and try to be around 400m pace. Nothing crazy hard, but a good introduction to running smooth yet uncomfortably.

I kind of got away from that because of weather then again because of my foot. I original plan was to actually do a solid 400m ish pace workout on monday instead of the 1k/200m workout, but because of the weather I decided to opt for a longer / slower workout. I will start to add in more 400m pace and faster work this week and the coming weeks, especially since the weather has been getting a lot better lately.

Not sure if it is the turns specifically that bothers my foot, or just running fast in general, but hopefully that won't matter regardless because my foot has been gradually improving.

Significant times / PRs for this training cycle:

5k PR 15:49 (road) in November 2017

3k PR 9:07 (200m flat track) in December 2017

Mile PR 4:20 (300m track) in January 2018

600m Debut 1:23.3 (300m track an hour after the mile).

Week ending in 3/3

Sunday 11.5 miles @ 7:18 pace. Last half a mile at 6:00 pace just to open up the stride a little

**Felt pretty tired and stale on this one. Felt pretty good actually to open up my legs at the end.

Monday 4 miles @ 7:10 pace + 7x60m hill sprints.

** Felt average. No complaints one way or the other.

Tuesday Off.

**Was just tired. Lack of sleep the previous weekend. Took the rest day.

Wednesday AM 3 miles @ 7:22 pace on the treadmill. Lift after.

PM 2mi warmup, 2x(3x200m), 400m, 200m jog into one last 200m.

(29, 27, 29) (28, 28, 28) 56, 33.

90 seconds between reps, 4 minutes between sets.

** Goal on the 200m reps was to run at opening 800m pace and get a feel for the start of the race. Was slightly uncomfortable, but I was pretty relaxed overall on those. The 400m was meant to be at the same pace, then as soon as the 400m was done you go right into a 200m jog then into one final 200m.

Thursday 6 miles in total.

**Ran in the middle school that my dad coaches at and ran with some kids who I help coach. Started with 20 minutes on the treadmill, then drills and dynamic stretches, then 4x60m sprints. After that we did 20 minutes of continuous running with 5 minutes around the halls, then 5 minutes in the stair well doing various stepping patterns (every step, every other step, hop every step, single leg hop every step, etc).

Finished off with a lot of core work after.

Friday 5.5 miles @ 7:27 pace on the treadmill.

Saturday 4 mile tempo @ 5:45 pace.

**Went through 5k in about 17:40 and suffered on the last mile into the wind. Did 4x~20 seconds on the road at around 400m effort after.

Week total: 42.1 miles

Overall I'm pretty happy with this week. I covered a lot of bases and my foot has been feeling better, but I still need to keep up with the foot strengthening work, because it was a little sore on Friday.

Wednesday's workout was the first real workout around 800m pace, and while it wasn't a killer and had relatively long rests, I'm happy with it. The 400m was a little tougher than I would have preferred it to be, but I can't be upset with a 56 after some 200m reps prior.

Thursday I just decided to make the most of the crappy rainy weather and get in some various work in the middle school. I feel like those stair reps are a good kind of plyometric cross training while also hammering my cardio, and when you only have a 150m hall-way to run in, you have to be creative.

Saturday's workout was not fun nor impressive, but I am glad to get it done. My endurance has surely taken a hit due to the down time in January, and I am also feeling a little tired from the consistent work I've been putting in the last couple weeks after that down time, but I have a few weeks before my first race so I have time to get some more work in.

As a side note, I plan on running 4 outdoor meets this season. The dates (should nothing else change) are:

3/24

4/14

4/21

5/11 (peak race)

In terms of competition, the most low-key meet will be 4/21 and the best competition should be 5/11.

I am trying to figure out what events I should run at which meets. Last year I ran 51.8, 2:01, 1:58 low, 1:58 low in my 4 tries, but I kind of just faded out towards the end instead of aiming for a quality peak.

Would running the 800m, 800m, 400m, 800m, make the most sense or should I run the 800m as my penultimate race for practice? I would like to run the 400m once, but I also want to get used to some 800m races in the process. I could easily run the 200m after any of the above races, but it would be impossible to run both the 400m and 800m in the same meet.

Any ideas?

Thanks for reading this far.

Bump

This thread has generated some good discussion but I don’t believe the original poster. Nobody can go from running 55 seconds and 2:05 after 6 years of training to running 1:50. I ran 1:52 at 22 years old after running 1:57 at 18. This guy was running times that wouldn’t even have gotten him onto most D3 teams. How did you get so many opportunities when you were running so slow?

Bad coaching at the high school level? Not serious at the high school level.

There are many late bloomers out there.

I checked a bunch of guys in milesplit and couldn’t find any over 1:59 from HS who are hitting 1:52. I challenge the community to find someone even close. I really enjoy some of the hypothetical discussions here but not the fictitious ones.

No Way Jose wrote:

This thread has generated some good discussion but I don’t believe the original poster. Nobody can go from running 55 seconds and 2:05 after 6 years of training to running 1:50. I ran 1:52 at 22 years old after running 1:57 at 18. This guy was running times that wouldn’t even have gotten him onto most D3 teams. How did you get so many opportunities when you were running so slow?

I’ll post an update on a few days. Kind of busy this weekend. But here’s all the proof you need even though I’m not sure what you don’t believe.

Hello everyone,

I bring you this post with some unfortunate news. As many of you know I've been battling some diffuse foot pain pretty much since I PR'd in the mile this past January. Although it has been up and down, recently it feels as though it's been getting worse, and although there is not a lot of pain while running, it is becoming annoying to deal with while running. The meet I was going to run was cancelled because of snow, and since I didn't have another meet for a couple weeks anyways, I have decided to just take a little break from running and get this injury sorted out. I have scheduled a podiatrist appointment for next week, and I am fully invested in the idea of taking off 2-4 weeks from running if need be. I haven't taken off more than a week from running in many years, and I am tired of running through injuries like I have for the past couple years since graduating.

Additionally, I was just not happy with the way my training was going regardless of my injury. And because of that, I was unlikely to race super well despite my actual fitness.

So although I will be taking some time off from running and am pretty bummed out about it, I need to try to look at the positives. I did manage PRs in the 5k, 3k, and the mile as well as a solid 600m debut on the same day, and hopefully I will be able to figure out what went wrong and do better next time in regards to injuries.

Once I am able to run again pain free, I will be starting a long but low intensity buildup this summer. It has been years since I've had a good summer and run 60-70mpw with consistency, and I want to get back to that since I am pretty aerobically under-developed overall.

My plan is to continue lifting (unless the podiatrist says otherwise) and to start up some cross training here pretty soon so hopefully keep somewhat fit and keep extra weight off. I will post back here with updates but they might be few and far between depending on how things go.

Thank you to everyone who has been following along even though this has been a lackluster thread as of late, and I will be glad to answer questions anyone has, even if you're a troll like the one poster above.

Can you get into a pool to pool-run?

Dude you’re packing up for the whole season already? Dude cross train a few weeks and get your a** on the track and race. You won’t lose fitness you just won’t be sharp. But dude you gotta grow a pair and not waste the fitness. Cross train 2-3 weeks and Stay off that foot(no weight bearing) and it will heal up.