Ethan Hermann is robbed of an OTQ - Merber reports

WOW!

The Philly Marathon and its organizers (esp the elite organizer Colin) were dragged through the mud over this, and deserved none of it. At the very least they are owed an apology by those involved in this debacle, namely coach Chris Naimoli (Naimoli, not "Namoli" as is written).

It would also make sense for Merber to offer an update to this situation in his newsletter since the initial story had such wide reach and generated such a large response. It would suck for the reputation of the otherwise well-organized and great Philly races to be damaged by what we now know was a justified decision.

Well it’s really not that organized if they didn’t have enough medals. It’s a great race but Philadelphia doesn’t get high level marathoners to come. But the problem with that race for elites they only have two tables for fluids. Unless they changed it.

Is PRTC too big for its britches? 10+ years ago PRTC felt like a well-run, focused group of men and women who were chasing the post collegiate dream. Now it just seems...too large but still somehow exclusive.

I thought the division of the Liberty Track Club was confusing, now it makes a bit more sense.

Philly deserves a better run club scene in 2024.

Like I said:

Prior to the race, Mr. Hermann requested that Elite Fluid Station #4 Volunteer Joseph
Cutler, a member of the same running club as Mr. Hermann (Philadelphia Runner Track
Club), hand Mr. Hermann his personal fluids. However, Mr. Cutler stated that he did not
comply, leaving the bottle at its designated location on the table.

Volunteer working at Elite Fluid Station #6, Claire Lapat, reportedly told Mr. Hallman that
Elite Fluid Volunteers were instructed to leave the personal fluids on the table. Mr.
Hallman responded by falsely claiming that he was given permission by Elite
Coordinator Colin Leak to hand Mr. Hermann his personal fluids. Mr. Hallman, as
witnessed by Ms. Lapat, removed Mr. Hermann’s personal fluids from the elite fluids
table and handed Mr. Hermann his personal fluids at the Elite Fluid Station.

One thing that should be said is that the same half truth was spread within the club. Most members believed the version that was published and widely circulated just like this message board did. The request to take down posts wasn't communicated as a way to hide evidence. In hindsight it clearly was.

It was reactionary, but the response after the fact all came from people being told it was just one bottle. How could anyone have known better?

I don't know what kind of shape he's in (if he could actually run) but can the letsrun top brass provide a USATF email on the home page so we can flood their inbox with Let Ethan Run emails?

This is a travesty. Freaking Tom Brady deflates footballs, gets caught, and he played in the Super Bowl.

Ethan and his crew of flunkies come off as really bad sports in this ordeal. Following the rules is not that difficult. Take your L and move on like an adult.

Here are my take-aways from this:

- Ethan Hermann sounds like a good hard-working kid put in a bad position by an over-reaching coach.

- Chris Naimoli sounds like an a**-hole who doesn't know the rules or doesn't care about them, is willing to lie (to race volunteer, to us, to club members, and to race officials) and tell half-truths and all for what is no real advantage. If Ethan can't grab his own bottle he has major issues, he doesn't need someone to hand them to him. But Chris wanted to do it to insert himself into the race/situation (ego trip) and did so to the detriment and eventual DQ of his athlete.

- Either James McKirdy is lying about the Philly Race Official(s) coming to him with the evidence and asking for his opinion or if it is true then the Race Official(s) has some major ethics issues. The opinion of an outside coach is not needed or helpful in a rules violation instance. Its only was the rule broken or not, opinion is useless. To involve an outside party and give them information/evidence is unethical or at least against the spirit and probably rules of the race. I have a hard time seeing how/why they would do that. The most likely scenario is that McKirdy reported the rules violation and that is why he was discussing it with them and when confronted by Chris he lied about reporting it and made up his story about them coming to him for an opinion. Sounds very McKirdy'ish.

Random question, but how often are these fluid rules enforced for lesser runners? Let's say I'm a 2:40 kind of guy, and a medium-sized, well-respected race has dumb fluid stations set up. If a friend hands me a few bottles throughout the course, is there any chance I get DQd?

If you didn't rent your pitchfork by the hour and actually asked for the other side of the story from the race organizer, you would have known better. Instead, you took the word only of one side as gospel.

Good question. Unless it's spelled out in the specific rules of that race, I don't think that is the case if it doesn't help you qualify for a national championship and you're just trying to run a PR. Spouses hand water to runners all the time along the course, so it would be pretty hard to enforce.

Am I wrong to have the opinion that Hermann organized the effort and had teammates stationed as volunteers at separate aid stations. From the one time I ran Philly (several years ago), it seemed like groups (high school teams, running groups, etc.) volunteered to man particular aid stations. Has this changed?

I can also see how the guys running near Hermann would get pissed off seeing the assistance he received at every aid station.

Fair. There's a big difference between a coordinated effort and being mislead though.

The running publications that hooked onto a one-sided story need to seriously reevaluate their approach to running press. Unbelievable. Citius being the major catalyst for the pile on.

PRTC needs to do some housekeeping. Dragging your hometown race through the mud on this one is horrible. I understand a lot of the club was lied to as well, but that report indicates enough were very much in on the conspiracy for it to be baffling that not one person from the club stepped up sooner.

Everything here is the exact mindset that introduces folks to doping in the sport. They probably felt the resulting advantage was minimal, it was mostly a plan to afford some convenience. Once they slid a tiny bit of justification into the process they probably kept circling back to "well, he still woulda run 2:17" in their minds as they continued to double-down on the lie. Once the lie was in place there needed to be some collateral damage, and they were okay with that because again, "he still woulda run 2:17."

Good for the people at the Philly Marathon for setting the record straight.

Is there another thread I should be following here? Love a good cheater thread.

Here's a good one:

The science said otherwise. The cold temps deflated the balls. Trying reading sometime.