I will add one more interesting piece from Jamie's book.
She writes that as a cisgender person, she will never fully understand what her daughter is going through or why she is going through it. But she knows it is real and she can support her daughter even if she does not totally understand everything about her lived experience.
But omniscient people on this board rejects anything they don't fully understand. Of course, they know everything, and everything better than anyone else. So they must also understand the lived experience of other people better than those people themselves. If they don't understand, they it must be bogus by definition.
We are blessed with having such people with superior intelligence on this board. /s
What do you think is the physical body of a boy? What do you think is the physical body of a girl?
, the internal and external anatomy of female and male bodies.
Internal AND external. Well there lies the contradiction to your argument. Internally, people have both chromosomes and hormones. Hormones can be easily replaced. Chromosomes, not so easily. And externally, there are many gender affirming surgeries available. This leaves SOOOO much room for ambiguity its almost funny. Unless you are simply saying that once someone is on HRT and has undergone gender affirming surgeries that they are their gender, this claim does not help your case.
Unless they are saying that their physical body morphs into that of a different gender then all they are saying is they are connecting emotions to gender. They are saying it’s I’m impossible to feel a certain feeling without being a certain gender. Which like I said gen x knew that if one day a boy Felt like wearing pink it didn’t change his biology. He was still a boy and didn’t need to feel shame. Now these kids are being told you should feel shame for being a boy and liking pink, the only right thing is to admit you are really a girl
No, they are NOT.
The author of that book, Jamie, told her kid "the color is for everyone, and clothes are not everyone." She allowed her kid to wear any color, and do any activity she wanted.
And she is advocating the same thing to other parents. Allow them to do any activity they want regardless of their gender, wear whatever color they want, and choose friends regardless of gender. Expand the boundary for kids' life regardless of gender. Many kids will find they don't have to change their gender to be comfortable with themselves. That's what "raising kid beyond binary" means.
Her kid dropped out of a Montessori school in the first grade because she could not handle being treated as a boy at school. She attempted suicide multiple times before she was finally allowed to live as a girl. She is now a National Merit Commended Scholar and a star performer of her HS musical theatre and all Girls Choir. Being a "gender nonconforming" kid was not good enough for her. She wanted to connect with other girls as a girl.
So before passing judgement based on your superior wisdom, why don't you just LISTEN (or read) what other people have to say. They are not as stupid as you believe them to be.
Well she didn’t go to a real Montessori school then, because gender has nothing to do with their teaching at all
, the internal and external anatomy of female and male bodies.
Internal AND external. Well there lies the contradiction to your argument. Internally, people have both chromosomes and hormones. Hormones can be easily replaced. Chromosomes, not so easily. And externally, there are many gender affirming surgeries available. This leaves SOOOO much room for ambiguity its almost funny. Unless you are simply saying that once someone is on HRT and has undergone gender affirming surgeries that they are their gender, this claim does not help your case.
So you are saying they can identify after the have been altered by drugs and surgery? Yea if I believed that was natural I would be an anonymous pi as well
I will add one more interesting piece from Jamie's book.
She writes that as a cisgender person, she will never fully understand what her daughter is going through or why she is going through it. But she knows it is real and she can support her daughter even if she does not totally understand everything about her lived experience.
But omniscient people on this board rejects anything they don't fully understand. Of course, they know everything, and everything better than anyone else. So they must also understand the lived experience of other people better than those people themselves. If they don't understand, they it must be bogus by definition.
We are blessed with having such people with superior intelligence on this board. /s
When my daughter was 3 she would run around the house chasing her sister saying she was a shopping cart. When I heard this I thought I must have heard that wrong and so I would ask her what she is and what she wanted to be when she grew up. It was always, “A shopping cart”. Then, she grew out of that phase and became Elsa from the movie Frozen for about 6 months followed by a fire truck. Of course she’s none of these things regardless of her “lived experience”. She’s a female human that will one day become a wife and mom.
Well she didn’t go to a real Montessori school then, because gender has nothing to do with their teaching at all
Sadly, in todays day and age gender to do with everything, including their teachings. If they have bathrooms, are they ALL gender neutral? What about staff bathrooms? If they have sex-ed classes, are all the kids grouped together? Are the friend groups that students make completely equal in regards to gender, or are there groups with more boys and groups with more girls? Are seating charts randomized, or do the teachers choose where to sit everyone? Do they have sports teams that are gender-expansive and not boy team and girl team? If they have locker rooms, are they separated by gender? If you said no to all of these, you are lying.
The author of that book, Jamie, told her kid "the color is for everyone, and clothes are not everyone." She allowed her kid to wear any color, and do any activity she wanted.
And she is advocating the same thing to other parents. Allow them to do any activity they want regardless of their gender, wear whatever color they want, and choose friends regardless of gender. Expand the boundary for kids' life regardless of gender. Many kids will find they don't have to change their gender to be comfortable with themselves. That's what "raising kid beyond binary" means.
Her kid dropped out of a Montessori school in the first grade because she could not handle being treated as a boy at school. She attempted suicide multiple times before she was finally allowed to live as a girl. She is now a National Merit Commended Scholar and a star performer of her HS musical theatre and all Girls Choir. Being a "gender nonconforming" kid was not good enough for her. She wanted to connect with other girls as a girl.
So before passing judgement based on your superior wisdom, why don't you just LISTEN (or read) what other people have to say. They are not as stupid as you believe them to be.
Well she didn’t go to a real Montessori school then, because gender has nothing to do with their teaching at all
So you had your kids in Montessori schools?
Even if there is nothing in the "teaching" human beings treat boys and girls differently, including subconsciously. We are all products of our socialization, and that includes things outside of whatever "teaching" we are supposed to adhere to.
Internal AND external. Well there lies the contradiction to your argument. Internally, people have both chromosomes and hormones. Hormones can be easily replaced. Chromosomes, not so easily. And externally, there are many gender affirming surgeries available. This leaves SOOOO much room for ambiguity its almost funny. Unless you are simply saying that once someone is on HRT and has undergone gender affirming surgeries that they are their gender, this claim does not help your case.
So you are saying they can identify after the have been altered by drugs and surgery? Yea if I believed that was natural I would be an anonymous pi as well
This is not what I am saying, it is what YOU are saying. A bodys sex is determined by internal and external factors that match the sex's stereotype. This is what you claimed. Which means you believe that once they start HRT and have surgeries they can identify as whatever they want. And stop calling HRT drugs. They are drugs in the sense that cough syrup or ibuprofen or prescribed medicine is a drug. But these treatments are not bad 'drugs'.
I will add one more interesting piece from Jamie's book.
She writes that as a cisgender person, she will never fully understand what her daughter is going through or why she is going through it. But she knows it is real and she can support her daughter even if she does not totally understand everything about her lived experience.
But omniscient people on this board rejects anything they don't fully understand. Of course, they know everything, and everything better than anyone else. So they must also understand the lived experience of other people better than those people themselves. If they don't understand, they it must be bogus by definition.
We are blessed with having such people with superior intelligence on this board. /s
When my daughter was 3 she would run around the house chasing her sister saying she was a shopping cart. When I heard this I thought I must have heard that wrong and so I would ask her what she is and what she wanted to be when she grew up. It was always, “A shopping cart”. Then, she grew out of that phase and became Elsa from the movie Frozen for about 6 months followed by a fire truck. Of course she’s none of these things regardless of her “lived experience”. She’s a female human that will one day become a wife and mom.
So your daughter "grew out of that phase." How long did that take? Did she repeat the same thing every day and night for several years non-stop?
She may or may not become a wife and mom. That's up to her. Many women don't get married or have children. But you have already mapped her life for her and she has no choice, right? what a loving parent you are!
, the internal and external anatomy of female and male bodies.
Internal AND external. Well there lies the contradiction to your argument. Internally, people have both chromosomes and hormones. Hormones can be easily replaced. Chromosomes, not so easily. And externally, there are many gender affirming surgeries available. This leaves SOOOO much room for ambiguity its almost funny. Unless you are simply saying that once someone is on HRT and has undergone gender affirming surgeries that they are their gender, this claim does not help your case.
And this is the flaw in your argument, and exposes you as someone who doesn’t have a defense but always has a trick question with a prepared response. You can change or manipulate anything easily. You can cut off a leg and make someone disabled. It doesn’t make anything ambiguous. The human body is fragile and can be manipulated but that doesn’t change what it is/was or isn’t. Even if someone takes the drugs and surgically alters their bodies it doesnt change that they were something else before, and all they have done is an expensive mod.
And this is the flaw in your argument, and exposes you as someone who doesn’t have a defense but always has a trick question with a prepared response. You can change or manipulate anything easily. You can cut off a leg and make someone disabled. It doesn’t make anything ambiguous. The human body is fragile and can be manipulated but that doesn’t change what it is/was or isn’t. Even if someone takes the drugs and surgically alters their bodies it doesnt change that they were something else before, and all they have done is an expensive mod.
I was simply asking for clarification about what you said because it sounded like you were saying someones gender is defined by their current physical characteristics.
When my daughter was 3 she would run around the house chasing her sister saying she was a shopping cart. When I heard this I thought I must have heard that wrong and so I would ask her what she is and what she wanted to be when she grew up. It was always, “A shopping cart”. Then, she grew out of that phase and became Elsa from the movie Frozen for about 6 months followed by a fire truck. Of course she’s none of these things regardless of her “lived experience”. She’s a female human that will one day become a wife and mom.
So your daughter "grew out of that phase." How long did that take? Did she repeat the same thing every day and night for several years non-stop?
She may or may not become a wife and mom. That's up to her. Many women don't get married or have children. But you have already mapped her life for her and she has no choice, right? what a loving parent you are!
I guarantee you she will become a wife and mom. Who she will become is for me to tell her. I am the parent. She is the child. My duty is to teach and guide her to become what she is meant to be while protecting her from criminals, deviants, and the mentally ill that would do her harm. I am loving parent and my children will become very successful, happy, well adjusted adults. Without deluding yourself, you cannot say same.
Your reading of the 14th Amendment is just as off-base as the nonsense claim that a male who gets a surgically-created cavity has a"vagina."
The 14th Amendment allows for people in the USA to be treated differently under the law in circumstances where we are measurably different or "situated differently" in a way, or in multiple ways, that have a genuine bearing on the matter at hand.
For example, under the 14th Amendment, schools in the USA are permitted to treat students differently depending on their age, abilities and knowledge base.
12-year-olds, teenagers and adults can’t enroll in kindergarten even if they have disabilities that mean they have the “mental capacity of a 5 year-old.”
High school students in the US can’t take AP courses or other advanced classes if they don’t meet the prerequisites.
When child prodigies who are intellectually advanced well beyond their years are allowed to skip ahead several grades or more in their academic coursework, they still aren’t allowed to take driver’s ed classes until they reach the chronological age for getting a learner’s permit.
Schools are allowed to have rules which restrict enrollment to kids who’ve been toilet trained, have had a health checkup, and whose parents/guardians have submitted the standard paperwork showing their child has been immunized against certain childhood illnesses.
Public schools in the US are allowed to restrict enrollment to students who legally reside in the district and/or within each particular school's catchment area.
It’s totally permissible under the 14th Amendment to treat males and females differently when it comes to determining eligibility for women’s and girls’ school sports and sports outside a school context.
Males who say they have a trans, femme, non-binary or other special gender identity aren’t being excluded from the female category because of their gender identity, gender expression, the gender labels they've adopted or the pronouns they want other people to refer to them by. They’re being excluded because of their sex.
Ok, a bit a further research and I found you are correct, though by a technicality. I was mistakenly considering Title IX as a part of the 14 amendment, when it is just a well known interpretation of it. So for this mistake, I apologize. However, this government site specifically states that "Title IX, which is of particular interest to young people, prohibits institutions that receive federal funding from excluding students from participating in educational and athletic programs on the basis of sex." And what you very clearly said violates this, "They're being excluded because of their sex."
Kudos to you for admitting you were wrong about the 14th Amendment. That's to your credit.
But since you're so unfamiliar with the meaning of the 14th Amendment and Title IX that you're having to look up basic information about them for the first time just now, then you're really not in a position to be issuing the grand pronouncements you've made on this and another thread asserting that female-only sports and spaces are clearly an unconscionable and indefensible violation of the constitutionally-guaranteed civil rights of males who say they have a trans gender identity (and other males who feel they should be allowed into female sports and spaces too).
I guarantee you she will become a wife and mom. Who she will become is for me to tell her. I am the parent. She is the child. My duty is to teach and guide her to become what she is meant to be while protecting her from criminals, deviants, and the mentally ill that would do her harm. I am loving parent and my children will become very successful, happy, well adjusted adults. Without deluding yourself, you cannot say same.
WTF!? When she is an adult, you cannot force her to do anything or be anything. What little control you have over her now will instantly disappear the second she turns 18. You cannot force her to become a wife. And unless you r*** her you cannot force her to become a mom.
This is not what I am saying, it is what YOU are saying. A bodys sex is determined by internal and external factors that match the sex's stereotype. This is what you claimed. Which means you believe that once they start HRT and have surgeries they can identify as whatever they want. And stop calling HRT drugs. They are drugs in the sense that cough syrup or ibuprofen or prescribed medicine is a drug. But these treatments are not bad 'drugs'.
Kudos to you for admitting you were wrong about the 14th Amendment. That's to your credit.
But since you're so unfamiliar with the meaning of the 14th Amendment and Title IX that you're having to look up basic information about them for the first time just now, then you're really not in a position to be issuing the grand pronouncements you've made on this and another thread asserting that female-only sports and spaces are clearly an unconscionable and indefensible violation of the constitutionally-guaranteed civil rights of males who say they have a trans gender identity (and other males who feel they should be allowed into female sports and spaces too).
I am actually quite well versed in Title IX. As I mentioned, my mistake was due to a small technicality. This is not the first time I have done research about the topic, I had merely overlooked that Title IX was not directly a part of the Constitution despite stemming directly from the 14th amendment. Title IX is still federal law.
I guarantee you she will become a wife and mom. Who she will become is for me to tell her. I am the parent. She is the child. My duty is to teach and guide her to become what she is meant to be while protecting her from criminals, deviants, and the mentally ill that would do her harm. I am loving parent and my children will become very successful, happy, well adjusted adults. Without deluding yourself, you cannot say same.
WTF!? When she is an adult, you cannot force her to do anything or be anything. What little control you have over her now will instantly disappear the second she turns 18. You cannot force her to become a wife. And unless you r*** her you cannot force her to become a mom.
You let schools, the internet, and society “raise” your kids. I don’t. You have no control. I do. You are a bystander, not a parent.